Cyprus-Forum.com

[boulio]

You haven't done your homework bulio, try again.

O yes i have just because i dont subscribe to the books you read dosent mean i have not.The acheson plan was terrible for cyprus and amazingly greece would have to also give up kastellorizo(funny how its in the news today concerning the EEZ IN THE EASTERN MEDITERANEAN)

Concerning the talks between clerides and dektash yes in hindsight they seem wonderful comapred to todays situatuion howver i believe that if the t/c got self govt in the form of seperate municipalites and enclaves it would just have lead to what we have today anyway.Dektash and the tmt would set up multiple basses on the island for the turkish army to land on at will.

[Bananiot]

Okay, let us be serious. I have no doubt that you are also interested in reaching the truth of what happened in the past and perhaps learn from our mistakes. My advice is, do not for one minute believe that the blame lies with one side only. Before 1974 we were calling the shots and we rejected anything less than outright "victory". We considered the Turks to be rather stupid and incapable of thinking straight. We went hell bent for the maximum gains, even when Greece was rules by the junta and we should have been doubly skeptical when we made a move (events at Kophinou). You see, even when the situation was pretty precarious, we still behaves extravagantly.

Now, the other side is on top. They call the shots. According to your logic, they are doing the right thing when they want the maximum. In fact they have more clout to achieve maximum gains than we had prior to 1974. Thus, we should not complain and turn cry babies, reporting the bad Turks to International Institutions, who are now turning a deaf ear, anyway.

[DT.]

You haven't done your homework bulio, try again.

O yes i have just because i dont subscribe to the books you read dosent mean i have not.The acheson plan was terrible for cyprus and amazingly greece would have to also give up kastellorizo(funny how its in the news today concerning the EEZ IN THE EASTERN MEDITERANEAN)

Concerning the talks between clerides and dektash yes in hindsight they seem wonderful comapred to todays situatuion howver i believe that if the t/c got self govt in the form of seperate municipalites and enclaves it would just have lead to what we have today anyway.Dektash and the tmt would set up multiple basses on the island for the turkish army to land on at will.

Thats exactly it boulio, some believe that rewarding the upper hand with an unfair deal that is an invite for further partition and possible bloodshed in the future is the way forward.

The anon plan was a recipe for disaster, dormant Turkish and Greek armies on the ground, a loose federation born out of "virgin birth" allowing either one of the 2 states to separate and remain on an equal political footing with the other state...ie leave the state of Cyprus for the GC statelet of united Cyprus, watch the referendum of the tc state and their split from the federation and bobs your uncle you've gone from state to community in a matter of years.

The fact is the position that Cyprus is in differs from the pessimistic drivel that some on this site spew day in day out. The defeats that Ankara has faced over the decades are testament that they are vulnerable. The fact that despite all efforts and all the awesome power that this regional superpower can master, Cyprus is still the only recognised govt on this island.

Despite this superpower the "trnc" is still not recognised by anyone.

Despite the superpower, 17 out of 20 chapters are blocked due to breaches against the Ankara protocol.

For an awesome superpower they sure seem to be getting pretty fed up with this minnow nuisance they can't seem to shake off. Bagis the other day spent an entire press conference cursing and spitting against those spoilt Greek Cypriots.....funny reaction from a superpower.

The fact also is however that Turkey, Greece and Cyprus hold enormous potential if relations between these 3 were ever to normalise. Potential that is to the benefit of all 3 countries. The sooner Turkey accepts the overly generous offers that have been made to her the sooner we can all get back to living our potential,

[Get Real!]

Before 1974 we were calling the shots and we rejected anything less than outright "victory". We considered the Turks to be rather stupid and incapable of thinking straight.

So what has changed? They're still stupid and incapable of thinking straight!

Btw, there must be Turk in you too Bananiot because I mostly find your opinion pretty dumb.

[boulio]

Okay, let us be serious. I have no doubt that you are also interested in reaching the truth of what happened in the past and perhaps learn from our mistakes. My advice is, do not for one minute believe that the blame lies with one side only. Before 1974 we were calling the shots and we rejected anything less than outright "victory". We considered the Turks to be rather stupid and incapable of thinking straight. We went hell bent for the maximum gains, even when Greece was rules by the junta and we should have been doubly skeptical when we made a move (events at Kophinou). You see, even when the situation was pretty precarious, we still behaves extravagantly.

Now, the other side is on top. They call the shots. According to your logic, they are doing the right thing when they want the maximum. In fact they have more clout to achieve maximum gains than we had prior to 1974. Thus, we should not complain and turn cry babies, reporting the bad Turks to International Institutions, who are now turning a deaf ear, anyway.

im being very serious,i never said the blame lies with only side but the majority of the blame lies with turkey.The UN resolutions are a testement to that.IF they are enforces is another story.With Cypriot entry into the EU Bananoit that was the game changer leverage has turned.wHO EXACTLEY IS TURNING A DEAF EAR ?Cyprus is handling her busines just fine internationally (EEZ WITH EGYPT,ISRAEL,LEBENON AND SOON WITH SYRIA)

HOW About the agreement that will be announced soon concerning SARS with Israel,That should sit well with the regional superpower.

Do you know what the problem is in my opinion,its not learnignfrom mistakes i think cypriots have done that i think its talking to these bozoz.If i was the cypriot govt i would sit down with all the political parties and prepare and present a BBF IF that is what the populous wants and giv it to the turkish side and the UN AND EU.A plan that takes into account all UNSC resolutions and EU principles and let the turks and Bagis spew whatever they want.

[Viewpoint]

Why dont the GCs do that then? All they do is blame the other side, reject any plan put before them and endlessly complain.

[All4114All]

Okay, let us be serious. I have no doubt that you are also interested in reaching the truth of what happened in the past and perhaps learn from our mistakes. My advice is, do not for one minute believe that the blame lies with one side only. Before 1974 we were calling the shots and we rejected anything less than outright "victory". We considered the Turks to be rather stupid and incapable of thinking straight. We went hell bent for the maximum gains, even when Greece was rules by the junta and we should have been doubly skeptical when we made a move (events at Kophinou). You see, even when the situation was pretty precarious, we still behaves extravagantly.

Now, the other side is on top. They call the shots. According to your logic, they are doing the right thing when they want the maximum. In fact they have more clout to achieve maximum gains than we had prior to 1974. Thus, we should not complain and turn cry babies, reporting the bad Turks to International Institutions, who are now turning a deaf ear, anyway.

im being very serious,i never said the blame lies with only side but the majority of the blame lies with turkey.The UN resolutions are a testement to that.IF they are enforces is another story.With Cypriot entry into the EU Bananoit that was the game changer leverage has turned.wHO EXACTLEY IS TURNING A DEAF EAR ?Cyprus is handling her busines just fine internationally (EEZ WITH EGYPT,ISRAEL,LEBENON AND SOON WITH SYRIA)

HOW About the agreement that will be announced soon concerning SARS with Israel,That should sit well with the regional superpower.

Do you know what the problem is in my opinion,its not learnignfrom mistakes i think cypriots have done that i think its talking to these bozoz.If i was the cypriot govt i would sit down with all the political parties and prepare and present a BBF IF that is what the populous wants and giv it to the turkish side and the UN AND EU.A plan that takes into account all UNSC resolutions and EU principles and let the turks and Bagis spew whatever they want.

Great plan to lay on the table. But in regards to resolutions I think both sides have blame and any resolution that was drafted after 1974 the complete break up of the republic is void, these resolutions were enforced on behalf of one sided claims. I think the situation has become to great for a 100% removal of mainland Turks but with an agreed % of return and demilitarization in exchange for T/C rule and rights to be protected I cannot see why I would not shake your hand right now to start drafting a federation system .

[boulio]

ALL411 when did the t/c declare there republic 1985?and like Gul said a few years ago to the t/c leadership you cant even export a box of oranges.Wake up,if the two sides want a federation so be it.but it has to be a TRUE FEDERATION.not some half baked plan drawn up in some back room,with respect for everyones rights ALL411 NOT JUST THE T/C.

[Bananiot]

Bulio, please explain this to me. We have received numerous resolutions from the UN which as you say are favourable to our cause. At the same time, the UN tells us to solve the problem through negotiations and the SG offers his good offices towards this end. Negotiations mean a compromise solution and certainly exclude the direction given by the resolutions thus rendering them pieces of useless paper.

How do you explain this? What lessons are there to be learned from this?

Within the EU we are the black sheep. We are there to be scorned and made fun off. Our deputies are the jokers in the pack. We have never thought about the problems the whole EU is concerned with. On top, the EU does not forget that we tricked them in order to get in.

Makarios thought that the non aligned countries would help Cyprus. Looked where it got us. Now you tell us that Syria and Lebanon are a good thing! God forbids! Israel might be a good move, for too long we considered this country the devils nest. But, when the chips are down, Turkey will appeal more to the entrepreneurial spirit of the Jews, being a huge market and having a fast developing economy.

Lastly, I do not know if you heard that many Greek business people who originate from Constantinople are returning back to Polis and settling permanently there, starting businesses and a new life in this beautiful city. Of course the move has nothing to do with sentiments. It is driven by cold realities of life. These realities that we miserably fail to see in Cyprus and so far we have lost 37% of it. Can you be sure that we will get to keep the rest?

[Gregory]

How do you explain this? What lessons are there to be learned from this?

Within the EU we are the black sheep. We are there to be scorned and made fun off. Our deputies are the jokers in the pack. We have never thought about the problems the whole EU is concerned with. On top, the EU does not forget that we tricked them in order to get in.
?

Some jokers! Ioannis kassoulides is Vice Chairman of the European Peoples Party the largest party in the European Parliament.

Takes Hadjigeorgiou is also vice chairman of the Europen Left Party in the Euro Parliament.

Which joker deputies are you talking about that are getting laughed at?

Perhaps it's Triantafylides that Chairs the EU delegation with regards to the Palestinians and who has accompanied Tony Blair a number of times as representatives of the Eu to facilitate the talks between the Israelis and Palestinians.


As for this

Bulio, please explain this to me. We have received numerous resolutions from the UN which as you say are favourable to our cause. At the same time, the UN tells us to solve the problem through negotiations and the SG offers his good offices towards this end. Negotiations mean a compromise solution and certainly exclude the direction given by the resolutions thus rendering them pieces of useless paper.

How do you explain this? What lessons are there to be learned from this?


.
?

You nearly had me there, the UN resolutions call for the removal of Turkish troops and the non recognition of the "trnc". Where in any of the talks are these 2 issues not meant to be solved but negotiated?
Why the lies? Chill out dude, too much self loathing in you.