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The ‘problem of Turkey’ in Cyprus by LEVENT KÖKER

How can we solve it? (keep it civilized)

Postby antifon » Tue Mar 15, 2011 3:36 pm

Tim Drayton wrote:
antifon wrote:
BirKibrisli wrote:
antifon wrote:
BirKibrisli wrote:Tim is right of course,as usual...There is no organic link with Zaman and the AKP...Zaman is the instrument of the "Movement" started by Fethullah Gulen and was for a long time opposed to certain policies of the AKP...Gulen lives in America and with the aid of a lot of 'deciples' runs a multinational empire built on media interests and educational institutions all around the world...Neither Islamists nor Secularists in Turkey trust this person,because he tries to walk the middle ground,and reportedly has strong links with the American establishment,including the Republican Party and the CIA...

Recently there has been a thawing in the Gulen AKP/Erdogan relations,and there is talk that Erdogan is paving the way for Gulen's return to Turkey.(He couldn't return till now because he was charged with sedition or some such threat by the previous government prosecutors)...
Gulen movement supposedly believe in inter faith and inter ethnic and racial dialogue,and this article might be a timely reminder to the AKP that Gulen has his own ideas about the Cyprus problem...



Care to share Gulen's Cyprus thinking?
.


Unfortunately I am not privy to Gulen's thoughts on Cyprus...And I'd rather not speculate..It is safe to assume that Gulen is trying to influence the AKP on Cyprob...His motives are not so clear,to me at least...



I recently read a rather detailed analysis on the Gulen movement in western media. If I find it I will send it to you. I believe I would remember if Cyprus was at all mentioned.
.


Perhaps this one?:

http://www.meforum.org/2045/fethullah-g ... d-ambition



Thanks, will read. However the one I had seen was an analysis from a major western publication. I will find it.
.
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Postby Tim Drayton » Tue Mar 15, 2011 3:54 pm

antifon wrote:
Tim Drayton wrote:
antifon wrote:
BirKibrisli wrote:
antifon wrote:
BirKibrisli wrote:Tim is right of course,as usual...There is no organic link with Zaman and the AKP...Zaman is the instrument of the "Movement" started by Fethullah Gulen and was for a long time opposed to certain policies of the AKP...Gulen lives in America and with the aid of a lot of 'deciples' runs a multinational empire built on media interests and educational institutions all around the world...Neither Islamists nor Secularists in Turkey trust this person,because he tries to walk the middle ground,and reportedly has strong links with the American establishment,including the Republican Party and the CIA...

Recently there has been a thawing in the Gulen AKP/Erdogan relations,and there is talk that Erdogan is paving the way for Gulen's return to Turkey.(He couldn't return till now because he was charged with sedition or some such threat by the previous government prosecutors)...
Gulen movement supposedly believe in inter faith and inter ethnic and racial dialogue,and this article might be a timely reminder to the AKP that Gulen has his own ideas about the Cyprus problem...



Care to share Gulen's Cyprus thinking?
.


Unfortunately I am not privy to Gulen's thoughts on Cyprus...And I'd rather not speculate..It is safe to assume that Gulen is trying to influence the AKP on Cyprob...His motives are not so clear,to me at least...



I recently read a rather detailed analysis on the Gulen movement in western media. If I find it I will send it to you. I believe I would remember if Cyprus was at all mentioned.
.


Perhaps this one?:

http://www.meforum.org/2045/fethullah-g ... d-ambition



Thanks, will read. However the one I had seen was an analysis from a major western publication. I will find it.
.


This is from the Middle East Quarterly (MEQ), a peer reviewed quarterly journal and publication of the American conservative think tank Middle East Forum - I would have said that this is fairly major.

I would draw your attention to the following, with reference to the court action that granted him permanent residence in the USA:

"Two former CIA officials, George Fidas and Graham Fuller, and former U.S. ambassador to Turkey Morton Abramowitz also supplied references."

As Boomerang rightly says, the CIA appears to be using Gülen, and the question must be to what end.
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Postby antifon » Tue Mar 15, 2011 3:56 pm

antifon wrote:
Tim Drayton wrote:
antifon wrote:
BirKibrisli wrote:
antifon wrote:
BirKibrisli wrote:Tim is right of course,as usual...There is no organic link with Zaman and the AKP...Zaman is the instrument of the "Movement" started by Fethullah Gulen and was for a long time opposed to certain policies of the AKP...Gulen lives in America and with the aid of a lot of 'deciples' runs a multinational empire built on media interests and educational institutions all around the world...Neither Islamists nor Secularists in Turkey trust this person,because he tries to walk the middle ground,and reportedly has strong links with the American establishment,including the Republican Party and the CIA...

Recently there has been a thawing in the Gulen AKP/Erdogan relations,and there is talk that Erdogan is paving the way for Gulen's return to Turkey.(He couldn't return till now because he was charged with sedition or some such threat by the previous government prosecutors)...
Gulen movement supposedly believe in inter faith and inter ethnic and racial dialogue,and this article might be a timely reminder to the AKP that Gulen has his own ideas about the Cyprus problem...



Care to share Gulen's Cyprus thinking?
.


Unfortunately I am not privy to Gulen's thoughts on Cyprus...And I'd rather not speculate..It is safe to assume that Gulen is trying to influence the AKP on Cyprob...His motives are not so clear,to me at least...



I recently read a rather detailed analysis on the Gulen movement in western media. If I find it I will send it to you. I believe I would remember if Cyprus was at all mentioned.
.


Perhaps this one?:

http://www.meforum.org/2045/fethullah-g ... d-ambition



Thanks, will read. However the one I had seen was an analysis from a major western publication. I will find it.
.



Found it!
http://www.tnr.com/article/world/magazi ... dium=email

It was free content still when I ran into it, via The Economist I believe. I guess you could burn the 2-week free subscription to read it.
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Postby BirKibrisli » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:32 am

Tim Drayton wrote:
BirKibrisli wrote:Tim is right of course,as usual...There is no organic link with Zaman and the AKP...Zaman is the instrument of the "Movement" started by Fethullah Gulen and was for a long time opposed to certain policies of the AKP...Gulen lives in America and with the aid of a lot of 'deciples' runs a multinational empire built on media interests and educational institutions all around the world...Neither Islamists nor Secularists in Turkey trust this person,because he tries to walk the middle ground,and reportedly has strong links with the American establishment,including the Republican Party and the CIA...

Recently there has been a thawing in the Gulen AKP/Erdogan relations,and there is talk that Erdogan is paving the way for Gulen's return to Turkey.(He couldn't return till now because he was charged with sedition or some such threat by the previous government prosecutors)...
Gulen movement supposedly believe in inter faith and inter ethnic and racial dialogue,and this article might be a timely reminder to the AKP that Gulen has his own ideas about the Cyprus problem...


This movement really goes back to Sheik Saidi Nursi, aka Bediuzzaman, does it not?



Yes,Tim...Here is an alarmist article on Gulen and his movement...I am still not decided on his motives,but today anyone who dares to publish a book or article on Gulen in Turkey finds himself at Silivri Prison charged with Ergenekon related crimes against the state...


Gülen's Background
Born in Erzurum, Turkey, in 1942, Fethullah Gülen is an imam who considers himself a prophet.[4] An enigmatic figure, many in the West applaud him as a reformist and advocate for tolerance,[5] a catalyst of "moderate Islam" for Turkey and beyond. He is praised in the West, especially in the United States, as an intellectual, scholar, and educator[6] even though his formal education is limited to five years of elementary school. After receiving an imam-preacher certificate, he served as an imam, first in Erdirne and later in Izmir. In 1971, the Turkish security service arrested him for clandestine religious activities, such as running illegal summer camps to indoctrinate youths, and was, from that time on, occasionally harassed by the staunchly secular military.[7] In 1981, he formally retired from his post as a local preacher.

To build an image as a proponent of interfaith dialogue, Gülen met Pope John Paul II, other Christian clergy, and Jewish rabbis[8] and emphasizes the commonalities unifying Abrahamic religions. He presents himself and his movement as the modern-day version of tolerant, liberal Anatolian Sufism and has used the literature of great Sufi thinkers such as Jalal ad-Din Rumi and Yunus Emre, pretending to share their moderate teachings.[9] Quotes from their teachings adorn Fethullah's Gülen's propaganda material. The movement, its proxy organizations, and universities—including Georgetown, to which it donates money—hold conferences in the United States and Europe to discuss Gülen. In October 2007, the British House of Lords feted Gülen with a conference in his honor.

Gülen was a student and follower of Sheikh Sa'id-i Kurdi (1878-1960), also known as Sa'id-i Nursi, the founder of the Islamist Nur (light) movement.[10] After Turkey's war of independence, Kurdi demanded, in an address to the new parliament, that the new republic be based on Islamic principles. He turned against Atatürk and his reforms and against the new modern, secular, Western republic.

In 1998, Gülen departed for the United States, reportedly to receive medical treatment for diabetes. However, his absence also enabled Gülen to escape questioning on his indictment in 2000 for allegedly promoting insurrection in Turkey in a series of secretly-recorded sermons. Since his voluntary exile, Gülen has resided on a large, rural estate in eastern Pennsylvania, together with about 100 followers, who guard him and tend to his needs. These servants are educated men who wear suits and ties and do not look like traditional Islamists in cloaks and turbans. They follow their hocaefendi's orders and even refrain from marrying until age fifty per his instructions. When they do marry, their spouses are expected to dress in the Islamic manner, as dictated by Gülen himself.[11] It is from his U.S. base that Gülen has built his fame and his transnational empire.





http://www.meforum.org/2045/fethullah-g ... d-ambition
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Postby BirKibrisli » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:46 am

oopsss.....Beaten by the gong I see... :)
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Postby Tim Drayton » Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:59 am

BirKibrisli wrote:[...] but today anyone who dares to publish a book or article on Gulen in Turkey finds himself at Silivri Prison charged with Ergenekon related crimes against the state...


Or, in the case of Ahmet Şik, for being caught red-handed in the process of writing a book about Gülen and his movement which has not yet been finished let alone published!
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Postby DTA » Wed Mar 16, 2011 12:17 pm

Tim Drayton wrote:
BirKibrisli wrote:[...] but today anyone who dares to publish a book or article on Gulen in Turkey finds himself at Silivri Prison charged with Ergenekon related crimes against the state...


Or, in the case of Ahmet Şik, for being caught red-handed in the process of writing a book about Gülen and his movement which has not yet been finished let alone published!


Tim really good to see you back by the way.
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Postby Tim Drayton » Wed Mar 16, 2011 12:40 pm

DTA wrote:
Tim Drayton wrote:
BirKibrisli wrote:[...] but today anyone who dares to publish a book or article on Gulen in Turkey finds himself at Silivri Prison charged with Ergenekon related crimes against the state...


Or, in the case of Ahmet Şik, for being caught red-handed in the process of writing a book about Gülen and his movement which has not yet been finished let alone published!


Tim really good to see you back by the way.


Thanks. I am not really back, this is just an illusion.
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Postby Jerry » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:09 pm

DTA wrote:
Tim Drayton wrote:
BirKibrisli wrote:[...] but today anyone who dares to publish a book or article on Gulen in Turkey finds himself at Silivri Prison charged with Ergenekon related crimes against the state...


Or, in the case of Ahmet Şik, for being caught red-handed in the process of writing a book about Gülen and his movement which has not yet been finished let alone published!


Tim really good to see you back by the way.


Yes, it's quite refreshing to see you posting again. CF could do with a few more "Tims" who can make useful contributions to the debates rather than the nutters whose meaningless jibes take over every topic.
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Postby BirKibrisli » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:34 pm

Tim Drayton wrote:
BirKibrisli wrote:[...] but today anyone who dares to publish a book or article on Gulen in Turkey finds himself at Silivri Prison charged with Ergenekon related crimes against the state...


Or, in the case of Ahmet Şik, for being caught red-handed in the process of writing a book about Gülen and his movement which has not yet been finished let alone published!


Indeed! :(
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