Cyprus-Forum.com

[jahitty]

I never suggested a 2000 year old tradition should be eradicated, its part of your heritage, I respect that deeply, i said tame and debate it'S role more ferociously. For TC's to accept reduced rights would be a serious paradigm shift, im an exception along with a few others.

You may or may not be right about an exagerrated feeling of insecurity about the church, yes its part Turkish propoganda, part historical memories and part genuine minority concerns. There are a number of small parties that are talking about this but im afraid if it takes hold then it will require some time, something we dont have much of.

[Kikapu]

I never suggested a 2000 year old tradition should be eradicated, its part of your heritage, I respect that deeply, i said tame and debate it'S role more ferociously. For TC's to accept reduced rights would be a serious paradigm shift, im an exception along with a few others.

You may or may not be right about an exagerrated feeling of insecurity about the church, yes its part Turkish propoganda, part historical memories and part genuine minority concerns. There are a number of small parties that are talking about this but im afraid if it takes hold then it will require some time, something we dont have much of.

Jahitty, I'm confused. Are you talking about TCs accepting less rights in the future than what they had in the 1960 agreements, which they had more rights than the GCs, or are you talking about that the TCs should accept less rights than the GCs in the future settlement. I hope it's the former and not the latter that you are talking about. In any case, just for the record, the TCs are not asked to have less rights than the GCs in the future, but for them to have Equal Rights with the GCs and ALL Cypriots in the Federal Cyprus.

[antifon]

I agree with your Kurdish thesis and yes this debate hasnt got off the ground in the TC community except within various smaller left wing parties such as YKP.

The most interesting question is 'why'? Why not in Turkey? Why not among the tCypriot community?

My answer is:
[a] serious lack of democracy
[b] an environment of fear
Neither is a surprise for anyone following closely Turkish politics & the situation in the occupied areas.

My questions to all are:
[a] Why do we, and the international community, allow Turkey to assume the moral high ground in Cyprus and preach solutions for a problem not dissimilar to the one she has been unable to solve since the 1920s, with unimaginable, unabated pain and suffering!?
[b] is the tCypriot society being hypocritical in failing to address and take positions on Turkey's Kurdish issue?
[c] do tCypriots feel that such a comparison simply does not suit their own ill-thought interests & what they perceive as already secured rights since 1960?

The fact is gCypriots [I bet my life on this] would be willing to grant tCypriots all the community level rights that Turkey would be willing to grant her ethnic minority community of Kurds.

This alone demonstrates no hypocrisy & no ulterior motives on the gCypriots' part. Despite their "religious" and conservative inclinations, allow me to add. The church factor, Jahitty et al, is a non-factor in Cypriot rapprochement! It only serves the various foreign propaganda machines operating in favor of their own interests in Cyprus.

I sincerely believe the ball is in tCypriots' court alone.

I never suggested a 2000 year old tradition should be eradicated,

I did make it sound that you did, didn't I? Sorry.

yes its part Turkish propoganda, part historical memories and part genuine minority concerns.

I understand the first part. For the rest tCypriots have to be specific so that concerns can be addressed. In general the gCypriot church encourages the people to not forget our 'lost' lands but in no way does it encourage an armed struggle or hatred against tCypriots. In the gCypriot mind the enemy is Turkey, its military and ill-thought, self-serving strategy on Cyprus. The tCypriots are grouped in two main categories where the 80-20 rule applies: the victims & the vultures, the latter being the willing puppets of the Turkish occupier.

[jahitty]

My questions to all are:
[a] Why do we, and the international community, allow Turkey to assume the moral high ground in Cyprus and preach solutions for a problem not dissimilar to the one she has been unable to solve since the 1920s, with unimaginable, unabated pain and suffering!?
[b] is the tCypriot society being hypocritical in failing to address and take positions on Turkey's Kurdish issue?
[c] do tCypriots feel that such a comparison simply does not suit their own ill-thought interests & what they perceive as already secured rights since 1960?

a) The usual lack of Pandering to the politically correct EU liberals, principles/honesty/ego/economics/Fear of losing geo-strategic influence/
b) Yes majority are either hypocritical self serving intersts/shit scared/others see it as pragmatic to ignore/minority are brave enough like Zeki Besiktepeli/yasmine movement BKP/YKP that do stand side by side with kurds. Zeki Besiktepeli for eg has used the kurdish comparison on numerous occasions. Overall the majority are scared of Turkish reaction.
c) Majority are scared to openly discuss. Not sure about feelings towards 1960's rights...dont know what current thinking on this is.
By the way, i was labelled along with my freinds as terrorists for sharing these kinds of ideas, it was especially damaging to my friends' careers. But we werent suprised.....

Jahitty, I'm confused. Are you talking about TCs accepting less rights in the future than what they had in the 1960 agreements, which they had more rights than the GCs, or are you talking about that the TCs should accept less rights than the GCs in the future settlement. I hope it's the former and not the latter that you are talking about. In any case, just for the record, the TCs are not asked to have less rights than the GCs in the future, but for them to have Equal Rights with the GCs and ALL Cypriots in the Federal Cyprus.

I was referring to the former, i am happy with equal rights with all GC's and ALL cypriots in a federal Cyprus. With a fair constitution built on solid democratic principles and with a reform of education based on objective history, empathy, cultrual understanding with a strong 'pan cyprian' focus.

[antifon]

Yes majority are either hypocritical self serving intersts/shit scared/others see it as pragmatic to ignore

it was especially damaging to my friends' careers

Let's think how we can more effectively expose Turkish hypocrisy in western circles & establish a healthy public debate on the principles to be applied for addressing the needs/fears/concerns/ rights of ethnic minority communities in countries where they faced/face the wrath, real or perceived, of the majority.

Turkey must choose a set of principles and stick to it!