Cyprus-Forum.com

[Get Real!]

Like Zoc says… it’s always the non-Cypriots who are quick to come up with divisive figures.

Why don’t you go divide your own country and show us how it’s done first!

[Kikapu]

Can you tell us VP how you come up with 25%,is it with a analysis or did you just come up with it?
Further will it be a new country in the north or a province of turkey?
If a new country will the new country except that the roc is succesor to all she has ie un seat,eu etc
Will turkey and this new state agree under un laws the roc continetal shelf and eez?

Back to the territory issue thru my valcultions based on the british land registry the breakdown is as follows:

61% gc land
12% tc land
26 % govt land
1% church

From my calculation the only way to come to 25 % is if govt land is split 50% why shoulf that be when you were 18% population and when in the govt of 1960 the tc had 30% representation in the parliment ?

I think a fairer solution would be 78-22 % split

The remaining 3% is related to Evkaf land but this i am certain can be negotiated to find a middle ground and agree the land distribution. The important issue here to that you have accepted that we cannot and will never find a solution to unite and that agreed partition is the only and best way to solve the Cyprus issue once and for all.

The TRNC will be a new worldwide recognized country.

The TRNC will not be in the EU.

Well done for seeing and accepting reality.

You are asking the wrong people (GC's) to agree to something (land for recognition) when you should be asking the TCs and Turkey for such a deal, and to what it would mean for them to agree to such a deal and under the conditions that will be asked by the GCs for such a deal, and that's without getting into your silly land percentages that you would want.

Lets start with these condition in what the GCs would want the TCs and Turkey to agree to, in order to achieve "Land for Recognition" for the north. Lets see how willing they will be to support your position. I doubt they will.

1. Only approx 5% of Government land would go to the north, based on 18%-82% split of 1960 population of Cyprus, of the 26% Government land that will divided, which will bring the land size for the north to be 17%. Denktash and Küçük sold most of the Evkaf land to the British for £1.5 million GBP, therefore the most land the north would have would be 18%, which bis 50% less than what it is today.

2. The north and Turkey will be vetoed from ever joining the EU.

3. There will be no longer any Turkish Cypriots in the RoC as a community, but only as citizens of Cyprus who happen to speak Turkish as their main language, much like the Spanish , Chinese, Japanese etc etc etc speaking citizens in the USA, and that the official language of the RoC will be Greek. Any TCs who does not wishes to accept this, will no longer be considered a citizen of Cyprus and that they will be stripped of their RoC citizenship and also stripped off their EU citizenship, unless they are EU citizens from another EU member state, such as the UK. Visa will be required by the north to travel to the RoC, exceptions for those with EU citizenship.

4. ALL services by the RoC will be stopped to ALL those who are no longer RoC citizens or EU citizens, except for pensions owed from the past.

5. ALL natural resources found in the new RoC's (82%) EEZ will belong solely to the RoC. Anything found in the north's 18% EEZ will belong to the north. Much like Haiti and Dominican Republic who both share the same island, but as separate countries, independent from each other, therefore, each have their own EEZ's.

6. The RoC will allow any country to station a military base on it's 82% territory.

These are few that comes to mind right now. I don't care that you will accept these condition for partition, because you are irrelevant. Give me an acceptance report for these above conditions by the TCs and Turkey and than come back here and ask for "Land for Recognition", otherwise you are such waisting every ones time as usual with your provocative propaganda..

Before taking these proposals to our leaders in the TRNC its you who should provide the acceptance report by the GC side otherwise its you that is pissing in the wind, if there is a serious proposal from those that count on the GC side then produce it otherwise its you that is wasting everyone time with your standard stupidity.

This is a public forum and we are all discussing our ideas publicly, you trying to dismiss the fact that bulio and I can come to a solution which we all know makes you sick by demanding the "official stamp" only shows that people like you support the current status quo as it is not your intention to find middle ground but to sell out the TCs people to minority rights in a GC state.

You have missed the point ..........AGAIN!

It is you, the north's so puppet leaders and Turkey, who is constantly proposing a partition in one form or other ( AP perfect example) and not such proposals made by the RoC or the GCs, therefore, it is upon yourselves to make such proposals in order to make it palatable for the RoC and the GCs to accept such conditional "Land for Recognition" proposal. My guess is, these are a bare minimum the RoC or the GCs would even contemplate even agreeing to since they have all the economic & political recognitions and the north have ZILCH. But to even test the waters in what the RoC and the GCs would accept, you should first run it through what the TCs as EU citizens and Turkey would accept. My guess is they will not, therefore, you are wasting every ones time. On top of these possible proposals that I gave as an example, for them to stand any chance for the RoC and the GCs to accept your silly proposal, you may need to do a lot more bending over and bringing along much more Vaseline, because you are going to need it. So stop with your pointless posts and cheap-shots and give us the the acceptance report by the TCs and Turkey that they would agree to anything to be rid of the RoC and the GCs. Until then, you are just being a forum nuisance and annoyance....!

[Viewpoint]

Look you moronic fuck ( I can beat you at this name calling shit) if bulio and I can agree division on here thats our business, you want 50% back in a BBF but he is willing to to accept recognition for 50% return all well and good, you two are the ones with a differing of opinions, I disagree with you but would take his offer.

As for the official stance all you have to do is wait for the official closure of the current talks to see what the demand will be from our side and believe me it will be recognition but it will not be anywhere as flexible as mine.

[Kikapu]

Look you moronic fuck ( I can beat you at this name calling shit) if bulio and I can agree division on here thats our business, you want 50% back in a BBF but he is willing to to accept recognition for 50% return all well and good, you two are the ones with a differing of opinions, I disagree with you but would take his offer.

As for the official stance all you have to do is wait for the official closure of the current talks to see what the demand will be from our side and believe me it will be recognition but it will not be anywhere as flexible as mine.

Look you moronic fuck ( I can beat you at this name calling shit)

That's about ALL you are good at.

you want 50% back in a BBF but he is willing to to accept recognition for 50% return

BBF with EU Principles will be a recognition of TCs rights, you twit!

[ZoC]

Look you moronic fuck ( I can beat you at this name calling shit).

no u can't. u just come across as premenstrual.

[Viewpoint]

Look you moronic fuck ( I can beat you at this name calling shit) if bulio and I can agree division on here thats our business, you want 50% back in a BBF but he is willing to to accept recognition for 50% return all well and good, you two are the ones with a differing of opinions, I disagree with you but would take his offer.

As for the official stance all you have to do is wait for the official closure of the current talks to see what the demand will be from our side and believe me it will be recognition but it will not be anywhere as flexible as mine.

Look you moronic fuck ( I can beat you at this name calling shit)

That's about ALL you are good at.

you want 50% back in a BBF but he is willing to to accept recognition for 50% return

BBF with EU Principles will be a recognition of TCs rights, you twit!

No it wont you moron, this recognition is shared whereas recognition of the TRNC would mean we go it without the GCs and become a recognized country with all the benefits that involves.

[bill cobbett]

Oh Gawd... one thing that doesn't change on CF is the flipping language!!!!

Please pack it in with F words, moron words and sexist refs to menstruations. Thank you.

[ZoC]

Oh Gawd... one thing that doesn't change on CF is the flipping language!!!!

Please pack it in with F words, moron words and sexist refs to menstruations. Thank you.

u tell 'em, billy. only inarticulate sexists (and girls) use expletives willy-nilly.

[Pyrpolizer]

The forum has gradually run out of steam just like the current talks, all has been said yet we are still in disagreement, more than ever in fact. We are further way from a solution than we have ever been and have not move forward one step that would show that both want or can live together. Agreed partition for land appears to be the only way forward which imo both sides should start to contemplate as we are two different people with two totally different paths only problem is we share the same island, its time everyone realized this, that unification will never materialize and that agreed partition is the only viable solution.

VP you 've raised this issue of agreed partition countless times. What's the point? It's unrealistic, it cannot happen and I explained you the reasons many times. Today with the gas findings and EEZ there are even more reasons.

If your side REALLY wants to have agreed partition on exchange of returned land then there is a way to achieve it. It's not fully guaranteed to succeed it needs a lot of diplomacy from the Turkish side and a lot of pressure by the Anglo-Americans Turkish allies but the odds are that it will succeed in the end. The way is this: You start returning land unilaterally. You boss around as the good guy. You start with Famagusta and continue slowly until the Kypreoi won't be able to stand the pressure anymore and sit down to discuss the final details. Like it or not partition is going to COST you and most probably the cost will be higher compared to the cost of even agreeing on a BBF by accepting all the Kypreoi demands.Probably... I don't know...

The question is do your side AND Turkey really want agreed partition on exchange of land? Or do they want to keep the whole occupied area even if it stays unrecognized for ever? Isn't it obvious they want the later? Isn't it obvious they estimate it is more valuable to them as it is?

I understand your frustration for the fact that no solution seems possible in the near future, too many Kypreoi and Kibrislis share the same feeling, I wish I had the magic formula to tell you how the situation is going to change. I already proposed a few things in this forum. My conclussion is that something really RADICAL and CLEVER must be put in practice.
AN ACTION OUT OF THE ORDINARY!

[Pyrpolizer]

Btw a couple of days ago there was a one liner in the news that the Turkish side has sent a mediator to the RoC to propose agreed partition along the lines of what VP said

I haven't heard any more about it, the issue was not given more publicity and remained just a one liner in some past news