Cyprus-Forum.com

[Bananiot]

Okay, It's time to bid you good night, tomorrow is another day and in Nicosia town is very late right now.

[Simon]

Simon, are you aware of any important tactical mistakes the snobbish Italian generals made that cost them dearly?

There were many reasons Bananiot, as there always is when dealing with war. Read below:

General Sebastiano Visconti Prasca, in his memoirs, attributes the failure of the campaign mainly to poor organization, personal agendas, corruption and lack of cooperation among the top ranks of Italy's Armed Forces. Prasca compared the stubborn Greek resistance in Epirus with that of the Turks in the Dardanelles in World War I.[49] At the same time, however, Prasca is considered one of those mainly responsible for underestimating the strength of the Greek Army, making inadequate plans and leading the Italian army to its blunder in the mountains of Epirus.[50] The Italian forces certainly faced tactical problems, being weaker in infantry, with only two regiments per division.[35] However the Italians were stronger in artillery and mortars than the Greeks, and enjoyed absolute superiority in air forces, which they did not manage to exploit properly. Poor motivation, as opposed to the Greeks, and the rough terrain of Epirus, which favoured the Greek defence, also played a role in the outcome.

However, the Italians failed primarily at a strategic level, i.e., at the level of Mussolini and the High Command. Barely a month before the invasion of Greece, on 1 October, Mussolini ordered the demobilization of half the Italian army, a measure accepted by the General Staff, although General Mario Roatta warned that much of the army would become unserviceable for many months.[20] In addition, the persistent underestimation of Greek preparedness doomed the campaign to failure from the start.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greco-Italian_War

[Cap]

I don't need to, statistics speak for themselves.

As for the Italians, from what I've read, many were against the invasion. They felt Greece was like a sister country. 'una faccia una razza' and REFUSED to fight the Greeks, some blatantly abandoning and deserting their positions and duties, some surrendering freely to the Greek armed forces and to this day many in Italy feel ashamed for their country's actions.

[AEKTZIS]

my mistake. u'll forgive me for not having my finger on the pulse of the finnish heavy-metal-historic-battle music scene; nor the associated, equally renowned serb-youtube-video-making scene...

I'll forgive you but only if you promise to check out the Finnish heavy metal historic battle music scene....you never know, you might find something you like.

[Get Real!]

I'll forgive you but only if you promise to check out the Finnish heavy metal historic battle music scene....you never know, you might find something you like.

Quit posting irrelevant shit in my CyProb threads!

And while you’re at it, get rid of that stupid gay tagline!

[AEKTZIS]

How about this?

I'll stop posting irrelevant shit in your topics when you stop having such an obsessive hatred for Greece. IF YOU ARE NOT GREEK, WHY THE FUCK ARE YOU SO INFATUATED WITH PROVING THAT GREEKS ARE NOT "GREEKS"...

And I will remove the tag if you delete 27027 posts of shit that spewed from your keyboard onto the internet.

[Get Real!]

How about this?

I'll stop posting irrelevant shit in your topics when you stop having such an obsessive hatred for Greece. IF YOU ARE NOT GREEK, WHY THE FUCK ARE YOU SO INFATUATED WITH PROVING THAT GREEKS ARE NOT "GREEKS"...

And I will remove the tag if you delete 27027 posts of shit that spewed from your keyboard onto the internet.

Re poushto eokavitoui, efies bou dame dioti an bo tsie golisso sou enna fkis aftomolos tsie enna bais sta dourgika!

Enge nasou xanabo!

[AEKTZIS]

den eimai eokavitoui, oute fasistas, xonepse to, eimai Ellinas.

Ellinas ths Kyprou gia sena dustuxws shmainei fasistas kai ethnikistis...den eipa pote oti yposthrizw thn eoka b.
Antithetws, pisteuw pws ftaine se megalo vathmo gia thn katastrofh ths kyprou kai diafwnw apolyta me thn tromokratia tous.

Thelane autoi na skotwsoun ton pappou mou to '73 efoson kathgorhse ton Sampson, kai epeidh o pappous mou htan aristeros.

[Paphitis]

Okay cap, let us see. Do you know, for a start, another country that celebrates the beginning of war rather than the end. Greece is the only one, in the whole world. Why is this, I wonder, do you have any answers?

Nothing like sheer stupidity to bring someone out of CF retirement Bananiot.

I am sure you're an intelligent man, but please do some research before you lead people down the wrong path.

So, Greek "Slavs" seem anachronistic to you, because they commemorate the first allied victory in WW11. Well, Australians and Kiwis must be equally anachronistic, because they too have their National Remembrance day on the very day the first ANZACs landed at ANZAC Cove at Gallipoli. This was the bloodiest day of the entire campaign where some 2,000 ANZACs fell in the space of a couple of hours. Also, the landing itself was a military blunder as the ANZACS landed on the wrong beach where Ottoman troops fortified the high ground above the landing ANZACs. But they fell as Australians and New Zealanders and 2 nations were born on the battlefields.

But this was the first military conquest under our very own national flag by our very own military but certainly not the first military campaign (Boer War - South Africa) Australians were involved in under a foreign (British) flag.

So Bananiot, it is my absolute pleasure that you should group Greek "Slavs" (do you nut cases think this term is offensive?) with Australia and New Zealand and our brave ANZACs. Allow me to wear this as badge of honour and also remind you of your utter stupidity!!

Australians and Kiwis will always respect Greece's military accomplishments. They did fight side by side, and so they did witness their sacrifices. Australians also witnessed their generosity, where mere peasants and shepherds would hide fleeing Aussie and Kiwi troops whilst under German occupation, and then escort them to the coast along with other retreating Greek and British forces, for evacuation to North Africa where they will live to fight another day. Yes, even to this present day, many Aussie veterans return to Crete in the hope of finding the families of the very people that had saved their lives.

They are our people Bananiot, and their sacrifice has been etched in our very short Australian history, and we are grateful. We love these Greek "Slavs" very much!!

Furthermore, Italy and Greece were both fascist countries when war broke out on october 28 1940. It was the case of one fascist fighting another fascist. The Greek army was well prepared for the Italian attack. Mobilisation started in secret from June 1940 and in October the Italians started an ill thought of campaign from badly equipped ports in Albania that could not keep up with the basic task of supplying an attacking army that was badly misinformed about the terrain that laid ahead. As one Italian soldier reported at the time "they promised us we would be in Athens by nightfall, for coffee, but nobody told us that between Albania and Athens stood a huge mountain range".

It was lucky for Greece and the allies that Greece was ruled by a "fascist" military leader, because as far as I am concerned, Greek Military Officers are the only persons even remotely capable of leading Greece and its people through such crisis. That is the way I feel about Greek and Cypriot politicians.

Still, the Greek soldiers fought bravely, but so did the Italian soldiers, under extremely difficult circumstances. What I object to is the supernatural tinge the nationalists give to the Greek soldier that triumphed despite fighting against all odds. This is a pathetic attempt that basically it is used to excuse later failures.

Indeed, the Italians fought bravely under difficult circumstances.

I am not one to degrade any nation's military exploits or say the Greek soldiers are better than Italian soldiers.

Many have a firm belief that Turkish troops are inferior. I don't believe this is true. If anything, I believe they are a bit better than ours. I don't believe that Cyprus has an adequately trained military. There certainly isn't any strong political leadership, and I also believe that if Cyprus or Greece is to face any major crisis such as that in Imia, or another Turkish Offensive, then for the sake of the very survival of both Greece and Cyprus, the Hellenic Armed Forces and the CNG should be prepared to form another Military Junta or Dictatorship. And I say this with a heavy heart, but I don't believe there is a single politician in Greece or Cyprus which can lead their respective countries through such crisis, and I don't say this on any bypartisan grounds. The same would hold true whether it is PASOK or New Democracy in power or whether AKEL, DIKO, or DISY were in power in Cyprus.

Turkey, will not hand back a single rock in Cyprus. This is the reality, and it is about time all Cypriots came to terms with this. Turkey, speaks only one language....

Please keep the bullshit in check because I really don't have the inclination to waste any more of my valuable time with such nonsense...

[Paphitis]

I agree. I'm the first to criticize Greece for its shortcomings but don't think for a second that I'm going to sit here and distort well documented historical facts for the purpose of furthering anybody's agenda.

Every nation on earth has some shortcommings Cap. We Cypriots have more than enough of our very own. Our conduct has not been worthy of the RoC nation. We damaged it, probably beyond any repair. When we recognise this fact, then we can also look at Greece, and their American and British backers and manipulators!

We did not behave in a dignified manner, and now, our political leadership will remove any precious dignity we did have...

You could be a Jew in Auschwitz, being marched to the Gas Chambers. But even in such a hopeless situation, most chose to die with their dignity intact. No matter what the Nazis did, they could not take away their dignity if they did not allow them to do so. We as Cypriots must never allow anyone to take away ours!!

There are some examples of undignified behavior in this thread from persons who should not be pointing the finger at anyone, not even the Americans or the British because they are not strong or smart enough to identify our very own shortcomings or weaknesses. To them, everyone else is to blame but us. Very unrealistic and totally wrong.