Cyprus-Forum.com

[DTA]

As for it starting in the 50s - yeah well we didnt fancy joining Greece - we were not down with them - but we agreed to share the island with the gcs in 1960. And that lasted 3 years.

What an incredibly casual, naive and insulting account of Turkish Cypriot involvement in Cyprus's troubles. How generous of you to "agree to share the island" with the 82 per cent majority. Shame it didn't work out. Have you thought to ask yourself why?

The Greek Cypriot aspiration for Enosis in the 1950s was a legitimate response to the British colonial occupation of Cyprus. It was not directed against Turkish Cypriots. Whereas the Turkish Cypriot campaign for partition in the 1960s was wholly targeted against the Greek Cypriot majority with support from Turkey.

The Turkish Cypriot minority were initially encouraged to turn on the Greeks by the British authorities in the 1950s as part of their "divide and rule" strategy. Are you denying that the Turkish Cypriots collaborated with the British in the 50s? Are you denying that Turkish Cypriots formed the TMT and started to kill innocent Greek Cypriot civilians thus starting the inter-communal conflict? Are you denying that Turkish Cypriots collaborated with the invading Turkish army in 1974 again killing innocent Greek Cypriots?

The Turkish Cypriots and their misguided leaders have much to answer for in Cyprus. Not least doing Turkey's dirty work on the island in direct opposition to the aspirations of the majority population.

Yeah it was casual as I was answering a fascist I don't have much time for them.

As for your account of what happened, it's an absolute myopic ill informed joke of an analysis-

So much so I can't be bothered to answer it.

[Pyrpolizer]

Will you answer the three that I asked you?

Sure, i am not in the habit of avoiding questions.

let me quote them to have them in front of me:

Code: Select all

Where have I said that it was all the gcs fault?
What have I said that is untrue?
Where have I said that gcs have not suffered as well?

For 1 and 3 you said nothing, but neither did i say that you said anything.
For 2 just answer my questions about the "embargo" and we will find out if it is true or not.

NB. when I asked to tell me what you think of your own people that was in relevance with those who have the Mercedeces, in other words for your own people at PRESENT conditions. My bad, I should have clarified that, since you replied in a historical retrospect and hence we jumped to something else. We can revert to that later if you want.

[DTA]

When you asked me what I thought of my people I honestly took it to mean my people in general, that's why I answered.

As for my people with mercedes and bmws- what does that mean?

My girlfriend drives a BMW - she is a lawyer
Her dad drives one he is a dentist
My dads cousin's husband (who i call my uncle) who lost everthing in the south and was given one house and five dunums
Of land despite having at least 20 times that amount in the south.
could now through hard work buy a fleet of them if he wanted to, and has brought his son an x6

He also told te gcs that came to see their old house that whenever they are ready they can come and he will return their house- as it has always been theirs

So i really don't understand where your coming from?

[Pyrpolizer]

I know for a fact there were tcs post 74 that were forced from their homes at gunpoint by gc/ Greek solders - so the whole dentash threatened to kill anyone that didnt move north is bullshit propaganda that you have obviously brought into.

As for it starting in the 50s - yeah well we didnt fancy joining Greece - we were not down with them - but we agreed to share the island with the gcs in 1960. And that lasted 3 years.

Hence my comment from 1963- you see it all makes sense if you take of the blinkers.

What do you mean post 1974? When exactly? In August, in September October,November December?
Do you at least know when exactly about half the Kibrisli population moved North? Man we are talking for 60-70000 people here, do you know or just just spout hearsay stories? And since you talk about threads at gunpoint there should have been some who refused and were killed. How many where they and WHEN??

One member of my family and a member of my girlfriends family told me that happened, im going to believe them before you. Also when I posed this question on the board before other tcs came forward and said that knew of others who experienced the same thing. But I guess none of that is good enough for you, so step up and prove it was dentash who threatened people and made them move north.

60-70,000 people did not move at gun point and I can prove it to you, therefore it is you who throws away bullshit propaganda and avoids even telling us when exactly the few people he knows have moved.
Answer the questions I asked before, if you want me to continue.

[Pyrpolizer]

When you asked me what I thought of my people I honestly took it to mean my people in general, that's why I answered.

As for my people with mercedes and bmws- what does that mean?

My girlfriend drives a BMW - she is a lawyer
Her dad drives one he is a dentist
My dads cousin's husband (who i call my uncle) who lost everthing in the south and was given one house and five dunums
Of land despite having at least 20 times that amount in the south.
could now through hard work buy a fleet of them if he wanted to, and has brought his son an x6

He also told te gcs that came to see their old house that whenever they are ready they can come and he will return their house- as it has always been theirs

So i really don't understand where your coming from?

It means those living in Cyprus man, in the occupied tsk tsk tsk...
Not your girlfriend in LONDON!

[Hermes]

Yeah it was casual as I was answering a fascist I don't have much time for them.

As for your account of what happened, it's an absolute myopic ill informed joke of an analysis-

So much so I can't be bothered to answer it.

Thank god for that. It saves me the trouble of having to read it.

[DTA]

When you asked me what I thought of my people I honestly took it to mean my people in general, that's why I answered.

As for my people with mercedes and bmws- what does that mean?

My girlfriend drives a BMW - she is a lawyer
Her dad drives one he is a dentist
My dads cousin's husband (who i call my uncle) who lost everthing in the south and was given one house and five dunums
Of land despite having at least 20 times that amount in the south.
could now through hard work buy a fleet of them if he wanted to, and has brought his son an x6

He also told te gcs that came to see their old house that whenever they are ready they can come and he will return their house- as it has always been theirs

So i really don't understand where your coming from?

It means those living in Cyprus man, in the occupied tsk tsk tsk...
Not your girlfriend in LONDON!

My girlfriend is a lawyer in Cyprus, she drives a BMW in Cyprus so????

[DTA]

I know for a fact there were tcs post 74 that were forced from their homes at gunpoint by gc/ Greek solders - so the whole dentash threatened to kill anyone that didnt move north is bullshit propaganda that you have obviously brought into.

As for it starting in the 50s - yeah well we didnt fancy joining Greece - we were not down with them - but we agreed to share the island with the gcs in 1960. And that lasted 3 years.

Hence my comment from 1963- you see it all makes sense if you take of the blinkers.

What do you mean post 1974? When exactly? In August, in September October,November December?
Do you at least know when exactly about half the Kibrisli population moved North? Man we are talking for 60-70000 people here, do you know or just just spout hearsay stories? And since you talk about threads at gunpoint there should have been some who refused and were killed. How many where they and WHEN??

One member of my family and a member of my girlfriends family told me that happened, im going to believe them before you. Also when I posed this question on the board before other tcs came forward and said that knew of others who experienced the same thing. But I guess none of that is good enough for you, so step up and prove it was dentash who threatened people and made them move north.

60-70,000 people did not move at gun point and I can prove it to you, therefore it is you who throws away bullshit propaganda and avoids even telling us when exactly the few people he knows have moved.
Answer the questions I asked before, if you want me to continue.

Where did I say that ALL 70,000 tcs that left the south had to do it at gun point?

I can also prove that the 140-000 200,000 gc did not ALL leave at gun point. So your point is?

[Viewpoint]

I dont see it that way its assimilation which ever way we go.

It's that attitude that will doom the T/Cs. You face assimilation and certain irrelevance and extinction under Turkish military rule. No way back. Once the T/Cs are gone, they're gone. Finito. Has the dodo come back? No chance.

In a partnership state with the G/Cs the kibrislis still have a chance because they'll be living in an EU state with all the rights and protections of EU law. Rights guaranteed by EU law. With a political and economic stake in the island's future.

Now which do you think promises the better option of long-term survival? Only a dumbo will answer 'Turkey'.

Thats your personal opinion and not a fact...the EU laws will in noway stop assimilation into the GC majority, please point out what the differences would be between if you can that would stop assimilation?

Laws against discrimination won't in themselves ensure the survival of the T/Cs. T/Cs will have to become viable partners to flourish as a successful community in Cyprus. They'll have to work hard and compete in order to thrive. It won't be easy. But at least they'll get a chance.

For a start they'll have a political stake in a unified state, a say in the running of the country and a degree of autonomy. Plus there's going to be a lot of wealth and opportunities in the energy and shipping sectors if predictions are true and Cyprus becomes an important energy hub to Europe.

Now if you can't make a go of it from that basis then you don't deserve to survive. Don't wait too long to decide though...

What's the choice? In the north, the T/Cs have voted with their feet and left the island in droves. Can you blame them? Do the majority of T/Cs have any say in the running of the north's affairs? What future has Turkey offered them? Isolation, marginilisation, corruption, more settlers and the destruction of their culture. That's the reality.

What you offer is to vague and general, the majority can manipulate and discriminate against a minority all under the flag of democracy add to this the very high level of mistrust between the two sides and you have a formula for disaster, there needs to be concrete guarantees and deterrents to make sure both side do not try to dominate or control the other. We have experienced very bad times with gcs and only over the past 37 years have we arrived at self worth and feeling of belonging and most of security.

[CBBB]

I dont see it that way its assimilation which ever way we go.

It's that attitude that will doom the T/Cs. You face assimilation and certain irrelevance and extinction under Turkish military rule. No way back. Once the T/Cs are gone, they're gone. Finito. Has the dodo come back? No chance.

In a partnership state with the G/Cs the kibrislis still have a chance because they'll be living in an EU state with all the rights and protections of EU law. Rights guaranteed by EU law. With a political and economic stake in the island's future.

Now which do you think promises the better option of long-term survival? Only a dumbo will answer 'Turkey'.

Thats your personal opinion and not a fact...the EU laws will in noway stop assimilation into the GC majority, please point out what the differences would be between if you can that would stop assimilation?

Laws against discrimination won't in themselves ensure the survival of the T/Cs. T/Cs will have to become viable partners to flourish as a successful community in Cyprus. They'll have to work hard and compete in order to thrive. It won't be easy. But at least they'll get a chance.

For a start they'll have a political stake in a unified state, a say in the running of the country and a degree of autonomy. Plus there's going to be a lot of wealth and opportunities in the energy and shipping sectors if predictions are true and Cyprus becomes an important energy hub to Europe.

Now if you can't make a go of it from that basis then you don't deserve to survive. Don't wait too long to decide though...

What's the choice? In the north, the T/Cs have voted with their feet and left the island in droves. Can you blame them? Do the majority of T/Cs have any say in the running of the north's affairs? What future has Turkey offered them? Isolation, marginilisation, corruption, more settlers and the destruction of their culture. That's the reality.

What you offer is to vague and general, the majority can manipulate and discriminate against a minority all under the flag of democracy add to this the very high level of mistrust between the two sides and you have a formula for disaster, there needs to be concrete guarantees and deterrents to make sure both side do not try to dominate or control the other. We have experienced very bad times with gcs and only over the past 37 years have we arrived at self worth and feeling of belonging and most of security.

What we offer may be vague, but isn't that better than the certainty of annihilation with Turkey?