Cyprus-Forum.com

[Kikapu]

I refer you to the original post. Points 2 and 3:

2. Whether you call it the RoC or the United Cyprus Federation doesn't really matter, what counts is fair representation for all communities that make up Cyprus' population.

3. UN resolutions talk about a bi-zonal, bi-communal federation based on political equality. Clinging to the idea of legalising the 'TRNC' - or two-states - is one of the reasons negotiations have been going nowhere. This has not happened for 37 years, there's no reason for it to happen anytime soon.

Totally agree the GCs have never wanted to share by supporting a BBf with political equality, their aim has always been a unitary GC state with TCs as just another minority, thats why for 38 years there has and never will a solution.

More BS from "I'm a partitionist at heart" clown.

In the USA, the great state of Utah is a "Mormon state", but it does not mean ONLY Mormon Americans can live there nor does it mean ONLY the Mormon Americans can be in the government of Utah, but since the majority of those living in Utah are Mormon Americans, eventhough they are in fact a Minority group in the USA, naturally, most political offices will be held by the Mormons in the state of Utah, and also makes Utah "Politically Equal" to all the other states in the US, which they send their 2 senators to the US senate, as equals. Just replace Utah with the north in a True Federation Cyprus, and you have what the UN, EU and the RoC backs. Only the fascists such as yourself and the likes of you in the north and Turkey does not back the above, because your aims is to partition, so when Denktash agreed to BBF, he made the mistake of not asking for BBC, as in Confederation. Too bad for the Fascists, because you are stuck with BBF with EU norms as of 2004. The alternative to BBF with EU norms, is going to be Unitary state with EU norms. Take your pick!

Dear Kikapu we have been debating for years and you knwo full well that we cannot go from square 1 to 50 on day 1. The USA is a matured democracy where they have evolved into one people Americans and are proud of it. While on my visit I asked people who looked like Mexican and Far East where are you from they ouwl proudly announce Im from the USA and that they are Americans. For us this is not the case and you cannot force this as the 2 sides have been divided far to long for this sort of response, we need transition periods guarantees checks and balances to go through the eolving stages necessary to become one people. Our problem is that the checks and balances we ask for which are vital in order to evolve you deny me, your denial only fuels my mistrust and makes me dig my heels in even further. You yourself claim that what we ask for is not necessary and that over time it will become redundent as the evolution will show that we will all be better off united than divided as we are today. But in order for us to take that first step we have to be encouraged and not forced, wehave to be given guarantees checks and balances that will over time become redundent but your approach has not yielded any results in over 52 years of negotiaitions, isnt it time you tried something new and allowed evolution to happen?

If the RoC was not a matured Democracy, they would not have been allowed to join the EU, unlike Turkey which is not a mature Democracy or even wants to be, hence the reason why it is not in the EU.

Just because you do not feel like a Cypriot as a numerical minority, it does not mean the numerical majority should lose being a Cypriot and be treated in a apartheid way by taking their rights away just because you do not trust protections of Human Rights, Democracy and International law which the EU will guarantee these rights to everyone. The one's who are not trusted in Cyprus are those who want to do away with these rights for all Cypriots and instead create permanent partition, is the reason why a settlement has not been reached, because you continue practicing these violations of Democracy, Human Rights and International laws for all Cypriots. It is time to stop blaming others why there hasn't been a settlement and start looking within, assuming you want to live under EU norms. People of Cyprus have lived together for 400 + years before, because there wasn't an issue of Enosis and Taksim until the 50's, and today, Enosis is no longer the issue, where as, Taksim is still the norm for people like you and Turkey, therefore the blame can be placed of no settlement squarely on the laps of people like you and Turkey. It is time to change with the times, or else you will get left behind.

[Viewpoint]

So we will get left behind because you think one size fits all. How narrow minded can one individual be, your views are so obtuse its the foundation stone to why a solution will never be found.

[repulsewarrior]

Kikapu, i don't know what you think of my position, but if it means anything, go back in this thread and reread it. if you really want a Cypriot State, rather than a Greek State, calm down, and look at what has been said so far.

...i do not believe we are far apart, our intent IS the same.

but we must be more careful to observe, and in our communication.

...is now a good time to Found a Greek Constituency?

[Kikapu]

So we will get left behind because you think one size fits all. How narrow minded can one individual be, your views are so obtuse its the foundation stone to why a solution will never be found.

No, your insistence on Apartheid solution is the reason why no solution has been found. The moment you want to be like the rest of the EU, presto, a solution can be found. If you think an Apartheid solution is the answer, then as soon as you can convince the rest of the EU to become an "Apartheid Democracy", then you can have the same in Cyprus.

I have given you a BBF plan with all the protections for a numerical minority TCs being political equals, as well as something extra, the "Grandfathered-in population" control for the north, just because it will never be used, but a double security for the TCs where the north will retain it's majority TCs, unless of course, the TCs themselves choose to become a minority in the north, and you snubbed at it, and the reasons are, is because you are a partitionist at heart. For people like you to make sure no partition of such will ever be possible, is to have a settlement based on True Federation, True Democracy, Human Rights, International Laws and the EU Principles. With the above principles, you cannot divide Cyprus. Anything less than the above principles like the Annan Plan or the 1959 Zurich agreements, we can see the results today and there's no need to further give you more of the same to make things even far worse than they are today. Lets face it, it is oxymoronic to think a partitionist at heart like you and your ilk would want anything but partition, so giving you anything less than the above principles for Cyprus, it will be like adding fuel onto a fire to accelerate for you to partition Cyprus permanently. What do you take us for to trust you with a "Apartheid Democracy" principles for a settlement, morons?

[humanist]

The TC"s are weird breed of people Kikapu, apologies as you are TC yourself. But they cannot stand the settlers but yet cannot stand the GC's either. Their way of thinking will lead them to extinction.

[Viewpoint]

So we will get left behind because you think one size fits all. How narrow minded can one individual be, your views are so obtuse its the foundation stone to why a solution will never be found.

No, your insistence on Apartheid solution is the reason why no solution has been found. The moment you want to be like the rest of the EU, presto, a solution can be found. If you think an Apartheid solution is the answer, then as soon as you can convince the rest of the EU to become an "Apartheid Democracy", then you can have the same in Cyprus.

I have given you a BBF plan with all the protections for a numerical minority TCs being political equals, as well as something extra, the "Grandfathered-in population" control for the north, just because it will never be used, but a double security for the TCs where the north will retain it's majority TCs, unless of course, the TCs themselves choose to become a minority in the north, and you snubbed at it, and the reasons are, is because you are a partitionist at heart. For people like you to make sure no partition of such will ever be possible, is to have a settlement based on True Federation, True Democracy, Human Rights, International Laws and the EU Principles. With the above principles, you cannot divide Cyprus. Anything less than the above principles like the Annan Plan or the 1959 Zurich agreements, we can see the results today and there's no need to further give you more of the same to make things even far worse than they are today. Lets face it, it is oxymoronic to think a partitionist at heart like you and your ilk would want anything but partition, so giving you anything less than the above principles for Cyprus, it will be like adding fuel onto a fire to accelerate for you to partition Cyprus permanently. What do you take us for to trust you with a "Apartheid Democracy" principles for a settlement, morons?

Partition is not a dirty word, its has brought about a peaceful existence for both sides for the last 38 years, what you want to do is force us from day 1 to go from step 1 to 50 a leap of faith right into the laps of the GCs...well no can do, if there are no transition periods, guarantees checks and balances the TRNC can stay as it is. As for your pathetic attempt to sell us TCs out which you tried to disguise in the form of your solution dont even go there people know with whom your priorities lie the GCs so reserecting something we have exposed as being our death warrant is not a very good idea.

[Viewpoint]

The TC"s are weird breed of people Kikapu, apologies as you are TC yourself. But they cannot stand the settlers but yet cannot stand the GC's either. Their way of thinking will lead them to extinction.

Kikapoo is not a TC.

[repulsewarrior]

...so, there is no Turkish Constituency, and what's best for Cypriots is a Greek State?

...is that the new revisionist plan?

...don't ask me, i come from a "mixed" village. none of those left, is there?

Quote:
That federation would comprise a federal government with a single international personality, along with a Turkish Cypriot constituent state and a Greek Cypriot constituent state, which would be of equal status.

...need i repeat myself, if there is a Republic and the Turkish Constituency, where is a Greek Constituency, (and others i hope), as equals?

...and i need to ask you, before you go into denial, do you realise that we are at an advent, it is possible that the demographics will change dramatically, we will still be Cypriots, we will need THIS respect as Citizens, yet how many will be born "Greeks" or "Turks", and how many will speak English? what will be important is that they are as electors equal to their neighbours, where everyone votes (as an Individual) for their Federal Government Representatives, and by where they choose to reside (as a Person), everyone votes in one National Assembly as well.

...Cyprus may be almost all Greek, it is all the more reason for them to reason, as Human Beings, for this betterment Bicommunal can be defined.

...

...

[Kikapu]

So we will get left behind because you think one size fits all. How narrow minded can one individual be, your views are so obtuse its the foundation stone to why a solution will never be found.

No, your insistence on Apartheid solution is the reason why no solution has been found. The moment you want to be like the rest of the EU, presto, a solution can be found. If you think an Apartheid solution is the answer, then as soon as you can convince the rest of the EU to become an "Apartheid Democracy", then you can have the same in Cyprus.

I have given you a BBF plan with all the protections for a numerical minority TCs being political equals, as well as something extra, the "Grandfathered-in population" control for the north, just because it will never be used, but a double security for the TCs where the north will retain it's majority TCs, unless of course, the TCs themselves choose to become a minority in the north, and you snubbed at it, and the reasons are, is because you are a partitionist at heart. For people like you to make sure no partition of such will ever be possible, is to have a settlement based on True Federation, True Democracy, Human Rights, International Laws and the EU Principles. With the above principles, you cannot divide Cyprus. Anything less than the above principles like the Annan Plan or the 1959 Zurich agreements, we can see the results today and there's no need to further give you more of the same to make things even far worse than they are today. Lets face it, it is oxymoronic to think a partitionist at heart like you and your ilk would want anything but partition, so giving you anything less than the above principles for Cyprus, it will be like adding fuel onto a fire to accelerate for you to partition Cyprus permanently. What do you take us for to trust you with a "Apartheid Democracy" principles for a settlement, morons?

Partition is not a dirty word, its has brought about a peaceful existence for both sides for the last 38 years, what you want to do is force us from day 1 to go from step 1 to 50 a leap of faith right into the laps of the GCs...well no can do, if there are no transition periods, guarantees checks and balances the TRNC can stay as it is. As for your pathetic attempt to sell us TCs out which you tried to disguise in the form of your solution dont even go there people know with whom your priorities lie the GCs so reserecting something we have exposed as being our death warrant is not a very good idea.

So what are you saying, that USA's True Federation and the EU's Principles does not have any checks & balances for everyone, and you want people to take you seriously?

That's where your argument falls flat on it's face and exposes your true intentions, and that is, you do not want any checks & balances for everyone, but an "Apartheid Democracy" where numerical minority TCs will make gains at the expense of the numerical majority GCs and other Cypriots.

Partition is a dirty word when you have forcefully violated the Human Rights of hundreds of thousands of Cypriots, stole their property, brought in hundreds of thousands of Illegal Aliens from the very same country which illegally occupy parts of Cyprus, against the detriment of all Cypriots, including the TCs. You are just happy to enjoy the spoils of war and living on stole GC properties. If I was just as morally corrupted as you, I wouldn't want to have peace either, which would mean returning all your illegally gotten loot in a settlement based on True Federation and Democracy with Human Rights and International law. You want a settlement that will legalize your ill gotten gains. Enjoy it while you can, because nothing lasts forever!

As for your comments on my BBF plan, it really did expose you as being a "I'm a partitionist at heart", way before you told us yourself. Just because you lie by repeating the same lies, just like what Erdogan does all the time in the hopes that people will believe the lies told, you may be able to convince the uneducated, Racists and the Fascists, but you stand ZERO chance convincing anyone with an ounce of intelligence.

[Kikapu]

The TC"s are weird breed of people Kikapu, apologies as you are TC yourself. But they cannot stand the settlers but yet cannot stand the GC's either. Their way of thinking will lead them to extinction.

Kikapoo is not a TC.

Kikapoo may not be, but for sure, Kikapu is!