Cyprus-Forum.com

[DTA]

again what tsunami? you are becoming tiresome

A set of successive political developments, international, Turkish and Cypriot, with dire repercussions for the comfort and sustainability of your "status quo".
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Like what? what are your reasons for your beliefs or sources of information?

well?

[antifon]

again what tsunami? you are becoming tiresome

A set of successive political developments, international, Turkish and Cypriot, with dire repercussions for the comfort and sustainability of your "status quo".
.

Like what? what are your reasons for your beliefs or sources of information?

well?

DTA, are you my enemy of my friend?
.

[antifon]

anti you are a moron.

I am different than all of you, therefore you must be right!
.

Thank you. You are not only a moron but should go see professional help.

I agree. Acknowledging the problem they say is 50% of the battle.
Care to recommend your shrink?
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I dont use one but I know a few but im sure they would institutionalize you immediately.

Sorry to disappoint you but I am already institutionalized. Thank God they have wi-fi. You should see me in the white robe. I look spiffy.

Anyway, thanks for the diagnosis & trying to help. I hope your leaders' decisions will be just as insightful. In fact, I know they will be. And I thank them in advance for it.
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[Mapko]

Not a very happy bunch because their Sugar Daddy is pulling the plug on their spending (and that's the ONLY reason they're not happy):

http://www.voanews.com/english/news/Nor ... 17358.html

Bye-bye Turk 'Cypriot', hello Turk:

http://www.prio.no/upload/Is%20the%20Tu ... inking.pdf

http://famagusta-gazette.com/settlers-i ... 411-69.htm

"Demographics
CensusesNorthern Cyprus's first official census was performed in 1996. The population of the country was 200,587. The 2nd census, carried out in 2006, revealed the population of Northern Cyprus to be 265,100, of which majority is composed of indigenous Turkish Cypriots, with the rest including a large number of settlers from Turkey. Of the 178,000 Turkish Cypriot citizens, 82% are native Cypriots (145,000). Of the 45,000 people born to non- Cypriot parentage, nearly 40% (17,000) were born in Cyprus. The figure for non-citizens, including students, guest workers and temporary residents stood at 78,000 people. The population of Northern Cyprus' cities are: North Nicosia: 85,579; Famagusta: 64,269; Kyrenia: 62,158; Morphou: 31,116; Trikomo: 21,978.

EstimatesEstimates by the Government of Northern Cyprus: The 1983 population of Northern Cyprus was 155,521. Estimates by the government of the Republic of Cyprus from 2001 place the population at 200,000, of which 80-89,000 are Turkish Cypriots and 109,000-117,000 Turkish settlers. An island-wide census in 1960 indicated the number of Turkish Cypriots as 102,000 and Greek Cypriots as 450,000. Estimates state that 36,000 (about 1/3) Turkish Cypriots emigrated in the period 1975-1995, with the consequence that within Northern Cyprus the native Turkish Cypriots have been outnumbered by settlers from Turkey.

Northern Cyprus is almost entirely Turkish speaking. English, however, is widely spoken as a second language."

"Turkish settlersAs a result of the Turkish invasion, the Parliamentary Assembly of the Council of Europe, stated that the demographic structure of the island has been continuously modified as a result of the deliberate policies of the Turks. Despite the lack of consensus on the exact figures, all parties concerned admit that Turkish nationals have been systematically arriving in the northern part of the island. Some suggest, that over 120,000 settlers were brought into Cyprus from mainland Turkey. This was despite Article 49 of the Geneva Convention stating that "The Occupying Power shall not deport or transfer parts of its own civilian population into the territory it occupies."

UN Resolution 1987/19 (1987) of the "Sub-Commission On Prevention Of Discrimination And Protection Of Minorities" which was adopted on 2 September 1987 demanded "the full restoration of all human rights to the whole population of Cyprus, including the freedom of movement, the freedom of settlement and the right to property" and also expressed "its concern also at the policy and practice of the implantation of settlers in the occupied territories of Cyprus which constitute a form of colonialism and attempt to change illegally the demographic structure of Cyprus".

In a report prepared by Mete Hatay on behalf of PRIO, the Oslo peace center, it was estimated that the number of Turkish mainlanders in the north who have been granted the right to vote is 37,000. This figure however excludes mainlanders who are married to Turkish Cypriots or adult children of Mainland Settlers as well as all minors. The report also estimates the number of Turkish mainlanders who have not been granted the right to vote, whom it labels as "transients", at a further 105,000."

[B25]

Can you ever post without implied or direct military threats, or the use of military jargon? I wonder why that is.

We are bright enough to know we cannot defeat you militarily. We are also bright enough to appreciate that your military advantage is more of a liability in EU Cyprus, growing with every passing day.

Let me remind you the words of your own Turkish Foreign Ministry [I trust you permit me calling him yours as I do agree the annexation is imminent; I personally look forward to it with great anticipation] Undersecretary Feridun Sinirlioğlu in a meeting with the State Department's Undersecretary William Burns on February 18, 2010:

“membership makes them [Cyprus Republic] invulnerable”

Indeed, for anyone who understands International Relations 101 material!


But what's even more incomprehensible to you is that we would not wish to fight you even if we were superior militarily.

We have a task at hand. To regain what is ours, by history and by law. And to give back what is not. More importantly to set up a system that will allow all Cypriots to move on on a fair and European basis.

We will use legal, financial and political means to achieve our goal, backed by our accumulated wisdom in negotiations and understanding where you come from and how you think. Also, equipped with knowledge about the home ground of our enemy, Turkey, and the double standards she uses to promote her "strategic interests" in Cyprus and her Turkish, narrowly speaking, interests at home.

All the above, along with support of our allies in the EU and the region, and let me add the some old-fashioned common sense, should be enough to:

- deny Turkey the right to assume the moral high ground
- get the application of UN resolutions in Cyprus the soonest possible
- build trust with those tCypriots willing to build alongside us
- undo the damage of 1974 in a gradual and sensitive manner
- define the structure of the RoC v2.0 [a 1963 adjusted for the EU reality]
- focus our attention on challenges any normal society faces
.

This is the best post you've written so far. Particularly the part about building trust with TCs. Do you not think this will be a lot easier to achieve with a much better final result, if we work on this aspect rather than being hostile and aggressive in our approaches?

Thank you for going out on a limb. I am afraid I will be disappointing you.

I know Cyprus extremely well. I spent time to understand Turkey. In my younger days I also met many tCypriots at various bi-communal events. My "wisdom" is the culminating synthesis of all these experiences and knowledge and I am more stubborn than any Karpaz donkey has ever been in knowing that I am right for the way forward. As such, I consider certain things not part of a CF negotiation.

I have conditions for engaging because I value my time & winning friends, either g's or t's, is not truly, an objective of mine, rather a welcome byproduct if it happens. Discussing for the sake of discussion is pointless, certainly the case at the UN, and we should not make it the case here. Best stick with the one liners, often successful, which, for me take the pressure off the day and the numerous business e-mails and telephone calls I make on a daily basis.


These are my conditions:

First, the only reason we even speak of a BBF is because of an unwarranted war that brought division. It is not acceptable as a basis. I am arrogant enough to suggest that on this point I represent better the will of gCypriots than our politicians who are justifiably bound by realities. The very idea that we have to agree a proposed solution separately is disgusting.

Second, 1963 was a set of forward looking ideas which would safeguard the interests of the tCypriot Community, while ensuring that the smooth functioning and development of the country would neither be prejudiced or thwarted. We must agree to revisit these ideas, adopt their spirit, and bring them up to EU-date. I take it for granted that we agree the 1960 "rights" for the tCypriots were ludicrous and must be severely trimmed. We are not equal at the community level, other than at the individual level, though I recognize that for a limited number of well defined matters the question of veto must exist.

These are my conditions for moderating my verbal, often uncontrolled, aggressiveness, and even then my arrogant style will pop up when least expected. Engaging knowing ex ante that you consider 1960 EQUALITY & 1974 DIVISION enshrined & the big-bang of your negotiating position is all I need to know to deny your kind offer/suggestion to proceed in non aggressive ways. Let me at least have some fun!

Else I really have nothing to say to you & it is not personal. I will respond to your posts but my audience won't be you & my objective will be nothing more but to make a dull or stressful day slightly better, while at the same time reminding fellow tCypriots how we feel. The regular gCypriot Joe.

I have no desire in making you feel better, or trust me more. I have many who do & see no reason why I should try harder with you. This moaning of yours just has to stop. It has been 50 years already! If you want to complain I can find out and suggest psychologists who can help you overcome events which transpired in the early 60s, when as we are recently finding out more and more the Turkeyish/tCypriot role was more conniving and duplicitous than the gCypriots' ever was.

Our mission should be to move forward as Cypriots, and rid ourselves of Turkey to the same extend as we have rid ourselves of Greece. Even better to fire all the guarantors and sue them for a job horribly done. In fact, I would personally like to see no Greek or Turkish flag at any public institution. Individuals can wave them to death.

However, since I doubt any tCypriot can yet see eye to eye with me on the above I shall press on this lonely path until the tsunami hits.
.

Lonely??? I'm right beside you

Same here. And there are thousands that echo your thoughts, keep up the good work.

But I don't believe you are only 19 though

[antifon]

Can you ever post without implied or direct military threats, or the use of military jargon? I wonder why that is.

We are bright enough to know we cannot defeat you militarily. We are also bright enough to appreciate that your military advantage is more of a liability in EU Cyprus, growing with every passing day.

Let me remind you the words of your own Turkish Foreign Ministry [I trust you permit me calling him yours as I do agree the annexation is imminent; I personally look forward to it with great anticipation] Undersecretary Feridun Sinirlioğlu in a meeting with the State Department's Undersecretary William Burns on February 18, 2010:

“membership makes them [Cyprus Republic] invulnerable”

Indeed, for anyone who understands International Relations 101 material!


But what's even more incomprehensible to you is that we would not wish to fight you even if we were superior militarily.

We have a task at hand. To regain what is ours, by history and by law. And to give back what is not. More importantly to set up a system that will allow all Cypriots to move on on a fair and European basis.

We will use legal, financial and political means to achieve our goal, backed by our accumulated wisdom in negotiations and understanding where you come from and how you think. Also, equipped with knowledge about the home ground of our enemy, Turkey, and the double standards she uses to promote her "strategic interests" in Cyprus and her Turkish, narrowly speaking, interests at home.

All the above, along with support of our allies in the EU and the region, and let me add the some old-fashioned common sense, should be enough to:

- deny Turkey the right to assume the moral high ground
- get the application of UN resolutions in Cyprus the soonest possible
- build trust with those tCypriots willing to build alongside us
- undo the damage of 1974 in a gradual and sensitive manner
- define the structure of the RoC v2.0 [a 1963 adjusted for the EU reality]
- focus our attention on challenges any normal society faces
.

This is the best post you've written so far. Particularly the part about building trust with TCs. Do you not think this will be a lot easier to achieve with a much better final result, if we work on this aspect rather than being hostile and aggressive in our approaches?

Thank you for going out on a limb. I am afraid I will be disappointing you.

I know Cyprus extremely well. I spent time to understand Turkey. In my younger days I also met many tCypriots at various bi-communal events. My "wisdom" is the culminating synthesis of all these experiences and knowledge and I am more stubborn than any Karpaz donkey has ever been in knowing that I am right for the way forward. As such, I consider certain things not part of a CF negotiation.

I have conditions for engaging because I value my time & winning friends, either g's or t's, is not truly, an objective of mine, rather a welcome byproduct if it happens. Discussing for the sake of discussion is pointless, certainly the case at the UN, and we should not make it the case here. Best stick with the one liners, often successful, which, for me take the pressure off the day and the numerous business e-mails and telephone calls I make on a daily basis.


These are my conditions:

First, the only reason we even speak of a BBF is because of an unwarranted war that brought division. It is not acceptable as a basis. I am arrogant enough to suggest that on this point I represent better the will of gCypriots than our politicians who are justifiably bound by realities. The very idea that we have to agree a proposed solution separately is disgusting.

Second, 1963 was a set of forward looking ideas which would safeguard the interests of the tCypriot Community, while ensuring that the smooth functioning and development of the country would neither be prejudiced or thwarted. We must agree to revisit these ideas, adopt their spirit, and bring them up to EU-date. I take it for granted that we agree the 1960 "rights" for the tCypriots were ludicrous and must be severely trimmed. We are not equal at the community level, other than at the individual level, though I recognize that for a limited number of well defined matters the question of veto must exist.

These are my conditions for moderating my verbal, often uncontrolled, aggressiveness, and even then my arrogant style will pop up when least expected. Engaging knowing ex ante that you consider 1960 EQUALITY & 1974 DIVISION enshrined & the big-bang of your negotiating position is all I need to know to deny your kind offer/suggestion to proceed in non aggressive ways. Let me at least have some fun!

Else I really have nothing to say to you & it is not personal. I will respond to your posts but my audience won't be you & my objective will be nothing more but to make a dull or stressful day slightly better, while at the same time reminding fellow tCypriots how we feel. The regular gCypriot Joe.

I have no desire in making you feel better, or trust me more. I have many who do & see no reason why I should try harder with you. This moaning of yours just has to stop. It has been 50 years already! If you want to complain I can find out and suggest psychologists who can help you overcome events which transpired in the early 60s, when as we are recently finding out more and more the Turkeyish/tCypriot role was more conniving and duplicitous than the gCypriots' ever was.

Our mission should be to move forward as Cypriots, and rid ourselves of Turkey to the same extend as we have rid ourselves of Greece. Even better to fire all the guarantors and sue them for a job horribly done. In fact, I would personally like to see no Greek or Turkish flag at any public institution. Individuals can wave them to death.

However, since I doubt any tCypriot can yet see eye to eye with me on the above I shall press on this lonely path until the tsunami hits.
.

Lonely??? I'm right beside you

Same here. And there are thousands that echo your thoughts, keep up the good work.

But I don't believe you are only 19 though

Thanks again.
I am dyslexic!

[Viewpoint]

Hes a moron with no understanding of the Tcs whatsoever he is just another fanatic hell bent on turning the whole island in to a Greek island, which of course we will never allow.

[B25]

Hes a moron with no understanding of the Tcs whatsoever he is just another fanatic hell bent on turning the whole island in to a Greek island, which of course we will never allow.

And what are you?

You are his direct opposite

[Viewpoint]

Hes a moron with no understanding of the Tcs whatsoever he is just another fanatic hell bent on turning the whole island in to a Greek island, which of course we will never allow.

And what are you?

You are his direct opposite

An average TC, he is an extremist and wants maximal demands whereas i willing to share equally.

[antifon]

Hes a moron with no understanding of the Tcs whatsoever he is just another fanatic hell bent on turning the whole island in to a Greek island, which of course we will never allow.

And what are you?

You are his direct opposite

An average TC, he is an extremist and wants maximal demands whereas i willing to share equally.

That's the tragedy: "i [am] willing to share equally"

You can have 9%. Is that OK? That's an accurate reflection of the numbers of authentic tCypriots I believe today.
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