Cyprus-Forum.com

[Piratis]

Once again you lose the argument and you resort to personal attacks having nothing more to say.

You only want to remember the parts of history that suit you, so with half truth you can excuse the invasion and the demands you have today. I do recognize the suffering of TCs, but that is only a part of the truth, not the whole truth as Turkish propagandists would have us believe. When the whole truth is presented (e.g. that it is the TCs and Turks who started both the inter-communal conflict and the war of 74, and that indeed GCs suffered for longer and had more casualties) then your excuses for ethnic cleansing and the racist demands that you continue to have from the 50s until today became totally baseless.

What is sad is that you don't want from us just to recognize the truth in your position (e.g. that TCs suffered in the 60s) but you also expect from us to erase from our memory the truths about our own suffering and your share of responsibility for this suffering. Only with half truths you can excuse ethnic cleansing and the demands for racist discrimination and segregation, and this is why you refuse to accept the whole truth.

On the other hand what I support is that all criminal actions against innocent people are inexcusable, regardless if they were TCs or GCs, and that the way forward is not trying to excuse yet more human rights violations against people simply because they belong to a certain race or ethnic group, but on the contrary restore the human rights of those people, abolish all kinds of racist discriminations, and finally be allowed to have in Cyprus the kind of state that we should have been allowed to have in the first place: A democratic, free state were all citizens are equal without the racist discriminations and segregation which has been imposed on our island in the past. This is the only way forward.

Both Makarios and Sampson wanted Turks out, they said it themselves, how can you still stand there spewing the usual repetitive rubbish and say that we started the war!? I guess it was the TC's dressed up as GC police terrorizing everyone as well? Why did they not want a state free from racism back then?

First of all Samson was just a stupid thug and I am not here to defend him.

That said, show me even one case when Makarios, Samson or anybody else said that they wanted "Turks out" before June 1958, when the TCs initiated the inter-communal conflict and demanded our annihilation from half of our island.

Makarios was the one who first proposed independence as an equally legitimate alternative to enosis, but what he meant was obviously a real independence like it exists in all other democratic countries, not the racist crap that was forced on us in 1959, with foreign bases, foreign armies and the racist discrimination and segregation of the population, things that exist in no other normal country in the world.

So we wanted a state free from racism and normal in every other way from back then, but we were not allowed to have it then like we are not allowed to have it now.The unhealthy and divisive system that was forced on us was an excellent breeding ground for even more hate and racism, and racism is something that people from both communities are guilty of.

Are we now going to continue this cycle of racism and hate by looking in the past for excuses (anybody can find an excuse to be racist, it is the easiest thing), or are we finally going to accept that all Cypriots are equal and leave these anachronistic racist divisions in the past?

[Viewpoint]

GCs have never been trusted to uphold equality andnon discrimination due to past problems. Even today you are one of the most racist societies in the EU a christian can still not marry a muslim in the south. We need strict guidelines that will guarantee that the majority cannot use their majority rights to discrminate against any one group due to their differecies be it ethnic backround religion etc.

[halil]

Turkish Cypriot concerns about enosis grew during the 1940s, and particularly after the 1950 plebiscite in which the Greek Cypriot community unanimously voted in favour of it. The Turkish Cypriot élite and the population at large were still relatively content with British rule. However, well aware of the discriminatory treatment of the Turks/Muslims in former Ottoman areas annexed to Greece, the Turkish Cypriots fiercely rejected union with Greece. This spontaneous rejection, nurtured by the British, led to a British-Turkish Cypriot front against EOKA in the mid-1950s. In 1956 the Turkish Cypriots began countering EOKA through the armed movement
Volkan and then, in 1957, the TMT (Turk Mukavemet Teskilati). By 1957 the Turkish Cypriot community and Turkey had formulated their own counter-position to enosis: taksim, or partition of the island into Greek and Turkish Cypriot zones.

By the late 1950s, the main parties were at loggerheads with each other. The Greek Cypriots and Greece were pushing for enosis, while the Turkish Cypriots and Turkey responded with demands for taksim. The British, meanwhile, were determined to retain full sovereignty of the island.The path for compromise was cleared,
however, with a shift in the British position in late 1957. The compromise solution between the extremes of enosis and taksim was independence. In 1959, a framework agreement was worked out in Zurich between the Greek and Turkish Prime Ministers.It was immediately followed by the signature of fully-fledged treaties in London,which were also signed by the British and by Archbishop Makarios and Fazil Kucuk, representing the Greek and Turkish Cypriot communities respectively. The parties
agreed on a basic structure for the new, independent Republic of Cyprus (RoC) which explicitly ruled out both enosis and taksim. Under the agreement, Britain retained sovereignty over the military bases of Dhekelia and Akrotiri.


At the same time, the parties also signed Treaties of Guarantee and of
Alliance. The Treaty of Guarantee was intended to “ensure the independence, territorial integrity and security” of the Republic of Cyprus and to prevent its “political or economic union with any state whatsoever”


more to come later on...... who are wants to read truth ..............

At the same time, the parties also signed Treaties of Guarantee and of
Alliance. The Treaty of Guarantee was intended to “ensure the independence,territorial integrity and security” of the Republic of Cyprus and to prevent its“political or economic union with any state whatsoever” (Article 1). In support of this aim, the Treaty gave Britain, Greece and Turkey “the right to take action with the sole aim of re-establishing the state of affairs established by the Treaty” (Article 4). The three guarantors could intervene in the internal affairs of the island, either jointly or independently, to ensure compliance with the Treaty and to prevent both enosis and taksim. The Treaty of Alliance was a defence pact to safeguard the independence and territorial integrity of the RoC. In its additional protocol, the Treaty allowed Greece and Turkey to station 950 and 650 troops, respectively, in Cyprus. It also granted Britain extensive rights in its use of the ninety-nine square miles under its
sovereignty.

[halil]

The basic structure of the RoC was laid down in the 1960 Constitution, which established a bi-communal partnership Republic, i.e., a hybrid consociational model with elements of communal autonomy. Bi-communality was ensured through a detailed, complex arrangement providing for community representation and powersharing.
The executive would be governed according to a presidential system, with a Greek Cypriot President and a Turkish Cypriot Vice-President elected by the separate communities. The executive would also consist of a cabinet of ten members: seven members would be Greek Cypriot and appointed by the President, while the remaining three would be Turkish Cypriot and appointed by the Vice-President. The legislature would consist of a fifty-member House of Representatives elected through
separate electoral lists. Communal representation would be determined on a 70:30 ratio, and there would be the same ethnic quota for the civil service and the police force. For the 2,000-strong armed forces, however, a 60:40 ratio would apply. The judicial system would consist of a Supreme Constitutional Court, a High Court of Justice and lower courts also characterized by bi-communal representation. Separate communal chambers would be set up to deal with educational, religious, cultural and personal status matters. The communal chambers would be entitled to levy taxes and establish separate courts to administer these powers, and to receive direct subsidies from their respective ‘motherlands’. Finally, in each of the island’s five largest towns there would be separate municipalities for the two communities.

[halil]

Almost from the outset, many Greek Cypriots expressed their dissatisfaction with the agreements, regarding them as a betrayal of the enosis cause. Makarios felt they had been imposed from outside. Most importantly, the Greek Cypriots contested what they believed to be the over-generous concessions granted to the Turkish Cypriot community relative to their size. In their view, the Turkish Cypriots, who represented 18% of the island’s population, should have been granted minority rights
rather than an almost equal share in government arrangements. Hence, on 3 November 1963 President Makarios presented Vice-President Kucuk with a thirteenpoint proposal for amending the Constitution. The amendments proposed the abolition of several critical constitutional provisions that characterized the bi-communal nature of the Republic. They set the stage for a unitary, centralized state with minority rights
(at most) for the Turkish Cypriot community. Ankara and Vice-President Fazil Kucuk rejected the proposed amendments.Tensions within public institutions grew until Turkish Cypriot officials either left or were made to leave all public positions. At the same time, violence broke out between
communal paramilitary groups. Paramilitary organizations were initially defensive in nature, but as tension mounted they adopted more aggressive positions. The outbreak of inter-communal violence between the Greek Cypriot police force and the Turkish Resistance Movement, and between Greek and Turkish Cypriot paramilitary groups,led to numerous deaths and the forced displacement of over 30,000 Turkish Cypriots
from mixed villages to enclaves. The (Greek Cypriot) government imposed an economic embargo on strategic goods and services to the enclaves, it directed no public expenditure to the Turkish Cypriot community living in enclaves, restricted the latter’s freedom of movement and denied it most forms of employment. The problem intensified with Greece’s efforts to destabilize Makarios’government. Tensions between Greece and Cyprus had been exacerbated following the 1967 military coup in Greece and the growing Greek interference in the internal
affairs of the island. It culminated on 15 July 1974 when the Greek National Guard staged a coup to oust the Archbishop’s regime and extend the dictatorship to Cyprus.

At this point, Turkey, which had already been on the verge of intervening in 1964 and 1967 in response to inter-communal violence, intervened militarily on 20 July 1974,

more to come later on .....who are interested to read the TRUTH...........

[Hermes]

more to come later on .....who are interested to read the TRUTH...........

Always interested to read the TRUTH...

[Piratis]

Halil, I will save you from the trouble to flood this thread with copy & paste posts (which you apparently make to bury our posts) by giving a link direct to the book you are copying from:

http://books.google.com/books?id=bjGsbt ... frontcover

Anybody who is interested can read that book (including the parts you left out), as well as tons of other books about Cyprus (most of which would not be promoted by you as they wouldn't fit your agenda).

[shahmaran]

Halil, I will save you from the trouble to flood this thread with copy & paste posts (which you apparently make to bury our posts) by giving a link direct to the book you are copying from:

http://books.google.com/books?id=bjGsbt ... frontcover

Anybody who is interested can read that book (including the parts you left out), as well as tons of other books about Cyprus (most of which would not be promoted by you as they wouldn't fit your agenda).

Right so its ok when you copy and paste all the time?

[runaway]

A Turkish film at an illegal south cypriot festival? What a shame

[Piratis]

GCs have never been trusted to uphold equality andnon discrimination due to past problems. Even today you are one of the most racist societies in the EU a christian can still not marry a muslim in the south. We need strict guidelines that will guarantee that the majority cannot use their majority rights to discrminate against any one group due to their differecies be it ethnic backround religion etc.

GCs are no different than most other southern European people (and way better than Turkey in this respect), and considering the fact that Cyprus gained its independence just 50 years ago and we had so many problems due to the conflict and the Turkish invasion, our current level is quite remarkable. There is of course space for a lot of improvement and the majority of us want Cyprus to progress in this and every other respect, as opposed to people like yourself who are looking for excuses to keep Cyprus in the middle ages.

And who told you that a Christian can not marry a Muslim? My own cousin did just that without a problem whatsoever. You are obviously missing something.