Cyprus-Forum.com

[Get Real!]

In case you don't believe me here is a link for you to read...And if you do not find the source credible,it shouldn't take too long for you to track down the original Oriana Falaci interview....

In December 1974, the late Archbishop Makarios himself, after he had been overthrown by the coup of 15 July 1974 and while he was in exile, disclosed to an Italian journalist Oriano Falaci, in New York that the last head of the Greek Junta, Brigadier Ioannides, and Sampson (the self-confessed murderer who was made 'President of Cyprus' by the Junta) came and saw him one day in 1963 (while Ioannides was serving as a Greek Army Officer in Cyprus) and suggested a plan for the extermination of the Turkish Cypriots. The relevant passage of the interview with Makarios reads as follows:

One day he (Brig. Ioannides) came to see me with Sampson, to suggest a project that would have settled forever the problem of Cyprus. He kissed my hand respectfully and said: “Your Beatitude, here is my project; to attack the Turkish Cypriots suddenly everywhere on the island and eliminate them to the last one.” I was astonished, I told him that I could not agree with him.

http://www.mfa.gov.tr/akritas-plan.en.mfa

Why didn't your Turkish source use the exact words of that interview?

"He had bowed to me, he had kissed my hand most respectfully, then: "Beatitude, here's the plan. To attack the Turkish Cypriots suddenly, everywhere on the island. To eliminate them one and all. Stop." I was flabbergasted. I told him I couldn't agree with him, that I couldn't even conceive the idea of killing so many innocent people. He kissed my hand again and went away in a huff. I tell you, he's a criminal."

http://mk-mk.facebook.com/topic.php?uid ... topic=4460

[Get Real!]

I am wasting my time and energy...Neither Hermes nor Piratis is capable of any empathy for the TCs...This is very clear now..A man (Sampson) who went to see Makarios some years ago with a plan to exterminate all TCs of Cyprus in one night had just become President after a Greek junta led coup, whose leader Ionnides was Sampson's partner in crime during the meeting with Makarios where the wholesale massacre of the TCs were discussed,and you two see nothing alarming about that for the TCs in 74...
Fine,have it your way...I am really lost for words...I cannot believe how callous you can be ...My friends,with people like you around we need more than 40,000 Turkish troops to safeguard the lives of the people who live in the North of Cyprus...You can crow all you like about democracy and the EU principles,but nobody will ever listen to you,as long as you are deaf to the TC reality in Cyprus...

Yet the ONE person who did not believe in harming Turkish Cypriots never received any support from them! How foolish you were…

[BirKibrisli]

Bir do you remember how optimistic you were, these have not changed one iota you of all people should have seen that as you lived through those terrible times that according to piratis and hermes you inflicted on yourself without and GC input.

Yeah,we decided to throw ourselves into wells,disappear by busloads, get out of our sick beds in hospitals and throw ourselves out of the windows,leave our villages and huddle in enclaves,or emmigrate to far away countries, so that one day Turkey would have the reason to invade,make those of us who still remained in Cyprus refugees in our own country,and give most of the the GC land and properties in Northern Cyprus to Turkish settlers they brought in especially for that reason...That is how stupid and nonpatriotic they thing we are...

[BirKibrisli]

I am wasting my time and energy...Neither Hermes nor Piratis is capable of any empathy for the TCs...This is very clear now..A man (Sampson) who went to see Makarios some years ago with a plan to exterminate all TCs of Cyprus in one night had just become President after a Greek junta led coup, whose leader Ionnides was Sampson's partner in crime during the meeting with Makarios where the wholesale massacre of the TCs were discussed,and you two see nothing alarming about that for the TCs in 74...
Fine,have it your way...I am really lost for words...I cannot believe how callous you can be ...My friends,with people like you around we need more than 40,000 Turkish troops to safeguard the lives of the people who live in the North of Cyprus...You can crow all you like about democracy and the EU principles,but nobody will ever listen to you,as long as you are deaf to the TC reality in Cyprus...

Yet the ONE person who did not believe in harming Turkish Cypriots never received any support from them! How foolish you were…

Makarios was no friend of the TCs,GR! He had his own plan to get rid of us... We couldn't possibly trust him...But my point is,and you too are choosing to ignore it,we had two men in 74, One who had just become President after a violent coup supported by the Greek Junta,and another man who was the leader of the same Greek Junta who supported the Coup, who as a team had previously gone to see Makarios with a bloodcurdling proposal to kill all TCs in one night, and your mates above see nothing for the TCs or Turkey to be alarmed about at the turn of events in 74...You might like to tell them to get real!

[Piratis]

I am wasting my time and energy...Neither Hermes nor Piratis is capable of any empathy for the TCs...This is very clear now..A man (Sampson) who went to see Makarios some years ago with a plan to exterminate all TCs of Cyprus in one night had just become President after a Greek junta led coup, whose leader Ionnides was Sampson's partner in crime during the meeting with Makarios where the wholesale massacre of the TCs were discussed,and you two see nothing alarming about that for the TCs in 74...
Fine,have it your way...I am really lost for words...I cannot believe how callous you can be ...My friends,with people like you around we need more than 40,000 Turkish troops to safeguard the lives of the people who live in the North of Cyprus...You can crow all you like about democracy and the EU principles,but nobody will ever listen to you,as long as you are deaf to the TC reality in Cyprus...

Bir, Samson has a son and he is probably a "Turk hater" as well. So maybe you should kill the remaining Greek Cypriots in order to "protect" yourselves from him?

Your excuses are really lame my friend.

1) The Turkish plan to ethnically cleanse Greek Cypriots in order to achieve partition existed since the 50s. Samson and others like him became "Turk haters" only after your plan for partition became public and only after the TCs initiated the inter-communal conflict.

2) Samson was nothing but a puppet and he would do whatever the Generals in Athens told him to do. The Muslim/Turkish minority in Greece was not harmed during the rule of the generals in Greece, and during the 5 days of the coup no single TC was harmed either. These are the FACTS.

3) You still didn't explain how protecting TCs from Samson is related with killing 1000s and ethnically cleansing 100s of thousands of innocent Cypriots.

4) Even after the coup and Samson fell, the Turks proceeded with a second phase in their invasion, killing and ethnically cleansing even more people and they continued to occupy Cyprus for 36 years since then. How does your "Samson excuse" give an answer to this?

Sorry mate, but your "interpretation" is really lame and can not pass from any kind of scrutiny.

The TCs and Turks wanted partition since the 50s, before any inter-communal conflict started. They took the opportunity of the coup, when our defenses were at their lowest since the coupists and the resistance fighters were fighting each other, to put into action their plan and partition Cyprus. Then they had to find some excuse for their crime. What you are repeating here is that lame excuse.

Funny how you ask for empathy while at the same time you excuse the murder of 1000s and the ethnic cleansing of 100s of thousands using such a lame excuse.

And it is pathetic how when you lose the argument you come to threaten us with even troops and even more crimes against us. This is how you want to win the argument Bir? You want to silence the truth with such threats? How pathetic!

[BirKibrisli]

No,dear Piratis,pathetic is your attempts to put words in my mouth,to mislead people about what I am saying...Show me one line in all my posts here where I excuse the murdering of one person,let alone thousands...You can misinterpret what I am saying all you like...It will not change the reality..The reality you and your soulmates will always turn a blind eye to...You are the ones who are justifying the demand for Enosis,the tearing up of the foundation agreement of the RoC,excusing the exile of the TCs into enclaves,and denying their second class treatment in their own country during 1963-74 period...You have put your heads firmly in the official GC state propaganda guidelines,and you only lift your heads up to spew more of the lame arguments,while denying real life experiences of people like myself...I am not threatening anyone with anything...I am stating the obvious conclusion...Since by your arguments it is obvious the fanatical GC mentality is alive and well in Cyprus,given half the chance the mistreatment and the abuse you dished out to the Tcs in the past will inevitably be repeated...Now that you are more numerous and much better armed and trained than you were in 1974, more Turkish troops will be needed to keep the citizens of Northern Cyprus safe from fanatics like youself and others in this forum...It makes perfect sense...

[shahmaran]

I am wasting my time and energy...Neither Hermes nor Piratis is capable of any empathy for the TCs...This is very clear now..A man (Sampson) who went to see Makarios some years ago with a plan to exterminate all TCs of Cyprus in one night had just become President after a Greek junta led coup, whose leader Ionnides was Sampson's partner in crime during the meeting with Makarios where the wholesale massacre of the TCs were discussed,and you two see nothing alarming about that for the TCs in 74...
Fine,have it your way...I am really lost for words...I cannot believe how callous you can be ...My friends,with people like you around we need more than 40,000 Turkish troops to safeguard the lives of the people who live in the North of Cyprus...You can crow all you like about democracy and the EU principles,but nobody will ever listen to you,as long as you are deaf to the TC reality in Cyprus...

Bir, Samson has a son and he is probably a "Turk hater" as well. So maybe you should kill the remaining Greek Cypriots in order to "protect" yourselves from him?

Your excuses are really lame my friend.

1) The Turkish plan to ethnically cleanse Greek Cypriots in order to achieve partition existed since the 50s. Samson and others like him became "Turk haters" only after your plan for partition became public and only after the TCs initiated the inter-communal conflict.

2) Samson was nothing but a puppet and he would do whatever the Generals in Athens told him to do. The Muslim/Turkish minority in Greece was not harmed during the rule of the generals in Greece, and during the 5 days of the coup no single TC was harmed either. These are the FACTS.

3) You still didn't explain how protecting TCs from Samson is related with killing 1000s and ethnically cleansing 100s of thousands of innocent Cypriots.

4) Even after the coup and Samson fell, the Turks proceeded with a second phase in their invasion, killing and ethnically cleansing even more people and they continued to occupy Cyprus for 36 years since then. How does your "Samson excuse" give an answer to this?

Sorry mate, but your "interpretation" is really lame and can not pass from any kind of scrutiny.

The TCs and Turks wanted partition since the 50s, before any inter-communal conflict started. They took the opportunity of the coup, when our defenses were at their lowest since the coupists and the resistance fighters were fighting each other, to put into action their plan and partition Cyprus. Then they had to find some excuse for their crime. What you are repeating here is that lame excuse.

Funny how you ask for empathy while at the same time you excuse the murder of 1000s and the ethnic cleansing of 100s of thousands using such a lame excuse.

And it is pathetic how when you lose the argument you come to threaten us with even troops and even more crimes against us. This is how you want to win the argument Bir? You want to silence the truth with such threats? How pathetic!

You should also explain how executing unarmed TC's and dumping them into mass graves was going to achieve anything during an inevitable invasion which you had no power to stop? Obviously was not going to win you the war.

I'll tell you why, minimizing the TC population even further (which was the policy al along) in a state of panic. You saw defeat come and had to speed up the process. Hitler did it as well if you remember? Maximize the damage. Was not going to win him the war but he thought he might at least achieve his goal of eradication.

The question is, why the innocent unarmed civilians?

Holds absolutely no military advantage, only political!

[Piratis]

I am wasting my time and energy...Neither Hermes nor Piratis is capable of any empathy for the TCs...This is very clear now..A man (Sampson) who went to see Makarios some years ago with a plan to exterminate all TCs of Cyprus in one night had just become President after a Greek junta led coup, whose leader Ionnides was Sampson's partner in crime during the meeting with Makarios where the wholesale massacre of the TCs were discussed,and you two see nothing alarming about that for the TCs in 74...
Fine,have it your way...I am really lost for words...I cannot believe how callous you can be ...My friends,with people like you around we need more than 40,000 Turkish troops to safeguard the lives of the people who live in the North of Cyprus...You can crow all you like about democracy and the EU principles,but nobody will ever listen to you,as long as you are deaf to the TC reality in Cyprus...

Bir, Samson has a son and he is probably a "Turk hater" as well. So maybe you should kill the remaining Greek Cypriots in order to "protect" yourselves from him?

Your excuses are really lame my friend.

1) The Turkish plan to ethnically cleanse Greek Cypriots in order to achieve partition existed since the 50s. Samson and others like him became "Turk haters" only after your plan for partition became public and only after the TCs initiated the inter-communal conflict.

2) Samson was nothing but a puppet and he would do whatever the Generals in Athens told him to do. The Muslim/Turkish minority in Greece was not harmed during the rule of the generals in Greece, and during the 5 days of the coup no single TC was harmed either. These are the FACTS.

3) You still didn't explain how protecting TCs from Samson is related with killing 1000s and ethnically cleansing 100s of thousands of innocent Cypriots.

4) Even after the coup and Samson fell, the Turks proceeded with a second phase in their invasion, killing and ethnically cleansing even more people and they continued to occupy Cyprus for 36 years since then. How does your "Samson excuse" give an answer to this?

Sorry mate, but your "interpretation" is really lame and can not pass from any kind of scrutiny.

The TCs and Turks wanted partition since the 50s, before any inter-communal conflict started. They took the opportunity of the coup, when our defenses were at their lowest since the coupists and the resistance fighters were fighting each other, to put into action their plan and partition Cyprus. Then they had to find some excuse for their crime. What you are repeating here is that lame excuse.

Funny how you ask for empathy while at the same time you excuse the murder of 1000s and the ethnic cleansing of 100s of thousands using such a lame excuse.

And it is pathetic how when you lose the argument you come to threaten us with even troops and even more crimes against us. This is how you want to win the argument Bir? You want to silence the truth with such threats? How pathetic!

You should also explain how executing unarmed TC's and dumping them into mass graves was going to achieve anything during an inevitable invasion which you had no power to stop? Obviously was not going to win you the war.

I'll tell you why, minimizing the TC population even further (which was the policy al along) in a state of panic. You saw defeat come and had to speed up the process. Hitler did it as well if you remember? Maximize the damage. Was not going to win him the war but he thought he might at least achieve his goal of eradication.

The question is, why the innocent unarmed civilians?

Holds absolutely no military advantage, only political!

I didn't excuse the killing of any innocent TCs. It was 100% inexcusable. Now if you also agreed that the murders of 1000s of unarmed GCs (also dumped in mass graves) and the ethnic cleansing of 100s of thousands of innocent Greek Cypriots was also inexcusable as well then we would came to an agreement. So why don't you?

Funny how you excuse the invasion which initiated the killings between GCs and TCs in 1974, but then you try to blame our side because you also had victims during the war that your side initiated.

We never did anything to minimize the TC population, so it is about time you stop lying about this. The annual growth of both TCs and GCs was the same (0.8%) between 1960 and 1973. And during the war of 1974 far more GCs were killed, so if anything it is the Turks who were trying to reduce our population.

According to the censuses which took place in Cyprus before the factual partition of the island, the Greek Cypriot community amounted to 447,901 (78,2%) in 1960, and to 498,511 (78,9%) in 1973. The Turkish Cypriot community numbered 103,822 (18,1%) people in 1960, and 116 000 (18,4%) in 1973. The total population of Cyprus was 572,707 in 1960 and 631,778 in 1973 (see Appendix 3, Table 1). An average rate of annual growth for both communities between 1960 and 1973 was similar and amounted to 0,8%. In consequence, the ethnic distribution of the population did not change between 1960 and 1974 and the proportion of each community remained stable.

http://assembly.coe.int/Documents/Worki ... OC9799.htm

Regarding Hitler, he used the same excuse as Turkey did when he invaded Czechoslovakia, to supposedly "protect" the German minority there. The similarities between Hitler and the Turkish leadership are obvious. (and the similarities do not stop there. The genocides that Hitler committed were not the first of the 20th century. The first ones were those committed by the Turks against the Armenians and the other Christian populations of Asia Minor)

[Piratis]

No,dear Piratis,pathetic is your attempts to put words in my mouth,to mislead people about what I am saying...Show me one line in all my posts here where I excuse the murdering of one person,let alone thousands...You can misinterpret what I am saying all you like...It will not change the reality..The reality you and your soulmates will always turn a blind eye to...You are the ones who are justifying the demand for Enosis,the tearing up of the foundation agreement of the RoC,excusing the exile of the TCs into enclaves,and denying their second class treatment in their own country during 1963-74 period...You have put your heads firmly in the official GC state propaganda guidelines,and you only lift your heads up to spew more of the lame arguments,while denying real life experiences of people like myself...I am not threatening anyone with anything...I am stating the obvious conclusion...Since by your arguments it is obvious the fanatical GC mentality is alive and well in Cyprus,given half the chance the mistreatment and the abuse you dished out to the Tcs in the past will inevitably be repeated...Now that you are more numerous and much better armed and trained than you were in 1974, more Turkish troops will be needed to keep the citizens of Northern Cyprus safe from fanatics like youself and others in this forum...It makes perfect sense...

When you excuse the invasion what exactly are you excusing if not the murder of 1000s and the ethnic cleansing of 100s of thousands? This is exactly what the invasion was all about. The Turks didn't make some commando operation to take out Samson, but a full scale invasion, killing and ethnically cleansing innocent people as per their partition plan decided since the 50s.

What I support are only what we have every right for, such as the right of the Cypriot people to freely and democratically decide the destiny of their own island, which includes the right to unite Cyprus with whomever we want, EU, Greece or China (as long as they accept us too).

You on the other hand choose to collaborate with foreign imperialists in order to impose by force your undemocratic and racist terms on the Cypriot people and deny to the people of Cyprus their human and democratic rights. The Turkish side initiated an inter-communal conflict in 1958 and a war in 1974 and the whole Cypriot population suffered, not just TCs. Yet you want to blame exclusively the GC side for what happened so you can use that as an excuse to continue violating the human and democratic rights of the vast majority of the Cypriot population.

Nothing that I support threatens the lives or the human rights of the Turkish Cypriots. What you need the Turkish army for is to blackmail us even more and gain even more on our expense. You want to take away our human and democratic rights, you want to take from us a large portion of our lands, and you want your minority of 18% to gain a disproportionally large amount of power. This is why you want the Turkish army.

[lovernomore]

No,dear Piratis,pathetic is your attempts to put words in my mouth,to mislead people about what I am saying...Show me one line in all my posts here where I excuse the murdering of one person,let alone thousands...You can misinterpret what I am saying all you like...It will not change the reality..The reality you and your soulmates will always turn a blind eye to...You are the ones who are justifying the demand for Enosis,the tearing up of the foundation agreement of the RoC,excusing the exile of the TCs into enclaves,and denying their second class treatment in their own country during 1963-74 period...You have put your heads firmly in the official GC state propaganda guidelines,and you only lift your heads up to spew more of the lame arguments,while denying real life experiences of people like myself...I am not threatening anyone with anything...I am stating the obvious conclusion...Since by your arguments it is obvious the fanatical GC mentality is alive and well in Cyprus,given half the chance the mistreatment and the abuse you dished out to the Tcs in the past will inevitably be repeated...Now that you are more numerous and much better armed and trained than you were in 1974, more Turkish troops will be needed to keep the citizens of Northern Cyprus safe from fanatics like youself and others in this forum...It makes perfect sense...

When you excuse the invasion what exactly are you excusing if not the murder of 1000s and the ethnic cleansing of 100s of thousands? This is exactly what the invasion was all about. The Turks didn't make some commando operation to take out Samson, but a full scale invasion, killing and ethnically cleansing innocent people as per their partition plan decided since the 50s.

What I support are only what we have every right for, such as the right of the Cypriot people to freely and democratically decide the destiny of their own island, which includes the right to unite Cyprus with whomever we want, EU, Greece or China (as long as they accept us too).

You on the other hand choose to collaborate with foreign imperialists in order to impose by force your undemocratic and racist terms on the Cypriot people and deny to the people of Cyprus their human and democratic rights. The Turkish side initiated an inter-communal conflict in 1958 and a war in 1974 and the whole Cypriot population suffered, not just TCs. Yet you want to blame exclusively the GC side for what happened so you can use that as an excuse to continue violating the human and democratic rights of the vast majority of the Cypriot population.

Nothing that I support threatens the lives or the human rights of the Turkish Cypriots. What you need the Turkish army for is to blackmail us even more and gain even more on our expense. You want to take away our human and democratic rights, you want to take from us a large portion of our lands, and you want your minority of 18% to gain a disproportionally large amount of power. This is why you want the Turkish army.

Piratis, I read 1 or 100 of your postes, they are all the same rubbish. I wonder sometimes if you are real or a computer program.