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"No" to a New Partnership

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"No" to a New Partnership

Postby MrH » Wed Oct 13, 2010 9:27 am

When will the UN, EU and Turkish Cypriots understand that the Greek Cypriots DO NOT, AND WILL NOT, ACCEPT a
PARTNERSHIP
agreement for the resolution of the Cyprus problem. That's NOT part of Greek Cypriot policy.
They (the GCs) want a Unified island with Protected MINORITY Rights
- assuming that the
Turkish Cypriots do NOT Qualify for "PARTNERSHIP" Status on the island of Cyprus
, assuming that the
Original conditions of the 1960 Treaty is null and void and the Amended Republic of Cyprus Treaty; of Today, is what an agreement should be based on
.

This is the issue in a Nutshell, and like many of Mr Ban Ki Moon's predecessors, he too, will hit a brick wall on the Cyprus problem within the next few months. Let's Stop messing about with pointless tit-for-tat agreements and Get to the Crunch. The Greek Cypriots believe in a Completely different Scenario to what the Turkish Cypriots do, the Greek Cypriots Want and believe in what I have said above. If this is not to be accepted by the Turkish Cypriots, then why all this time wasting tactics?

Or are they NOT? Has Turkey's Agenda Changed? What are the Greek Cypriots holding on to?

I know there are many questions and answers to seek in this debate, but I believe we should ultimately concentrate on only one: Which is the best, and most REALISTIC, way the Cyprus issue can move forward? When considering that Turkey will now obviously NOT become an EU member soon (and the fact that it's also losing interest), which is also building even more uncertainty on the original Greek Cypriot tactic of "Cornering" Turkey (as one diplomat said back in 1997 when they [the GCs] started its talks with the EU) into a Greek Cypriot style agreement, are there truly any other options left but to seek an amicable "Velvet style" split?

I know it's hard for the average Greek Cypriot person to think past the realm of the European Union, but it must be said, and realised, that as there is just no way Turkey will become an EU member soon (and I can not reiterate this enough), what possible anchor is there left to somehow convince Turkey in accepting a Greek Cypriot desired agreement? What are the Greek Cypriots now holding this unrealistic rope with?

In the words of Klafcos Clerides, "
The failure to endorse the Annan Plan in 2004 has set the cogs rolling for the eventual recognition of the TRNC. Even accepting the basis of the idea of its referendum was a huge political mistake for the Greek Cypriots"
.
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Postby Me Ed » Wed Oct 13, 2010 9:52 am

When you talk about a partnership from a TC point of view, what do you mean exactly?

In what form do you exactly see this partnership working?
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Postby Nikitas » Wed Oct 13, 2010 10:00 am

Put yourself in the shoes of a GC average joe on the street and ask yourself if you would accept the "partnership" which is presented. You would laugh at it and here is why:

The 18 per cent minority gets equal political status, 30 per cent of the territory, rotating presidency, right to veto all state workings, permanent presence of foreign troops, pays zilch in land compensation for those that lose their property, and establishes a perpetual apartheid against the majority in the form of a deviation of EU and European Human Rights Charter provisions.

TCs are not exactly the champions of political marketing when it comes to selling their vision of a solution, are they?
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Postby MrH » Wed Oct 13, 2010 10:03 am

I believe the Turkish Cypriot government have said that one option could be to tackle this based on the highly Successful and working Bi-Communal, Bi-Zonal - Swiss-style Confederation Model; Two Constituent States with a Loose Central Government and a certain amount of autonomy for each side. This would guarantee both the unification of the island, and at the same time safe guard the interests (sensitive interests) of both the Turkish and Greek Cypriots on the island. I know many Greek Cypriots do not agree to this, but there are many that do!
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Postby Me Ed » Wed Oct 13, 2010 12:01 pm

What about freedom of movement?
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Postby wyoming cowboy » Wed Oct 13, 2010 12:04 pm

MrH wrote:I believe the Turkish Cypriot government have said that one option could be to tackle this based on the highly Successful and working Bi-Communal, Bi-Zonal - Swiss-style Confederation Model; Two Constituent States with a Loose Central Government and a certain amount of autonomy for each side. This would guarantee both the unification of the island, and at the same time safe guard the interests (sensitive interests) of both the Turkish and Greek Cypriots on the island. I know many Greek Cypriots do not agree to this, but there are many that do!



its obvious that the tc and turkey have no other option but to accept a true federation.......
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Re: "No" to a New Partnership

Postby Get Real! » Wed Oct 13, 2010 12:30 pm

MrH wrote:When will the UN, EU and Turkish Cypriots understand that the Greek Cypriots DO NOT, AND WILL NOT, ACCEPT a
PARTNERSHIP

Cyprus is a sovereign UN member COUNTRY, not a business venture so no such thing as a “partnership” can ever apply to Cyprus! :roll:

But even if Cyprus was a BUSINESS, where is your CAPITAL to earn your percentage of ownership?
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Postby MrH » Wed Oct 13, 2010 1:07 pm

Get Real,

What Rubbish are you talking about?

In 1974, after Greece tried to annex the island on the 15th July 1974 and Turkey responded, Britain agreed, wrongly, to allow the ROC to continue under the Administration of the Greek Cypriots BUT locked in an endless UN based negotiations process in order to seek an amicable deal BASED on the Original 1960 Structure of a PARTNERSHIP Agreement, and then later updated with the High Level Agreements. That is why Your leaders have always been COMPELLED to sit at a table and discuss such a deal, and that is why the INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY has never felt it RIGHT to FORCE Turkey to leave Northern Cyprus - as they are there under the INVITATION of the PARTNER-Turkish Cypriot people of the ORIGINAL REPUBLIC OF CYPRUS. Man are you IGNORANT.

Wake up man. What are you EXACTLY trying to Say. The ISLAND will ALWAYS be Locked in this UNITED NATIONS Process until either an amicable PARTNERSHIP Agreement is found or Partition of Some kind, following the example of other CONFLICT Area, acts as a basis for perhaps a future agreement.

If the MEMEBER of the EU of the GREEK CYPRIOT ROC had any significance and had ORIGINALLY been thought of as a MEANS to solving the Issue, Clearly the GREEK CYPRIOT Administration has messed it up for the Block. I DO NOT See the EU DEMANDING Turkey to abid by what the Greek Cypriots say as Turkey is Still, after so many GC thought Blunders by Turkey, an EU-Candidate Country. If your EU application was so IMPORTANT, what the hell is the EU stilll doing agreeing to Turkey's EU Candidancy. Come on Man, stop talking Rubbish.

The Truth of the matter is that Turkey is moving AWAY from the EU due to this Double Standards policy and the Greek Cypriots will eventually realise that the EU will act as a double-edged sword when PUSH comes to SHOVE. At the moment, you guys have been lucky, but Turkey is no longer having any more of it. Either the Cyprus issue is resolved as a BBF Confederal Formula, Two States or Turkey leaves the EU UNTIL the EU feels the back hand of the policy of the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.

Jesus Christ Get Real....of all people, you must know how politics affecting our people both in Turkey, Greece and Cyprus works. If YOU are so right, then answer this......Why is Christofias so bent on Blaming EROGLU for walking away from the "UN LEAD NEGOTIATIONS" and NOT HIMSELF? Come on man, even my 15 year old son studying for his GCSE exams can tell you the answer to that - and he regards himself as a Social Democrat!

The Strength the GCs rely so much (by being this all great member of the EU) on is an illusionary one, one that will be their ultimate failure if they do not broker a FEDERAL/CONFEDERAL Deal based on other examples seen around the world.
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Postby paliometoxo » Wed Oct 13, 2010 1:15 pm

MrH wrote:I believe the Turkish Cypriot government have said that one option could be to tackle this based on the highly Successful and working Bi-Communal, Bi-Zonal - Swiss-style Confederation Model; Two Constituent States with a Loose Central Government and a certain amount of autonomy for each side. This would guarantee both the unification of the island, and at the same time safe guard the interests (sensitive interests) of both the Turkish and Greek Cypriots on the island. I know many Greek Cypriots do not agree to this, but there are many that do!


how is two states unification... its partition under the pretence of reunifications under one state but really two? then tcs have full control and access to our resources and a president in the south and us nothing in the north? thats what you north turks are trying to do, take control over cyprus nto just have equal rights and two states because we would kill you all if we took down the borders?


rubbish you will never have partition in any form
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Postby boomerang » Wed Oct 13, 2010 1:41 pm

boomerang wrote:
Cyprus and the 2010 OSCE Mediterranean Conference
by Alfred A. Farrugia

Alfred A. Farrugia


The Organisation for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE) is convening the 2010 Mediterranean Conference in Malta this week on 14 and 15 October. Malta and Cyprus are OSCE participating states as well as European Union members.

It remains to be seen whether the OSCE will address the situation in Cyprus in the course of this conference. It will indeed be strange if the OSCE were to convene such a conference and fail to discuss the occupation of an OSCE participating state in the Mediterranean by another OSCE participating state from the same region. It is not the first time that such an anomaly has arisen.

The theme of the 2010 OSCE Mediterranean Conference is “The Dialogue on the Future of European Security – A Mediterranean Perspective”. As may be expected, the three main sessions of the conference will cover the so-called three “baskets” of the OSCE, that is the politico-military dimension, the economic dimension, and the human dimension. In these sessions the “Confidence- and security-building measures (CSBMs) – the OSCE experience and the Mediterranean perspective”; “OSCE experiences in fostering security and stability by dealing with economic and environmental challenges”; and “the promotion of OSCE commitments and exchange of experiences on tolerance and non-discrimination by OSCE participating States and the Mediterranean Partners” will be discussed.

All these issues have their implications for Cyprus. How can the OSCE discuss confidence- and security-building measures when the basic principles of the OSCE enshrined in the Helsinki Final Act of 35 years ago have been completely ignored by the relevant participating states of the OSCE ever since it was established?



Principles

In the case of Cyprus, Turkey has failed to respect and put into practise the OSCE’s first principle of sovereign equality. Turkey has similarly violated the principle of refraining from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity of Cyprus; it has disregarded the principle of the inviolability of frontiers. What has the OSCE done during the past 35 years about Turkey’s refusal to abide by its commitment towards Cyprus’ territorial integrity, and the principle of non-intervention in the internal affairs of another state? Those are five basic principles of the OSCE that Turkey has completely ignored. There are more.

Is Turkey providing information on the military forces it is stationing in the north of Cyprus in the OSCE’s Annual Exchange of Military Information, as it committed to do in the Vienna Document on CSBMs? Is Turkey providing details on the allocation of resources in its budget to maintain its military forces in the north of Cyprus, as it is obliged to do by the same Document on Defence Planning?

Are the OSCE diplomats aware of the economic and environmental implications of the occupation of the northern part of Cyprus by Turkey? Have any of the diplomats read the table in Appendix 1 (Volume Two) of the study compiled by Stella Soulioti entitled “Fettered Independence – Cyprus, 1878 – 1964”, namely the extent of control gained by Turkish invasion forces on the Cypriot economy?



IDPs

How can the OSCE discuss the human dimension and tolerance in a Mediterranean conference and forget the internally displaced persons (IDPs) on the island of Cyprus? Although the United Nations is dealing with the Cyprus question, there is nothing to stop the OSCE from doing the same in terms of Chapter VIII of the UN Charter – on regional arrangements. The OSCE has apparently forgotten its self-proclaimed principle of “OSCE first”!

In operative paragraph 4 of the UN Security Council Resolution 361 (1974) adopted on 30 August 1974, the Security Council expressed its grave concern at the plight of the refugees and other people displaced as a result of the situation in Cyprus and urged for their return to their homes in safety! Thirty-six years have passed since then, and the current concept of a bi-communal, bi-zonal federation is undermining that element of the UN resolution.

Turkish Cypriots and Greek Cypriots have the same rights as internally displaced persons (IDPs) to return to their homes, as the IDPs of Darfur have at the present time – UN Security Council Resolution 1935 (2010), operative paragraph 15, adopted on 30 July 2010.

The concessions made during the time of the Cold War, and in response to the unilateral declaration made by the leaders in the occupied north, may have made sense in those times. Now, with Cyprus as a member of the European Union, such concessions do not make sense any more, and are counter-productive if Cyprus is interested in keeping its unity, sovereignty and territorial integrity. Is a bi-zonal, bi-communal federation not another subtle form of separation or “taksim”?

Turkish Cypriots and Greek Cypriots should be free to live wherever they like, including in their former homes or their parents’ and ancestors’ homes, if they wish to do so, rather than seek compensation for their usurped and expropriated homes.

The basic human needs of Turkish Cypriots – their identity, recognition and security – like those of Greek Cypriots, need to be satisfied. Turkish Cypriots should be free to join any Cypriot national political party. In a parliamentary democracy they can have enough power to bring down any national Cypriot government if their basic needs are not met. They deserve to be a part of one Cyprus.

These are the issues that an OSCE Mediterranean conference could discuss, if the diplomats concerned had the political will to do so. The diplomats at the conference in Malta could devote whole sessions on Cyprus, if they want to. It is useless for the OSCE to declare at the last ministerial council meeting that it wants to get involved in conflict resolution, if it ignores a long protracted conflict in the Mediterranean such as the one in Cyprus. The OSCE is rendering itself irrelevant to such an important conflict when it could use its institutions to try and give a contribution to its solution.


The author is a retired diplomat who served at the Permanent Mission of Malta to the UN in New York, at the Delegation of Malta to the OSCE in Vienna, and at the Embassy of Malta to the United States in Washington DC as the Deputy Chief of Mission. He is also a Ph.D. candidate at the Institute for Conflict Analysis and Resolution (ICAR), George Mason University (GMU), Virginia, conducting research on peace building in Cyprus.

http://www.independent.com.mt/news.asp?newsitemid=113474


Mr Head, as my good friend AL said

You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time.


people...this guy is a bullshit artist and on a windup...amuses me seing that you guys don't see it...

just the other day he said his newspaper CM will print some bullshit and today the same paper printed the complete opposite to what Mr. head was saying... :lol:

downer says
Speaking after meeting President Demetris Christofias, Downer said the UN did not have any plans to host an international conference on the Cyprus problem and reiterated that nothing was agreed in the negotiations until everything is agreed.


He added: “nothing is agreed until everything is agreed; if you don’t agree on one chapter – you might agree on all the others – but if you can’t agree on one then you haven’t got a comprehensive agreement.”

http://www.cyprus-mail.com/cyprus/downer-no-plans-international-conference/20101013

simply put Mr Head and his blackberry are bullshit artists... :lol:
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