Cyprus-Forum.com

[Gasman]

Interesting Deniz. I do wonder how it 'got started' with the GC land being sold off to foreigners over there.

I mean the foreigners in question (who bought properties on the land in question) almost all dealt with Estate Agents / Property Developers advertising on the internet and property magazines (home in the sun sort of stuff - offering inspection trips etc) not directly from TCs or other private individuals.

I've asked this before - who started selling it? Was it the 'TRNC' government or who? Who first got 'the idea' to do this?

But then, as I've stated above, I have also read that, even if only for a short time, the RoC did agree with the 'TRNC' to this Esdeger or Exchange nonsense. And then changed their mind due to pressure from other political parties or waddever.

I do know some of the explanations given by Estate Agents when they were very busy selling. I know because I asked questions and they were the answers I got.

Various explanations - all designed to put a prospective purchaser's mind at rest, but, in my opinion, also leaving lots of questions unanswered and any individual with a smattering of common sense would have 'smelt a rat' or not been satisfied with those answers.

Many ex pat Brits have protested they were not aware they were doing anything wrong. Or that they believed the land was exchanged or would never have bought.

However, if you read some of the views expressed by them since Orams and more recently - they do seem to be saying 'well serves them right' or words to that effect.

This leads me to conclude that they DID in fact have doubts or even knew very well what the situation was. Or why the need to justify themselves now. Why aren't they just as OUTRAGED as the GC owners of the land involved?

I've asked some how they would feel if they still retained property in the UK (or even a car they left there, or a boat, or caravan) and, on their return there from a spell in their 'TRNC' property, they found their UK property had been taken over, lived in, knocked down, or SOLD in their absence because 'they left it'. Haven't had a sensible answer to that one yet.

Some of these property developers (when questioned - unbelievable really but not many prospective buyers DO question - I suppose they are blinded by the very low cost - remember at times you could get a 2bed house for well under 25K - that surely would be all most people would need to make them suspicious) were not too creative - they just said 'it's highly unlikely the Greek Cypriot landowner will ever get their land back, it's been 30 odd years and they will probably be talking about it for another 30 odd years but, in the unlikely event that any claim is made against you - we will buy the property back from you for what you paid for it.

Others were told that there was a very slim chance that they might have to pay some compensation in future but that the property they'd bought would have doubled in price by then so they'd still be quids in.

Others that the North was 'bound to become part of the EU' before too long and that prices would shoot up then and ditto to above.

I don't know any who said that there was any likelihood of the GC owners being granted the right to take possession of their property again. Nor anyone who was told that. And it doesn't seem to have occurred to any of them either does it? Not until very recently.

Another 'tale' I've heard several times is that 'all this land being built on was grazing land for GC shepherds - they are unlikely to ever bother to try to get it back. It wasn't worth much then, most of them have left Cyprus for good.

Another (and this one almost makes me laugh in its simplicity) that 'All the new builds are on 'grazing land. In the North, all the GCs owned 'property' and all the TCs were mainly shepherds - so any land that was grazing land is TC land'. Now it would only take a tiny bit of research to discover what portion of land belonged to GCs and to TCs to debunk that one.

It is my firm belief that a lot of ex pat Brits DID KNOW what the score was. But they were already in their retirement and they bought hoping or expecting the Cyprus Problem and the 'talks' about it to continue for as long again as they had already and their view was 'we will be dead by the time they come to any agreement'.

Many many years ago I was warned off buying property in the North, not by a GC but by a respectable honest TC estate agent in Famagusta who does not deal in the sale of GC owned property or land. He sent me links to various websites to alert me to the dangers and acquaint me with what the situation was.

Anyone else could easily have found out what the score was.

Yet still, even now, I hear Brits saying 'well we know for SURE our property has Esdeger Deeds so we have nothing to worry about'. Or that they have been shown 'very old original maps' proving that their property is on TC land as the map shows it was all TC land in that area (Iskele springs to mind here and it definitely was NOT all TC land - so god knows where these maps come from?)

And I am sure there are some dear souls who are still blissfully unaware that there is or might be a problem! People who've not got the internet, don't frequent ex pat bars and clubs and don't have a clue about anything much at all duh!

[denizaksulu]

Wow. I doubt if I will be able to answer all your questions.

Immediatelt after the events of 1974, before the dust of war had hardly settled, the GC land was given almost freely to London Cyps who would return to Cyprus and resettle there. Some did take the carrot. This did not depend on whether they had property in the south or not. So suddenly the poor peasant (working in the UK) found themselves suddenly land/property owners. I have no figures for this. Just a few acquantances I know.

Later on when the ez-pats began buying, they assumed that 1974 was the end of the 'Cyprus Problem' and that the GC side would accept the 'fait accompli' and the division of the island. The rest is pure PR and the property airs held in various locations world wide - including the UK. Still goes on ofcourse.

Needless to say none of this would take place without the approval of the authorities in the north.

[Gasman]

Interesting thank you Deniz. I heard from a Cyp who was returning to Cy after 74 that he wanted to return to the North, but that he would not get his pension paid if he did? That he would only get it if he resided in the South?

But none of this is just 'straightforward' is it? I also know GCs who have passed their interest/title in their land in the North to their offspring and I know that their offspring used that title to borrow money at a very advantageous rate, to buy property in the RoC.

I don't understand that really - except it says to me that whoever lent the money to them sees that title as being good enough to guarantee the loan?

Then all these different rules for GCs who stayed on in Cyprus and for those who left before 74 or returned after 74.

To be honest, I don't see how any government can come up with a 'plan' that will satisfy everyone.

And almost everyone involved will want a 'plan' that benefits themself, even if it means others will lose out.

Famagusta seems the simplest one - no one lives in the disputed area.

Another thing that puzzles me is what will happen regarding all the Turkish 'settlers'. Now that there are so many of them.

Surely it could have been foreseen that, leaving it longer and longer, this problem would only increase? Or that, if left long enough, you would be talking about getting rid of a population of settlers that outnumbers the population of the whole of Cyprus pre 1974?

I've never actually spoken to any poor Turkish settlers. I've had villages pointed out to me by TC pals over there saying that the whole village was occupied by settlers (usually in the middle of absolutely nowhere, at the bottom of a valley and miles off the beaten track).

But I've spoken to Turkish mainlanders who work in the hotels and such there. Not many of them seem to be happy living in the TRNC. (At one stage I wondered if they were 'press ganged' to work there lol!) Well, because these are mostly people who speak perfect English and seem reasonably intelligent and who complain that they cannot go South and that the 'TRNC' is very small and boring compared with Turkey?

I knew one for about 4 yrs who recently left for good. He has gone to Italy and is making his way to the UK from there! Hey - maybe they'll all end up in the UK and that will solve the problem lol!

[ZoC]

But I've spoken to Turkish mainlanders who work in the hotels and such there. Not many of them seem to be happy living in the TRNC. (At one stage I wondered if they were 'press ganged' to work there lol!) Well, because these are mostly people who speak perfect English and seem reasonably intelligent and who complain that they cannot go South and that the 'TRNC' is very small and boring compared with Turkey?

I knew one for about 4 yrs who recently left for good. He has gone to Italy and is making his way to the UK from there! Hey - maybe they'll all end up in the UK and that will solve the problem lol!

what a brilliant idea. we should ethnically cleanse the good people of north blackburn and dump all the turds there. blackburn's mp jack straw will endorse this, no problem. the chances of a settlement in cyprus would be greatly enhanced if the international community broke a taboo, and started publicly to recognise that if political equality cannot be achieved within one state, then it could with two states - cyprus and the turkish republic of northern blackburn.

[Gasman]

[denizaksulu]

But I've spoken to Turkish mainlanders who work in the hotels and such there. Not many of them seem to be happy living in the TRNC. (At one stage I wondered if they were 'press ganged' to work there lol!) Well, because these are mostly people who speak perfect English and seem reasonably intelligent and who complain that they cannot go South and that the 'TRNC' is very small and boring compared with Turkey?

I knew one for about 4 yrs who recently left for good. He has gone to Italy and is making his way to the UK from there! Hey - maybe they'll all end up in the UK and that will solve the problem lol!

what a brilliant idea. we should ethnically cleanse the good people of north blackburn and dump all the turds there. blackburn's mp jack straw will endorse this, no problem. the chances of a settlement in cyprus would be greatly enhanced if the international community broke a taboo, and started publicly to recognise that if political equality cannot be achieved within one state, then it could with two states - cyprus and the turkish republic of northern blackburn.

Not on your life.

What would Cyprus be without us REAL SIPRIYOTES?

My neighbours sisters son arrived over the weekend from Cyprus. He is a cameraman for RIK. My lovely neighbour being the caring auntie she is (to me too) cooked him a lovely dish of bamyades/bamya/ okra/ ladies fingers. He took one look and said yuk!! He went to Macdonalds. See what I mean?

[Gasman]

What would Cyprus be without us REAL SIPRIYOTES?

My neighbours sisters son arrived over the weekend from Cyprus. He is a cameraman for RIK. My lovely neighbour being the caring auntie she is (to me too) cooked him a lovely dish of bamyades/bamya/ okra/ ladies fingers. He took one look and said yuk!! He went to Macdonalds. See what I mean?

Blerdy ingrate! I'd have eaten it (apart from the ladies fingers - I find them rather 'slimey' lol)

SIPRIYOTES?


Love it!

[denizaksulu]

What would Cyprus be without us REAL SIPRIYOTES?

My neighbours sisters son arrived over the weekend from Cyprus. He is a cameraman for RIK. My lovely neighbour being the caring auntie she is (to me too) cooked him a lovely dish of bamyades/bamya/ okra/ ladies fingers. He took one look and said yuk!! He went to Macdonalds. See what I mean?

Blerdy ingrate! I'd have eaten it (apart from the ladies fingers - I find them rather 'slimey' lol)

SIPRIYOTES?


They are not that slimey if you know how to prepare them and while simmering do not stir. You can bake them in an oven too by carefully laying them out - no 'slime' at all.

ladies fingers = okre=bamya=bamyades ..Nice with a good pilav.

Love it!

[Gasman]

Well done Deniz! You've managed to attribute your response to me.

No matter - it is hardly 'controversial'!

Well two words you used put me right off the idea of trying them again - 'prepare' and 'oven'.

Cooking just ain't my 'thing'. Definitely one of those women who only has a kitchen because it came with the house!

[Paphitis]

Paphitis wrote

Crap!

We literally don't have much time for them, because they are very cold and insular, non egalitarian, whinge and whine like a B747 and they don't shower every day and absolutely pong!!!!!! And they can'e handle their piss and behave like absolute bums!!!!

Hated in Australia and continental Europe, and all these people can't be wrong!!!

Hey you

Less of the ''Can'e (sic) handle the piss''

One day we'll meet in Cyprus and I'll drink you under the bloody table, you sheep shaggin pervert.

and, for your information my old colonial amigo, I shower at least once a month whether I need one or not

Bloody convicts get right up my goat .........sometimes literally

Ricardo....

Yes, one day we will meet (June 2011 ) and sink some piss, but only if you have a shower!

I know just the gift for you:



I know the sheep are very nervous in Australia, but at least we smell nice...

Superman and Australia

What does superman and South Australia have in common?
They both have an Iron Knob.

Good Sport

Bruce and Sheila have been seeing each other for a while and Sheila asks Bruce to meet her on the Sydney Harbour Bridge.
Sheila: I’ve got something to tell you, Bruce…I’m pregnant and if you don’t marry me, I’m going to jump off this bridge into Sydney Harbour.
Bruce: That’s what I like about you!

English beer

Australian man: Why is your beer like having sex in a canoe?
English man: Dunno, why?
Australian man: It’s fucking close to water!

Australian with sheep and goat

What do you call an Australian with a sheep under one arm and a goat under the other?
Bisexual.

Australian lover

Why is an Australian lover like a wombat?
He eats, roots, shoots, and leaves.

Australian foreplay

Australian foreplay – “Brace yerself Sheila".