Cyprus-Forum.com

[Viewpoint]

Every Kibrisli that I meet says he is CYPRIOT and feels contempt for those others who are TURKS.
And we have VP here trying to sell propaganda. I won't buy.

Did you ask them if they want to be a minority among GCs? Lets say for arguments sake you are right what will it chnage? will it make you happy? or will it unite us?

The problem with you VP is that you are "a partitionist at heart". Kikapu said those are your own words...

You wish that someday you will have your own recognized state, that you will be equal to all other nations in the world, have ambassadors, join the UN, have a thriving economy etc etc just like the free areas of the RoC. And that you will get rid of Turkey messing in your affairs other than providing you a free of charge army and protection.
You forget of course that 90% of the land and properties in the north are stolen GC land and properties hence from this factor alone your dream could never come true. Let aside other factors like Turkey who controls everything in the occupied North, and considers the place as their loot of war, that will never donate to you to become an independent state. And who are you according to them? Some "british bastards" that’s what the Turks say for you….

Your starting point in what you REALLY WANT is very important in explaining your stance.
For you any other solution other than your dream of partition must be way too good to be accepted.Something like the Anan Plan… That’s why you always ask for a million guarantees and assurances every time a compromise proposal is on the air.

Now compare yourself with any other Cypriot whose starting point is unification or one Cyprus for all CYPRIOTS. Take a Kibrisli for this example. Does this guy expect to have a million guarantees and assurances for every aspect of a solution like you do? Does he expect the solution to be way too good for him (hence way too bad for the Kypreoi)? Does he expect his own numbers who are not even 10% of todays total, to dictate the remaining 90% of what to do or not do, hiding behind the term political equality, like you do? Does he expect to be an equal partner in an economy in which he will not even be contributing 5% and dictate terms and conditions to those who run 95% of the economy like you do?
Does he expect that with some magic formula the Kypreoi will be forced to give him their properties in the north for free or for some peanuts, or does he believe in lies that the Kibrisli land left in the free areas is enough to make an equal exchange like every partitionit thinks? Or does he KNOW that at best the Kibrisli will end up owning only about 1/3-1/2 of the land ownership in their administered area?
Does he expect that even with a BBF solution with political equality the Kibrisli Federal part will be in total control and practice discrimination vs the Kypreoi (like you and every other partitionist thinks), or does he deep inside know that this BBF thing is a starting point where the Kypreoi will sooner or later develop/create businesses and be in control of at least 50% of the economy there, because of their land and property ownership?

In summary those of you partitionists really misunderstood what you will ever get in a solution. And of course Eroglu is one of you and we ‘ve seen how far he managed to go.

without prejudice, i'll stand in defence of vp on this point. if i understand him correctly, he believes in a Republic that is strictly non discriminatory, that gives no distiction to its Citizens except as Individuals (and his plaint is that the GC (so-called) will never let this happen). our confrere seeks to represent a Turkish constituency, i (too) ask where is a Greek, Maronite, Armenian, and Latin, equals as Cypriot Constituencies?

...Cyprus, is it a Greek State, and why not a Cypriot State; where is a Greek Constituency, speaking Bicommunally?

Kikapu, i am Greek, as a Person, but as a Cypriot i prefer to represent myself as a Human Being; is it the same for you?

...would you agree vp, you are Turkish, but as a Cypriot you would prefer to represent yourself as a Human Being?

repulse I am a Turkish Cypriots who wants a BBF with political equality of the 2 constituent states as supported by the UN and EU.

[wyoming cowboy]

Every Kibrisli that I meet says he is CYPRIOT and feels contempt for those others who are TURKS.
And we have VP here trying to sell propaganda. I won't buy.

Did you ask them if they want to be a minority among GCs? Lets say for arguments sake you are right what will it chnage? will it make you happy? or will it unite us?

The problem with you VP is that you are "a partitionist at heart". Kikapu said those are your own words...

You wish that someday you will have your own recognized state, that you will be equal to all other nations in the world, have ambassadors, join the UN, have a thriving economy etc etc just like the free areas of the RoC. And that you will get rid of Turkey messing in your affairs other than providing you a free of charge army and protection.
You forget of course that 90% of the land and properties in the north are stolen GC land and properties hence from this factor alone your dream could never come true. Let aside other factors like Turkey who controls everything in the occupied North, and considers the place as their loot of war, that will never donate to you to become an independent state. And who are you according to them? Some "british bastards" that’s what the Turks say for you….

Your starting point in what you REALLY WANT is very important in explaining your stance.
For you any other solution other than your dream of partition must be way too good to be accepted.Something like the Anan Plan… That’s why you always ask for a million guarantees and assurances every time a compromise proposal is on the air.

Now compare yourself with any other Cypriot whose starting point is unification or one Cyprus for all CYPRIOTS. Take a Kibrisli for this example. Does this guy expect to have a million guarantees and assurances for every aspect of a solution like you do? Does he expect the solution to be way too good for him (hence way too bad for the Kypreoi)? Does he expect his own numbers who are not even 10% of todays total, to dictate the remaining 90% of what to do or not do, hiding behind the term political equality, like you do? Does he expect to be an equal partner in an economy in which he will not even be contributing 5% and dictate terms and conditions to those who run 95% of the economy like you do?
Does he expect that with some magic formula the Kypreoi will be forced to give him their properties in the north for free or for some peanuts, or does he believe in lies that the Kibrisli land left in the free areas is enough to make an equal exchange like every partitionit thinks? Or does he KNOW that at best the Kibrisli will end up owning only about 1/3-1/2 of the land ownership in their administered area?
Does he expect that even with a BBF solution with political equality the Kibrisli Federal part will be in total control and practice discrimination vs the Kypreoi (like you and every other partitionist thinks), or does he deep inside know that this BBF thing is a starting point where the Kypreoi will sooner or later develop/create businesses and be in control of at least 50% of the economy there, because of their land and property ownership?

In summary those of you partitionists really misunderstood what you will ever get in a solution. And of course Eroglu is one of you and we ‘ve seen how far he managed to go.

without prejudice, i'll stand in defence of vp on this point. if i understand him correctly, he believes in a Republic that is strictly non discriminatory, that gives no distiction to its Citizens except as Individuals (and his plaint is that the GC (so-called) will never let this happen). our confrere seeks to represent a Turkish constituency, i (too) ask where is a Greek, Maronite, Armenian, and Latin, equals as Cypriot Constituencies?

...Cyprus, is it a Greek State, and why not a Cypriot State; where is a Greek Constituency, speaking Bicommunally?

Kikapu, i am Greek, as a Person, but as a Cypriot i prefer to represent myself as a Human Being; is it the same for you?

...would you agree vp, you are Turkish, but as a Cypriot you would prefer to represent yourself as a Human Being?

repulse I am a Turkish Cypriots who wants a BBF with political equality of the 2 constituent states as supported by the UN and EU.

you still havent answered my question Vp....ill give it to you once more...How would the life of a Tc change/affected in a true democratic Federation?

[Viewpoint]

We would have to work closely with GCs, we would be included in all EU and world issues, we would have one international identity and recognition, we would trade directly from our own state, tourism would take off due to direct flights, TCs would return from abroad, we could take in Russian money like yourselves, we could ask for bailouts from the EU, my mail would come direct to my address etc etc. Is that enough?

[B25]

You forget one simpe thing, you dont have the land to do this. Why not ask turkey for a small piece in turkey to play the messiah. That way w can all be happy, you back with your turkish roots, us back to OUR lands.
If you think you are so deserving of our lands, why dont yo alo give the same to the Kurds??? Stinks of hypcricy.

[Viewpoint]

You forget one simpe thing, you dont have the land to do this. Why not ask turkey for a small piece in turkey to play the messiah. That way w can all be happy, you back with your turkish roots, us back to OUR lands.
If you think you are so deserving of our lands, why dont yo alo give the same to the Kurds??? Stinks of hypcricy.

We appear to be going around in circles do you know the difference between soverignty and privately owned land rights?

[B25]

You forget one simpe thing, you dont have the land to do this. Why not ask turkey for a small piece in turkey to play the messiah. That way w can all be happy, you back with your turkish roots, us back to OUR lands.
If you think you are so deserving of our lands, why dont yo alo give the same to the Kurds??? Stinks of hypcricy.

We appear to be going around in circles do you know the difference between soverignty and privately owned land rights?

Yes I do, you have NO sovereignty, that is held by the Nation, you have some private land as little as 12% distributed Island wide and certainly in no contiguous block of 37%.
It is you that has no idea about these things and you just throw those stupid slogans around when you have no argument. Heres one of your favourites that suits you right down to the ground, "you are a donkey who thinks you are a race horse because some idiot put a saddle on you". Don't you think that fits you right now? You have nothing, no DF, no DT, no recognition, no international voice, no nothing (the donkey), who wants to play the nation state (by adding a saddle).
Tell me VP, you you get paid ny the post or by the word to type your crap here????

[Viewpoint]

You forget one simpe thing, you dont have the land to do this. Why not ask turkey for a small piece in turkey to play the messiah. That way w can all be happy, you back with your turkish roots, us back to OUR lands.
If you think you are so deserving of our lands, why dont yo alo give the same to the Kurds??? Stinks of hypcricy.

We appear to be going around in circles do you know the difference between soverignty and privately owned land rights?

Yes I do, you have NO sovereignty, that is held by the Nation, you have some private land as little as 12% distributed Island wide and certainly in no contiguous block of 37%.
It is you that has no idea about these things and you just throw those stupid slogans around when you have no argument. Heres one of your favourites that suits you right down to the ground, "you are a donkey who thinks you are a race horse because some idiot put a saddle on you". Don't you think that fits you right now? You have nothing, no DF, no DT, no recognition, no international voice, no nothing (the donkey), who wants to play the nation state (by adding a saddle).
Tell me VP, you you get paid ny the post or by the word to type your crap here????

Cut your usual crap...and answer who are the "nation" that own soverignty? (obviously you need educating)

[Kikapu]

Every Kibrisli that I meet says he is CYPRIOT and feels contempt for those others who are TURKS.
And we have VP here trying to sell propaganda. I won't buy.

Did you ask them if they want to be a minority among GCs? Lets say for arguments sake you are right what will it chnage? will it make you happy? or will it unite us?

The problem with you VP is that you are "a partitionist at heart". Kikapu said those are your own words...

You wish that someday you will have your own recognized state, that you will be equal to all other nations in the world, have ambassadors, join the UN, have a thriving economy etc etc just like the free areas of the RoC. And that you will get rid of Turkey messing in your affairs other than providing you a free of charge army and protection.
You forget of course that 90% of the land and properties in the north are stolen GC land and properties hence from this factor alone your dream could never come true. Let aside other factors like Turkey who controls everything in the occupied North, and considers the place as their loot of war, that will never donate to you to become an independent state. And who are you according to them? Some "british bastards" that’s what the Turks say for you….

Your starting point in what you REALLY WANT is very important in explaining your stance.
For you any other solution other than your dream of partition must be way too good to be accepted.Something like the Anan Plan… That’s why you always ask for a million guarantees and assurances every time a compromise proposal is on the air.

Now compare yourself with any other Cypriot whose starting point is unification or one Cyprus for all CYPRIOTS. Take a Kibrisli for this example. Does this guy expect to have a million guarantees and assurances for every aspect of a solution like you do? Does he expect the solution to be way too good for him (hence way too bad for the Kypreoi)? Does he expect his own numbers who are not even 10% of todays total, to dictate the remaining 90% of what to do or not do, hiding behind the term political equality, like you do? Does he expect to be an equal partner in an economy in which he will not even be contributing 5% and dictate terms and conditions to those who run 95% of the economy like you do?
Does he expect that with some magic formula the Kypreoi will be forced to give him their properties in the north for free or for some peanuts, or does he believe in lies that the Kibrisli land left in the free areas is enough to make an equal exchange like every partitionit thinks? Or does he KNOW that at best the Kibrisli will end up owning only about 1/3-1/2 of the land ownership in their administered area?
Does he expect that even with a BBF solution with political equality the Kibrisli Federal part will be in total control and practice discrimination vs the Kypreoi (like you and every other partitionist thinks), or does he deep inside know that this BBF thing is a starting point where the Kypreoi will sooner or later develop/create businesses and be in control of at least 50% of the economy there, because of their land and property ownership?

In summary those of you partitionists really misunderstood what you will ever get in a solution. And of course Eroglu is one of you and we ‘ve seen how far he managed to go.

Pyro I am a partitionist at heart because the alternatives are not acceptable to either side, both side consider compromise is a gain for one side therefore must be a loss for the other. I know this may be difficult but you have to start by erasing all that has been etched into your brain and start acknowledging that we TCs have just as much right to the sovereignty/ownership of Cyprus as you do(we are not talking private land ownership thats another matter all together) only then will you understand that we have a right to live, work and prosper on this island. You want us to do this in a unitary state and I want to do it under a BBF with political equality of the 2 states, allowing everyone to move and settle where ever they wish choosing for themselves which administration they wish to reside under.

Your offer has failed in the past leaving a very bitter taste of total mistrust in every ones mouth, no one wants to go back to those days, what you offer forces me to live under majority rule which happens to be the GCs who can manipulate the situation to their own benefit leaving us out in the cold just like other minorities around the world persecuted discriminated against and always at a disadvantage but this would in our own country whereas other minority groups accept this status because they choose to move to another country other their own. WHY??? WHY???

Now my option of living side by side has proven beyond a doubt 38 years of peaceful existence where you have prospered and even joined the EU, I imho believe its clear which option is more suited to Cypriots on both sides of the divide....BBF with political equality of the 2 states as supported by the UN and EU.

Pyro I am a partitionist at heart because the alternatives are not acceptable to either side

That's like saying, "if I can't be with a woman, then I become Gay and go after men".

The truth is, you are "Gay", so stop pretending that you like "women"!

Twit!

[Viewpoint]

Only to be expected from you Kikapooo, are you saying that all Gays dont know what they are? not only are you racist but also a homophobe to boot....gets worse by every post.

[Kikapu]

Only to be expected from you Kikapooo, are you saying that all Gays dont know what they are? not only are you racist but also a homophobe to boot....gets worse by every post.

Once again your lack of fully comprehending the written English language has let you down.!

No, I am saying that Gays know who they are, just as you know that you are a Partitionist at Heart, so stop blaming on other issues which you claim that has made you a Partitionist at Heart!

Now do you get it?