Cyprus-Forum.com

[Viewpoint]

And now can we have the list from when eoka was formed.

[Piratis]

Piratis

I already gave to Bananiot the facts about those events. Bananiot (as always) didn't say the whole truth about that event.

The whole truth is that 7 Greek Cypriots were shot and injured by TCs the day before. One of the injured was the priest of the village. This is what caused the reaction by the GCs.

The TC killed was not some unsuspecting villager, but a policeman of the British forces. Also 3 Greek Cypriots were murdered in Assia in those events, something which again Bananiot failed to mention in his story.

Very good Piratis. Now, let us clear one thing after the other. You have been saying all along (ad nauseum) that the intercommunal strife was started by the TC's in 1958. Have you now changed your mind on this? Are you now saying that it started in April/May 1956?

1958 was the year when a lot of people were killed because of their ethnicity. Not just an event in some village with a couple of victims. In fact 1958 was one of the years with the highest death toll as a result of this conflict.

But I have no problem if you say that the conflict started even earlier than that if that is what you want and you believe that such events can be considered part of the conflict. But again, it is obvious that even in those events it is the TCs who attacked first, something you failed to mention.

Some would go even earlier (all the way back to the time when Turks first came to Cyprus). No problem with me at all. Take it as far back as you wish.

What you can not do is to claim that the inter-communal conflict started in 1963. If one thing is clear from our discussion is that there was conflict long before 1963 and that the Turks/TCs had started it (and this is true regardless of if we take the beginning of the conflict to be 1958, 1956, 1821 or 1571).

[Viewpoint]

Lets look at it from another angle when did we agree to wipe the slate clean and live together under a new constitution?

[Piratis]

Lets look at it from another angle when did we agree to wipe the slate clean and live together under a new constitution?

I don't see anything in any agreement about "wiping the slate clean".

If you want our forgiveness for the crimes you committed against us so we can start again from a clean slate what you should do is to start respecting our human and democratic rights.

Collaborating with foreign Imperialists so you can blackmail us and force on Cyprus some foreign made constitution that discriminates against the vast majority of the population, is not "wiping the slate clean" but on the contrary yet another item in the long list of crimes you committed against us.

[Viewpoint]

Lets look at it from another angle when did we agree to wipe the slate clean and live together under a new constitution?

I don't see anything in any agreement about "wiping the slate clean".

If you want our forgiveness for the crimes you committed against us so we can start again from a clean slate what you should do is to start respecting our human and democratic rights.

Collaborating with foreign Imperialists so you can blackmail us and force on Cyprus some foreign made constitution that discriminates against the vast majority of the population, is not "wiping the slate clean" but on the contrary yet another item in the long list of crimes you committed against us.

The 1960 agreements were exactly that a new start or by another name cleaning the slate and starting afresh, you obviously had hidden agendas and saw this a a stepping stone to gifting Cyprus to Greece which you knew full well we would never agree to as it we saw it as our death warrant.

The only way we can respect each others rights to agree to a BBF with political equality of the 2 states, which you have once rejected and still display great nausea at the prospect of having to share equally.

As for siding with the Brits who did you expect us to side with the enosis terrorists?

[denizaksulu]

Lets look at it from another angle when did we agree to wipe the slate clean and live together under a new constitution?

I don't see anything in any agreement about "wiping the slate clean".

If you want our forgiveness for the crimes you committed against us so we can start again from a clean slate what you should do is to start respecting our human and democratic rights.

Collaborating with foreign Imperialists so you can blackmail us and force on Cyprus some foreign made constitution that discriminates against the vast majority of the population, is not "wiping the slate clean" but on the contrary yet another item in the long list of crimes you committed against us.

The 1960 agreements were exactly that a new start or by another name cleaning the slate and starting afresh, you obviously had hidden agendas and saw this a a stepping stone to gifting Cyprus to Greece which you knew full well we would never agree to as it we saw it as our death warrant.

The only way we can respect each others rights to agree to a BBF with political equality of the 2 states, which you have once rejected and still display great nausea at the prospect of having to share equally.

As for siding with the Brits who did you expect us to side with the enosis terrorists?

Some GCs conveniently forget that EOKA and ENOSIS went hand-in-had together; as Makarios had said many times before. They wished we hang ourselves with our own noose. They are mad. I concur whole heartedly with the highlighted sentence of VP.

MERRY CHRISTMAS to ALL.

[Bananiot]

Surely even you Piratis, can understand that isolated events (as you call them) in a number of villages prepared the ground for more widespread hostilities. You have been moaning and groaning for years now that the conflict started in 1958 with the killing of the Kondemenos GC's (who were out to attack TC villages by the way) but you dismiss the killing of 3 GC's in Ashia and the shooting and injuring of 7 GC's (including the village priest of Afania) as non consequencial, practically. I shall return back to this.

For now Piratis, can you tell us who was the first Cypriot that fell dead as a result intercommunal strife and when did this event take place?

But, in the case you want to carry on with your absurdities, I just want to remind you that in 1959 both communities declared peace and embarked on the path of creating a new, independent Cyprus, by accepting the agrements which the late Papadopoulos claimed, late in his life, that they were a blessing in desquise.

[Kikapu]

I have just one thing to say to you all those who continually argue as to who and what started first, WHO CARES, because, just because one may have started something first against the other, it does not mean that the other would not have started something themselves too against the other as long as Enosis and Taksim dreams were alive before and after the 1960 constitution was signed. The fact that such a constitution was allowed to be signed, only confirms that Enosis and Taksim was alive, which made the 1960 constitution a perfect "vehicle" to make Enosis and/or Talkim possible. We have already passed the "blame stage" already, so the ONLY question left to be answered is, are the TCs (Turkey) going to continue with their Taksim dreams in 2011, long after the GCs Enosis dreams have ended or what.? Any other discussion on this topic is totally a WASTE of TIME. By continuing to do so, ALL you are doing is this.......

[Piratis]

Lets look at it from another angle when did we agree to wipe the slate clean and live together under a new constitution?

I don't see anything in any agreement about "wiping the slate clean".

If you want our forgiveness for the crimes you committed against us so we can start again from a clean slate what you should do is to start respecting our human and democratic rights.

Collaborating with foreign Imperialists so you can blackmail us and force on Cyprus some foreign made constitution that discriminates against the vast majority of the population, is not "wiping the slate clean" but on the contrary yet another item in the long list of crimes you committed against us.

The 1960 agreements were exactly that a new start or by another name cleaning the slate and starting afresh, you obviously had hidden agendas and saw this a a stepping stone to gifting Cyprus to Greece which you knew full well we would never agree to as it we saw it as our death warrant.

The only way we can respect each others rights to agree to a BBF with political equality of the 2 states, which you have once rejected and still display great nausea at the prospect of having to share equally.

As for siding with the Brits who did you expect us to side with the enosis terrorists?

The 1960 "agreements" was not a "new start" but yet another crime in the long list of your crimes against us which continue non stop from the day you set your foot on our island until today.

You are the terrorists and not the Cypriot freedom fighters. You sided with the British Colonialists in order to prevent Cypriots from having their freedom.

Your small minority can have what all other minorities have in every other country. For as long as you collaborate with foreign Imperialists to have gains on our expense we will fight back.

[Piratis]

Surely even you Piratis, can understand that isolated events (as you call them) in a number of villages prepared the ground for more widespread hostilities. You have been moaning and groaning for years now that the conflict started in 1958 with the killing of the Kondemenos GC's (who were out to attack TC villages by the way) but you dismiss the killing of 3 GC's in Ashia and the shooting and injuring of 7 GC's (including the village priest of Afania) as non consequencial, practically. I shall return back to this.

For now Piratis, can you tell us who was the first Cypriot that fell dead as a result intercommunal strife and when did this event take place?

But, in the case you want to carry on with your absurdities, I just want to remind you that in 1959 both communities declared peace and embarked on the path of creating a new, independent Cyprus, by accepting the agrements which the late Papadopoulos claimed, late in his life, that they were a blessing in desquise.

Bananiot, no problem with me if you want to go back to 1956. In 1958 100s of people died and it was one of the most bloody years of the conflict that followed (those 7 innocent unarmed GCs who were murdered where only the beginning), but even in the incident of 1956 it was again started by the TCs (something you tried to hide) so this doesn't change anything from what I said. If you want to take the conflict back to "preparing the ground" stage, then we could even go back another 78 years and earlier, to the time of Ottoman rule when we were oppressed by the Turks who murdered 10s of thousands of Cypriots.

By the way, you still did not apologize for hiding the truth about that incident. You tried to claim that GCs attacked the TCs out of the blue, but you were proven (as always) a liar.

About the 1960 agreements it is more than obvious that they were imposed on us by force and blackmail, and what they created was not an independent Cyprus, but a Cyprus controlled by foreigners and their local collaborators.

As far as the first Cypriot casualties of the Turkish aggression these must be the ones:

In 1489, the first year of Venetian control, Turks attacked the Karpas Peninsula, pillaging and taking captives to be sold into slavery. In 1539 the Turkish fleet attacked and destroyed Limassol.

But feel free to let me know if you have a date even earlier than that. No problem at all with me