Cyprus-Forum.com

[Hermes]

Bir these morons understand exactly what you are saying but like their forefathers they are turning a blind eye to your calls for actions that help heal the past and build trust. No GC has actually convinced anyone that the GC/EU option is better for TCs than moving forward with Turkey...how ironic they cant even promote what they say will be all thats needed for a solution.

You're in schizophrenic mode tonight. One post you call for unity, sharing and a strong federal structure, the next post you think your best option is partition and to go with Turkey! WTF is it? Make up your mind and stop dancing around like a demented fool!

[Viewpoint]

Bir these morons understand exactly what you are saying but like their forefathers they are turning a blind eye to your calls for actions that help heal the past and build trust. No GC has actually convinced anyone that the GC/EU option is better for TCs than moving forward with Turkey...how ironic they cant even promote what they say will be all thats needed for a solution.

You're in schizophrenic mode tonight. One post you call for unity, sharing and a strong federal structure, the next post you think your best option is partition and to go with Turkey! WTF is it? Make up your mind and stop dancing around like a demented fool!

Read the posts properly you moron.

[Hermes]

Bir these morons understand exactly what you are saying but like their forefathers they are turning a blind eye to your calls for actions that help heal the past and build trust. No GC has actually convinced anyone that the GC/EU option is better for TCs than moving forward with Turkey...how ironic they cant even promote what they say will be all thats needed for a solution.

You're in schizophrenic mode tonight. One post you call for unity, sharing and a strong federal structure, the next post you think your best option is partition and to go with Turkey! WTF is it? Make up your mind and stop dancing around like a demented fool!

Read the posts properly you moron.

I have. That's the problem!

[Viewpoint]

Bir these morons understand exactly what you are saying but like their forefathers they are turning a blind eye to your calls for actions that help heal the past and build trust. No GC has actually convinced anyone that the GC/EU option is better for TCs than moving forward with Turkey...how ironic they cant even promote what they say will be all thats needed for a solution.

You're in schizophrenic mode tonight. One post you call for unity, sharing and a strong federal structure, the next post you think your best option is partition and to go with Turkey! WTF is it? Make up your mind and stop dancing around like a demented fool!

Read the posts properly you moron.

I have. That's the problem!

You are so narrow minded that you dont understand them...where did I call for unity, sharing and a strong federal structure.....go back and start again.

[bill cobbett]

VP and Bananiot,you are wasting your time and energy ,my friends....These people will never understand...They never had to sleep with a shotgun under their beds when they were children...They never knew the fear of death some of us was subjected to growing up in Cyprus....They were never humiliated in long queues at checkpoints when they wanted to visit their relatives in another part of the island...They never had loved ones disappear by busloads,from hospital beds,from their villages....I am not saying terrible things did not happen to individual GCs,but these posters here never had personal experience of it...You talk about mistrust and personal security,they talk about higher living standards,EU aquies,UN resolutions etc...They have never faced extinction as a community or as a nation...They have no idea where you are coming from....That is why there will never be a solution in our lifetime....I admire your tenacity,and wish I had your patience to deal with these blind people...As I used to say, "there is no one as blind as those who refuse to see"....

Bir my dear, regrettably have to say that it is pretty clear to me, that you in common with practically everyone of the Older Generations are a majority part of the problem.

This Shotgun under the Bed mentality, this over-weight and untrusting baggage allowance from the past being carried in to the present and future is no way forward.

Now, if you'll excuse me ... will go and see how to give the younger generation occupying the Buffer Zone of the Mind a little help.

Hi there,Bill...We "older generation" are where we are and feel like we do because of certain events that happened in our little country...While you safely grew up in a loving,stimulating,and supporting environment some of us went to bed each night not sure if we would see the light of day....You can try to dismiss it,minimise it,or make it irrelevant ,but this is etched in our people's collective consciousness...That is why there is so much bitterness and mistrust between our peoples...Peersonally,I have met GCs via this forum I would trust with my life...I consider them my lifelong brothers...But that does not change the fact that NOTHING has been done over so many wasted years to promote understanding,respect and trust in Cyprus...What the younger geneartion is doing is pointless ideological wanking...It will change nothing,will not contribute to a solution one iota...We must face our bloody past,come to terms with it,so we can move forward with confidence...I have admiration for those who are truly trying to promote mutual trust,understanding and respect...These copy cat occupiers are not amongst them...I still wish them and you good luck...You need it...

Pollox Bir... it's the ideas of the young that often change things.

Whilst you were firmly grasping your shot-gun, quite happy to take shots at anyone you didn't like the look of, some of us were on the streets of the Diaspora, some of us agitated and occupied and protested, had many a cold night on occupations ... and those were times when it weren't terribly bright to take a stand against established ways... so please pack it in with your ugly and very condescending drivel about the comforts of the Diasopra.

Further, it was the young who made significant contributions in ending the war in Vietnam, took to the streets to condemn Apartheid in SA, marched and organised in East London to push back the Fascist Nationalists and support to Minorities. The young have always shaped the future.

Yesterday's Counter-Culture so often becomes Today's Culture.

So please get with the times.

Obviously you have had no direct contact with the youth of both sides, they are mainly air heads living off daddies money.

Oh Gawd, how on Earth do you come to that generalisation???

In any event and let's say you're right for a mo... it is often middle-class kids that take up the challenge to change things for the better in so many areas of life. Does it really matter who their parents are? Does that make their ideas bad ones????

[Hermes]

where did I call for unity, sharing and a strong federal structure.....go back and start again.

- One country one identity strong federal structure far from partition.

- I dont want the whole island, I am happy sharing.

Are you saying you didn't say these things? They are direct quotes. Or maybe you meant them to mean the opposite (like a true Turk):

- Two countries, two identities, a confederation, close to partition

- I don't want the whole island, just all the parts that don't belong to us.

PS. In future maybe you ought to add a caveat to your posts - that you mean the opposite of what you say.

[BirKibrisli]

VP and Bananiot,you are wasting your time and energy ,my friends....These people will never understand...They never had to sleep with a shotgun under their beds when they were children...They never knew the fear of death some of us was subjected to growing up in Cyprus....They were never humiliated in long queues at checkpoints when they wanted to visit their relatives in another part of the island...They never had loved ones disappear by busloads,from hospital beds,from their villages....I am not saying terrible things did not happen to individual GCs,but these posters here never had personal experience of it...You talk about mistrust and personal security,they talk about higher living standards,EU aquies,UN resolutions etc...They have never faced extinction as a community or as a nation...They have no idea where you are coming from....That is why there will never be a solution in our lifetime....I admire your tenacity,and wish I had your patience to deal with these blind people...As I used to say, "there is no one as blind as those who refuse to see"....

Bir my dear, regrettably have to say that it is pretty clear to me, that you in common with practically everyone of the Older Generations are a majority part of the problem.

This Shotgun under the Bed mentality, this over-weight and untrusting baggage allowance from the past being carried in to the present and future is no way forward.

Now, if you'll excuse me ... will go and see how to give the younger generation occupying the Buffer Zone of the Mind a little help.

Hi there,Bill...We "older generation" are where we are and feel like we do because of certain events that happened in our little country...While you safely grew up in a loving,stimulating,and supporting environment some of us went to bed each night not sure if we would see the light of day....You can try to dismiss it,minimise it,or make it irrelevant ,but this is etched in our people's collective consciousness...That is why there is so much bitterness and mistrust between our peoples...Peersonally,I have met GCs via this forum I would trust with my life...I consider them my lifelong brothers...But that does not change the fact that NOTHING has been done over so many wasted years to promote understanding,respect and trust in Cyprus...What the younger geneartion is doing is pointless ideological wanking...It will change nothing,will not contribute to a solution one iota...We must face our bloody past,come to terms with it,so we can move forward with confidence...I have admiration for those who are truly trying to promote mutual trust,understanding and respect...These copy cat occupiers are not amongst them...I still wish them and you good luck...You need it...

Pollox Bir... it's the ideas of the young that often change things.

Whilst you were firmly grasping your shot-gun, quite happy to take shots at anyone you didn't like the look of, some of us were on the streets of the Diaspora, some of us agitated and occupied and protested, had many a cold night on occupations ... and those were times when it weren't terribly bright to take a stand against established ways... so please pack it in with your ugly and very condescending drivel about the comforts of the Diasopra.

Further, it was the young who made significant contributions in ending the war in Vietnam, took to the streets to condemn Apartheid in SA, marched and organised in East London to push back the Fascist Nationalists and support to Minorities. The young have always shaped the future.

Yesterday's Counter-Culture so often becomes Today's Culture.

So please get with the times.

Bill,
When I was sleeping with a shotgun under my bed at age 7-8 you were probably not born yet...When you were born you probably slept with your favourite toy,safe in the knowledge that you lived in a civilised country where people's human rights were respected..So cut the crap...You can fool yourself that you can sweep the past under a carpet,and put your faith in those who have no idea what really happened in Cyprus...But it will not help us achieve the solution you say you desire...
Keep your head in the sand,mate...It is your head but GC state propaganda sand...I know you guys mean well,but you are totally deluded...You are only contributing to the problem...If you could only see that...

[Viewpoint]

where did I call for unity, sharing and a strong federal structure.....go back and start again.

- One country one identity strong federal structure far from partition.

- I dont want the whole island, I am happy sharing.

Are you saying you didn't say these things? They are direct quotes. Or maybe you meant them to mean the opposite (like a true Turk):

- Two countries, two identities, a confederation, close to partition

- I don't want the whole island, just all the parts that don't belong to us.

PS. In future maybe you ought to add a caveat to your posts - that you mean the opposite of what you say.

Look you as a GC always will take things out of context twist them around to suit your warped mentality, the first is a direct response to Nikitas who claims BBF is partition, the second is very clear, arent we sharing right now? its you thats wants the whole island not me. Now do you understand? Ah these simpletons.

[BirKibrisli]

Another logical fallacy ...

Bananiot has a steady and unwavering approach to the Cyprus issue: Turkey's intransigence is a foregone conclusion to which all others must adapt.

Now, what do we have, let us see: Intervention by Turkey in 1974 that no international body considers to be an invasion since Turkey, along with Greece and Britain, were granted this right in order to restore the London - Zurich agreements, which we signed while proclaiming "nenikikamen" - "we have won". Turkey comes in, occupies one third of the island, seeks and gets relocation of people, thousands become refugees and to add insult to injury, encourages thousands of Anatolian settlers to move to the island and practically change its demographic character. The worse, once order is restored, the Turkish army remains and effectively controls the north.

One would think that this is a clear case of human rights seriously violated by a bully of a country. Yet, all the international institutions, the UN, the EU and all the not so important ones, are calling the two sides, since day one, to engage in talks, in order to find a solution. Isn't our case a clear cut one, a case of intervention and occupation? Why do they ask us to seek a compromise solution through talks? Have the international institutions that are here to uphold law and order, completely lost the plot here? Are they not equating the victim with the aggressor, in our case?

Could it be that they know something we do not know, or something our apprentice politicians hide from us? Do we shoulder part of the blame for our predicament? Can somebody speak to us frankly about what we got ourselves into? Do we need anyone to tell us the obvious? Things can never become as they were before June 20 1974, let alone become better (unitary state, one man - one vote) unless of course we can militarily defeat Turkey in which case, what is there, one might ask, to stop us from realising our national aspirations?

A sane person can easily appreciate these dilemmas which have been forced onto our backs by our "patriots" and their dubious agendas. Nikitas, who is a Greek Cypriot writes about Turkey's intransigence and he is not the only one. Just about everybody in our community talk constantly about the Turkish intransigence as the main culprit for the stalemate. Fine, we have identified the culprit, where does this take us? Have we managed to convince those that can help us that our woes are a direct result of the Turkish intransigence, and if not, why not? Just consider this: Even during the Presidency of Papadopoulos, the Security Council of the UN called upon Turkey "to continue supporting the peace efforts" of the two communities. Papadopoulos not only did not complain but endorsed the document with his signature! This shows the extend of our problem which in a nutshell means that the international institutions believe that we shoulder at least part of the blame for the current situation. Hence they call for talks to find a solution, an agreed solution which of course must be a compromise solution, if it is to be agreed by both sides. If not, nobody will blame Turkey and of the next step will be some type of recognition for the pseudostate which will then lose its pseudo prefix and will leave us with nothing.

These are the thoughts that bother me and when I ask "what is the alternative?" and all I get is "nothing" I become more convince that Nikitas, B25, Aikmeh and a few others we all can identify, are not really interested in the good of this place.

Thank you for this thoughtful,intelligent,sensible post,Bananiot....No comments from the usual suspects,as usual...They prefer to keep their heads in the sand...GC state propaganda sand...While you and I know what is needed for a just solution,these ostriches keep doing what is not needed for a solution...having self-deluded,historically discredited,unimaginative ideas...You are one of the few bright lights who give people like me some hope,that perhaps one day sanity will privail,and our country will be united as one people,one nation...

[Hermes]

Look you as a GC always will take things out of context twist them around to suit your warped mentality, the first is a direct response to Nikitas who claims BBF is partition, the second is very clear, arent we sharing right now? its you thats wants the whole island not me. Now do you understand? Ah these simpletons.

You're a strange man. You mean you don't want one state, one country, and a strong federal structure? Why on earth are you trying to convince everyone you want a solution then? You want a separate state! And then you blame the GCs for not wanting a solution! You're nothing but a bloody time-waster!

As for your concept of sharing! That's a highly distorted and psychopathic concept of sharing you have there. Since when did stealing someone's land and property become sharing? Are you mad or just pretending to be?