Cyprus-Forum.com

[Alexios]

At the end of the day, I wouldnt expect any different argument from people who obey the brain washing from a backward expanionsist, siege mentality state.

Just a correction! I didnt write the above..

I am not sure how feasible it is to go back to the 1960 Constitution,otherwise yes i agree.

[BirKibrisli]

At the end of the day, I wouldnt expect any different argument from people who obey the brain washing from a backward expanionsist, siege mentality state.

Just a correction! I didnt write the above..

I am not sure how feasible it is to go back to the 1960 Constitution,otherwise yes i agree.

I am terribly sorry,Alexios,I must've taken that from someone else by mistake,though I don't see how it happened.They are definitely not your words.
I say lets go back to the 1960 constitution because that is the only agreement we have backed by international treaties.It is meant to be an interim measure to get us out of the mess we are in.If we wait for another agreement our lives might not be long enough at this rate.
And it is something Talat can demand and Papadopoulos has to consider seriously.Then the two comminities can take their own fates into their own hands and renegotiate a fairer Constitution with safeguards for minority rights.Personally I don't like the 1960 constitution because it forces the two communities to live side by side, not together.We can never forge a Cypriot nation with that constitution.But does Talat have the balls to demand to return to the Rof C of 1960,and does Papadopoulos have the balls to agree,I have serious doubts in both cases.
So that leaves the GCs masters of 65% of Cyprus,Turkey the master of the rest,and the TCs in deep fridge,I am afraid.

[Viewpoint]

At the end of the day, I wouldnt expect any different argument from people who obey the brain washing from a backward expanionsist, siege mentality state.

Just a correction! I didnt write the above..

I am not sure how feasible it is to go back to the 1960 Constitution,otherwise yes i agree.

I am terribly sorry,Alexios,I must've taken that from someone else by mistake,though I don't see how it happened.They are definitely not your words.
I say lets go back to the 1960 constitution because that is the only agreement we have backed by international treaties.It is meant to be an interim measure to get us out of the mess we are in.If we wait for another agreement our lives might not be long enough at this rate.
And it is something Talat can demand and Papadopoulos has to consider seriously.Then the two comminities can take their own fates into their own hands and renegotiate a fairer Constitution with safeguards for minority rights.Personally I don't like the 1960 constitution because it forces the two communities to live side by side, not together.We can never forge a Cypriot nation with that constitution.But does Talat have the balls to demand to return to the Rof C of 1960,and does Papadopoulos have the balls to agree,I have serious doubts in both cases.
So that leaves the GCs masters of 65% of Cyprus,Turkey the master of the rest,and the TCs in deep fridge,I am afraid.

Why should we go back to the 1960 constitution, it didnt work then wont work now....to much will be changed by GCs they would bever accept our veto rights so thats why we are trying to negotiate issues into a new constitution.

[BirKibrisli]

Viewpoint wrote:

Why should we go back to the 1960 constitution, it didnt work then wont work now....to much will be changed by GCs they would bever accept our veto rights so thats why we are trying to negotiate issues into a new constitution.

But Viewoint how do we know it won't work if we don't try it.A lot has changed since 1963,some for the worse maybe,but some definitely for the better.For example,Cyprus is in the EU now,TCs will have a lot of avenues to claim their rights if any attempt is made to tamper with them.You can't be afraid of physical violence between the two communities,under the watchful eye of the EU,canyou?Can you not see that any other solution that might be forced on the GCs cannot lead to a longterm peace and harmony,if our Cypriot brothers and sisters feel hardly done by.And any solution that involves two states will be greatly resented by the GCs.
As to our veto rights,are you aware that in 1963 the Turkish Cypriot side vetoed Makarios' Tax Law for no good reason,which gave the then President the excuse to insist on his "reform package"?
We should go back to the 1963 constitution because that is the only one we have enshrined in international treaties.It can happen within a few short months if both sides are willing.And if you think that time is in favour of TCs you are sadly mistaken.TCs will soon be a minority even in the TRNC.They already have no political power,totally isolated from the world,economically at the mercy of the beuraucrats in Turkey.Can all this be good for our beloved Cyprus,I ask you?

[Viewpoint]

quote="Birkibrisli"]Viewpoint wrote:

Why should we go back to the 1960 constitution, it didnt work then wont work now....to much will be changed by GCs they would bever accept our veto rights so thats why we are trying to negotiate issues into a new constitution.

But Viewoint how do we know it won't work if we don't try it.A lot has changed since 1963,some for the worse maybe,but some definitely for the better.For example,Cyprus is in the EU now,TCs will have a lot of avenues to claim their rights if any attempt is made to tamper with them.You can't be afraid of physical violence between the two communities,under the watchful eye of the EU,canyou?Can you not see that any other solution that might be forced on the GCs cannot lead to a longterm peace and harmony,if our Cypriot brothers and sisters feel hardly done by.And any solution that involves two states will be greatly resented by the GCs.
As to our veto rights,are you aware that in 1963 the Turkish Cypriot side vetoed Makarios' Tax Law for no good reason,which gave the then President the excuse to insist on his "reform package"?
We should go back to the 1963 constitution because that is the only one we have enshrined in international treaties.It can happen within a few short months if both sides are willing.And if you think that time is in favour of TCs you are sadly mistaken.TCs will soon be a minority even in the TRNC.They already have no political power,totally isolated from the world,economically at the mercy of the beuraucrats in Turkey.Can all this be good for our beloved Cyprus,I ask you?[/quote]

You are talking of going back to 1960 constituion which the GC say they were forced to accept, GCs tried to change and which TCs mentally buried in 1963. Which was also a contributing factor to the breakdown of relations between GCs and TCs.
If this constitiution is so imperfect then why go back to it when we have the opportunity to create a new constitution that will be acceptable to both sides?
The EU perspective is very questionable and on their past performance TCs do not feel that they would keep to their commitments and act in situations where TCs would need their support.

As for violence, well!! get rid of the Turkish Army and with the knowledge that Turkey could never intervene due to EU and you will see another face to GCs, wont this weaken our postition which will be exploited by GCs wishing to assert fear and intercommunal problems to extract their demands from TC community? What do we do if this happens wait for the EU to get 25 countries together and decide no thanks!!!!

As for us becoming a minority in the TRNC as we have said before the TCs are sandwiched in the middle, either a minority here or a minority in a united Cyprus that is another dileama we are faced with..better the devil you know?

Cypriots all love Cyprus no question there and TCs are willing to form a partnership, we displayed this will by saying YES. Now we have come to terms with the GC NO. We expect GC to come back to the table and this time negotiate in goodfaith so that we can address their and our concerns
and find a solution that both sides will be committed to. But do you believe deep down that we can achieve this?? I have my doubts and am very pesimistic thast why if over the next 5 to 10 years if no mutually agreed solution can be found recognition of the TRNC should come into play for the return of land. Im willing to give unification a chance but for how long?????

[2fan]

[quote="fantasies!

And when Kemal Atatürk spelled out the famous slogan "one Turk equals the whole world," he was either joking or he was drunk! You do not necessarily have to take it for granted.

Kifeas,
I have always respected you and your opinions but this is a new low for you. You obviously have a problem with the Ottoman Turks which I can understand, you claim Turkey is a third world country with no democracy and no regard to human rights which I unserstand is your opinion and I respect it. But don't you ever and I mean EVER show disrespect to Ataturk. Is nothing out of bounds for you?????? If your leader Tpap and TC's Denktash were a fraction of the man that Ataturk was your island would be unified by now. Watch your mouth. I expect an apology from you.

[2fan]

And if you GCs really want to foster a feeling of safety and equality for the TCs then you can start by paying the 14000 plus TCs working in the south equal wages and not treat them like second class citizens. You keep asking the TCs to take a leap of faith but I don't see many GCs taking it.

[2fan]

Kifeas,
So much for your arguments for human rights in Turkey. Take a look at yourself then talk your crap.

http://web.amnesty.org/pages/grc-051005-action-eng

[garbitsch]

2fan, Kifeas and others are suffering from amnesia and blindness, since now that they are part of the EU (Greece & RoC), everything they do is perfect and democratic.

As for Ataturk, isn't it obvious that they hate him so much since he didn't let Greeks to fulfil their megali idea?

[Main_Source]

But don't you ever and I mean EVER show disrespect to Ataturk

lol.. The man was a womaniser, an alcoholic, had a greed for land expansion for the good of 'turkness', did his best to abolish traditional culture for the sake of going western (even outlawed the fez...wtf) and to boot was in power during the genocide of Armenians and mass ethnic cleansing of Greeks. For some reason though, the majority of Turks are brainwashed into thinking he was some super man and took everything that he said as a final and moral word. He was also the man who started the plan to take back Cyprus and even made a speech about it.

Dont be so ignorant and look outside of the Turkish box...this is the guy that makes so many of your people overtly nationalistic and refuse to believe the truth about Turkey and their quarrels.

Why do you think the people that look after his personal diary/memoirs refuse to open them to the public or the media.

and its ok...Im not a fan of Alexander the Great.