Cyprus-Forum.com

[kimon07]

......Papagos. He strongly urged Makarios to sit quite (Greece, he told him, breaths with two lungs, one British and one American)

According to Wiki it was Geoprge Papandreou (the grand father of today's Forest G.A.P) who said that in 1950 to the Mayor of Nicosia, not to Makarios.

http://el.wikipedia.org/wiki/%CE%9A%CF% ... 1955-59.29

[Bananiot]

Of course we should not go for what we think we deserve. This is a folly and could be unethical too, if it tramples on other peoples rights. Regarding tactics, these can be employed and bear fruit to some degree, according to your political, military and alliance clout. In 1955 we started a n armed struggle against an empire, by ourselves. It was doomed from the beginning and in world affairs, mistakes are paid for. Sooner or later the bill is presented and you hand out the cash.

[kimon07]

......Papagos. He strongly urged Makarios to sit quite (Greece, he told him, breaths with two lungs, one British and one American)

According to Wiki it was Geoprge Papandreou (the grand father of today's Forest G.A.P) who said that in 1950 to the Mayor of Nicosia, not to Makarios.

http://el.wikipedia.org/wiki/%CE%9A%CF% ... 1955-59.29

In fact Papagos had promised to Makarios that if he was to become prime minister he would help him to organize and stage the "liberation struggle" and in fact he kept his promise.

[kimon07]

Of course we should not go for what we think we deserve. This is a folly and could be unethical too, if it tramples on other peoples rights. Regarding tactics, these can be employed and bear fruit to some degree, according to your political, military and alliance clout. In 1955 we started a n armed struggle against an empire, by ourselves. It was doomed from the beginning and in world affairs, mistakes are paid for. Sooner or later the bill is presented and you hand out the cash.

Doomed from the beginning? But didn't the armed struggle produce results? Did the Empire manage to subdue it? Wasn't the Empire utterly embarrassed and in a bad position internationally? Wasn't Harding forced to resign because his army was unable to subdue EOKA and was replaced by the "diplomat" Fut? Wasn't the Empire forced to negotiate and finally grant us independence? It is entirely our fault that the terms of the independence were bad and that the type of state we agreed to be established was not viable.
The least we could do to ease the worries of the Brits in respect to their bases and the Americans in respect to Cyprus falling under the influence of the Soviets, would be to ask for a more democratic and viable constitution and propose, in exchange, for Cyprus to join NATO.

[Bananiot]

Have you seen the previous page Kimon? I beat you to it, regarding Papagos

By 1959 EOKA had just about had it. The Brits imposed their will on us and this is highlighted by the fact that at Lancaster House, when Makarios kept refused to sign, Karamanlis informed him that the Brits knew exactly where Grivas was and they could pick him up any time. He had no choice but to sign. The outcome of the EOKA struggle could never have been any different.

[kimon07]

So we are going for what we think we deserve, is that OK?

Absolutely. Put it to a referendum to the TCs under strict supervision of the UN and the EU and see what happens.

[kimon07]

Have you seen the previous page Kimon? I beat you to it, regarding Papagos

By 1959 EOKA had just about had it. The Brits imposed their will on us and this is highlighted by the fact that at Lancaster House, when Makarios kept refused to sign, Karamanlis informed him that the Brits knew exactly where Grivas was and they could pick him up any time. He had no choice but to sign. The outcome of the EOKA struggle could never have been any different.

Come on Bananiot. You really think the Brits new were Grivas was but let him be?? Why not put him in chains first, leave EOKA devastated and then negotiate? Or, rather, do you really believe they would negotiate if they were certain that they were able to grab Grivas and subdue the armed straggle immediately? The declaration from Karamanlis only proves what we all knew.That Karamanlis wanted to close the Cyprus issue at any cost and pressed Makarios to his limits. All that karamanlis cared about during his first terms in office was the to eliminate the CY problem and establish good relations with Turkey, England, the USA and Europe so as to turn the efforts of the country exclusively towards economic growth and the elimination of the results of WW2 and mainly the civil war (44-49) and the "reconstruction" of Greece.

[Bananiot]

Kimon, do you really believe that EOKA could pose a serious problem to Britain? Operating in a small island with hardly any suitable place for guerrilla warfare EOKA was always a sitting duck for the Brits. Probably they were a blessing in disguise too and the Brits knew it. They even got Denktash to lend a helping hand to Yiorgadzis when he was arrested. By all accounts EOKA was totally finished by 1959, having gone through 1958 attacking and murdering GC's, especially in the Famagusta district. The Brits got what they wanted at the end, a foothold on the island which they wanted to secure prior to 1955 before EOKA started knocking on an open door. The only thing EOKA managed was to get Turkey seriously involved in the Cyprus issue.

[Viewpoint]

So we are going for what we think we deserve, is that OK?

Absolutely. Put it to a referendum to the TCs under strict supervision of the UN and the EU and see what happens.

If the result was that the TCs wanted division would you accept it?

[repulsewarrior]

...first get a census that is transparent to scrutiny, internationally. then, call for referendums with questions just as clear.

...try again.