Cyprus-Forum.com

[ZoC]

Unable to stand criticism, Stonehead?

ur a prick.

IMHO Your original post was racist in refering to the nationality of another Forum member, it was racist in refering to my ethnicity. Are these material to the debate? Yes if you are seeking to denigrate some because they are Brit or English.

IMHO i disagree. I am denigrating u because ur obtuse, not because ur english.

No I have not missed your point. As you say "there are so many shades of meaning in English". That is mine. The dictionary order is not significant, but, in so far as concepts are capable of translation "Εἰρήνη" = "Peace".

But "Peace" doesn't necessarily mean "Εἰρήνη". that's my point. Read this..

http://www.holytrinity.gen.nz/Pages/ser ... makers.htm


In our common English usage the word “peace” carries the meaning of serenity, of quietness, and tranquility. Along with that we associate the word to mean an absence of conflict, trouble, dissension or even war. We might think of peace even as that state where people get on reasonably well together. However, as good as these may be, this is not the Biblical meaning of the word “Peace”. To understand this Beatitude from a biblical perspective, we need to think about the word “Shalom”. This is the Hebrew word which means Peace. “Shalom” never means only the absence of trouble or noise; In Hebrew, “Shalom” means “everything which makes for a persons highest good.” So in Hebrew culture, for one to say to another, ”Shalom” – doesn’t mean that he wishes for the other only the absence of evil things, he wishes for him the presence and abundance of all good things and their greatest welfare.

and shut up.

[supporttheunderdog]

I rather think in your latest post you have rather proved the point I was trying to make, and in the process demolished one of your own initial prepositions.

In your original post you equated the English word "Peace" with the latin "pax", i.e, the absence of war or conflict, possibly imposed by force. You pointed out that the original written biblical word was "Εἰρήνη (though in reality as the bible was a later Greek language written record of the spoken word it would probably have been the aramaic word, as I am not aware Yeshua/Jesus spoke Greek) and suggested (and I do not disgree with that) that "Εἰρήνη" meant a lot more than the latin "Pax". You however went further and claimed the English word "Peace" did not carry the same meaning as "Εἰρήνη" but only that of "Pax".
quote
But "irini" (as in the Aramaic "shalom") isn't simply an absence of war. It evokes a deep sense of calmness, equilibrium, tranquility, ease, of lasting contentment and warmth. You can see, this is far deeper than the "peace" evoked in English.
Unquote

Now you are quoting an article which equates the English word "Peace" to the hebrew word "Shalom", which is the word to which you equated "Εἰρήνη". Now logically if "Εἰρήνη" and "Peace" both carry within them the meaning of "Shalom" then Peace evoked in English must also evoke a deep sense of calmness, equilibrium, tranquility, ease, of lasting contentment and warmth, as evoked by "Εἰρήνη" and not just as the absence of war, as you sought to argue in your first post.

Now may peace be unto us both.

[ZoC]

I rather think in your latest post you have rather proved the point I was trying to make, and in the process demolished one of your own initial prepositions.

In your original post you equated the English word "Peace" with the latin "pax", i.e, the absence of war or conflict, possibly imposed by force. You pointed out that the original written biblical word was "Εἰρήνη (though in reality as the bible was a later Greek language written record of the spoken word it would probably have been the aramaic word, as I am not aware Yeshua/Jesus spoke Greek) and suggested (and I do not disgree with that) that "Εἰρήνη" meant a lot more than the latin "Pax". You however went further and claimed the English word "Peace" did not carry the same meaning as "Εἰρήνη" but only that of "Pax".
quote
But "irini" (as in the Aramaic "shalom") isn't simply an absence of war. It evokes a deep sense of calmness, equilibrium, tranquility, ease, of lasting contentment and warmth. You can see, this is far deeper than the "peace" evoked in English.
Unquote

Now you are quoting an article which equates the English word "Peace" to the hebrew word "Shalom", which is the word to which you equated "Εἰρήνη". Now logically if "Εἰρήνη" and "Peace" both carry within them the meaning of "Shalom" then Peace evoked in English must also evoke a deep sense of calmness, equilibrium, tranquility, ease, of lasting contentment and warmth, as evoked by "Εἰρήνη" and not just as the absence of war, as you sought to argue in your first post.

Now may peace be unto us both.

"Εἰρήνη", as written in the gospels, equates exactly to the aramaic "shalom", as spoken by yeshua (ie tranquility, serenity et al); and not to the english, latin derived "peace" (ie. absence of war, compromise, et al)

i made this exact point in my initial post. i really don't know what ur arguing about - and nor do u. as a result, i think between us, we've now cultivated a state of "εἰρήνη" rather than "peace"... you perhaps by luck, me more by design.

but, either way, as the old saying goes...

μακάριοι οἱ εἰρηνοποιοί

[supporttheunderdog]

I'll gladly agree with your closing remarks.

μακάριοι οἱ εἰρηνοποιοί

[ZoC]

I'll gladly agree with your closing remarks.

μακάριοι οἱ εἰρηνοποιοί