Cyprus-Forum.com

[Hermes]

Hermes nothing will change, how long do you need to understand this?

VP, nothing stays the same. Look at how much has changed in the last two years? Who'd have thought it?

You are correct but the constant being the divide will remain as neither side shows the flexibility nor really wants to unite.

Nothing is constant, VP. Especially something which has no legal basis. You know this. You understand this point because you know that the occupied areas are maintained only by the force of arms. An enforced division which has no legal basis and relies only on force exposes the TCs to constant uncertainty and makes the TCs subject to the whims of external factors. Anything could change. It's a false security. The only thing that won't change is the RoCs sovereign claims to the north. Everything else is uncertain. History, economics and politics always have a way of surprising us. Turkey could decide, or be forced by circumstances, at any point to cut its losses in Cyprus. Stranger things have happened. Look at the past year.

[Viewpoint]

Holding your breath is not advisable as the big players are in control of how things develop both the Gcs and Tcs are very very small pawns in the grand scheme of things, they have far greater issues to deal with. I dont know how old you are but if you live long enough after another 50 years of non solution you to will understand that what Ecevit claimed in turning out to be true that the problem was solved in 1974 and what we have today is what we deserve.

[Hermes]

Holding your breath is not advisable as the big players are in control of how things develop both the Gcs and Tcs are very very small pawns in the grand scheme of things, they have far greater issues to deal with. I dont know how old you are but if you live long enough after another 50 years of non solution you to will understand that what Ecevit claimed in turning out to be true that the problem was solved in 1974 and what we have today is what we deserve.

If the "problem was solved", as you put it, then Turkey wouldn't need to keep 40,000 troops in Cyprus. A permanent garrison to keep the island forcibly divided means the problem has been anything but solved. Turkey understands this. Even if you don't.

[Viewpoint]

Holding your breath is not advisable as the big players are in control of how things develop both the Gcs and Tcs are very very small pawns in the grand scheme of things, they have far greater issues to deal with. I dont know how old you are but if you live long enough after another 50 years of non solution you to will understand that what Ecevit claimed in turning out to be true that the problem was solved in 1974 and what we have today is what we deserve.

If the "problem was solved", as you put it, then Turkey wouldn't need to keep 40,000 troops in Cyprus. A permanent garrison to keep the island forcibly divided means the problem has been anything but solved. Turkey understands this. Even if you don't.

The problems 1963-1974 have been solved we have been living in a peaceful environment and both sides have prospered, plus every country has an army to protect its borders so that argument doesn't hold water.

Look Hermes we just want to live in peace in our own state and have our own local administration, what you offer us is not what we want and we will never become what you want us to...you cannot force us to do anything.

[Hermes]

Look Hermes we just want to live in peace in our own state and have our own local administration, what you offer us is not what we want and we will never become what you want us to...you cannot force us to do anything.

What you want and what you can have are two different things entirely. No-one is going to give you a state in the north. You cannot get around the sovereignty issue. Further, do you think Turkey can afford to keep 40,000 troops permanently outside its borders? How soon before the legal claims, amounting to billions, for dispossessed GCs comes to Turkey's door? How much longer can Turkey afford the economic and strategic cost of occupying Cyprus? You're not thinking straight. Your current sense of security is entirely false. TCs have nothing, VP. Nothing but false promises and empty dreams. Time to snap out of it and grow up.

[Viewpoint]

Look Hermes we just want to live in peace in our own state and have our own local administration, what you offer us is not what we want and we will never become what you want us to...you cannot force us to do anything.

What you want and what you can have are two different things entirely. No-one is going to give you a state in the north. You cannot get around the sovereignty issue. Further, do you think Turkey can afford to keep 40,000 troops permanently outside its borders? How soon before the legal claims, amounting to billions, for dispossessed GCs comes to Turkey's door? How much longer can Turkey afford the economic and strategic cost of occupying Cyprus? You're not thinking straight. Your current sense of security is entirely false. TCs have nothing, VP. Nothing but false promises and empty dreams. Time to snap out of it and grow up.

How can I put this so you can arrive at an understanding that your approach will get you nowhere. Firstly we have a state unrecognized good or bad but its there you cannot ignore it as it makes you look real stupid. We can stay as we are forever, living in the TRNC is not as bad you wish to make it, I left the UK and have been living in the TRNC for 20 years now and love every moment of it, every country has its problems advantages and disadvantages. The soldier issue you keep raising is a fallacy that you GCs made up for your own benefit, Turkey has soldiers all over Turkey a few in the TRNC makes no difference they have been her for 37 years now and you want them to disappear so you keep up your propaganda you were taught in school. If they are still here in 10 years how will you feel when you look back? So our security concerns are well covered especially with Turkey being so close. The TCs have a right to Cyprus just as you do but its you who constantly dismiss this right which is acknowledged by the whole world, time you accepted and accommodated this reality.

Really this question keeps on springing to mind when will you GCs realize that we will never unite or that you will never get the north back...10 20 30 100 years??? how many exactly to look back and arrive at the conclusion how totally wrong you were.

[Hermes]

Firstly we have a state unrecognized good or bad but its there you cannot ignore it as it makes you look real stupid. We can stay as we are forever...

Forever is a long time. Turkey cannot keep 40,000 troops permanently in Cyprus to protect a small population. It cannot afford to keep subsidising the "trnc" and it faces potential legal claims that will run into billions of euros. Add to this the strategic, economic and diplomatic cost once its EU accession collapses - and the rise of Israel and Cyprus as rival energy transits - and you have one mighty fine Turkish mess.

You might think that it's a national cause but why do you think that Turkey is trying to come up with a way that will allow it to withdraw from Cyprus? Turkey wants rid of the Cyprob not to keep you "ungrateful parasites" living at the expense of the Turkish people. Turkey cares about Turkey not the TCs who it doesn't give a fuck about. Get it into your head. Don't be fooled by Erdogan. You know what he thinks of the TCs. And he knows what TCs think of him. They told him in no uncertain terms!

[humanist]

Hermes ... thats a good argument you put forward above. One I agree with. However, if that is the case why has Eroglu chosen the non solution approach he has of late. If Turkey does withdraw the troops and the subsidies of the "trnc", then surely the next best approach the TC's need to take is negotiated re unification. as opposed to one where it is imposed upon them when Turkey does move out and Cypurs is a gas producing nation therefore rich and can afford to take them to court individually as refugees want their lands back

[SKI-preo]

Holding your breath is not advisable as the big players are in control of how things develop both the Gcs and Tcs are very very small pawns in the grand scheme of things, they have far greater issues to deal with. I dont know how old you are but if you live long enough after another 50 years of non solution you to will understand that what Ecevit claimed in turning out to be true that the problem was solved in 1974 and what we have today is what we deserve.

Mother Turkey is also a relatively small pawn but they have pissed off our best friend Israel and so its soon going to be time for Turkey to get a new poo hole. Mother Turkey is a client state that is doing a pretty average job and upsetting her masters.

[Viewpoint]

Holding your breath is not advisable as the big players are in control of how things develop both the Gcs and Tcs are very very small pawns in the grand scheme of things, they have far greater issues to deal with. I dont know how old you are but if you live long enough after another 50 years of non solution you to will understand that what Ecevit claimed in turning out to be true that the problem was solved in 1974 and what we have today is what we deserve.

Mother Turkey is also a relatively small pawn but they have pissed off our best friend Israel and so its soon going to be time for Turkey to get a new poo hole. Mother Turkey is a client state that is doing a pretty average job and upsetting her masters.

Dream on.