Cyprus-Forum.com

[Oracle]

The problem with Brits, Russians etc speculating with property in Cyprus is that they have several properties on the go!

If one goes wrong; that is all we hear about!

They remain quiet about the umpteen they have made hundreds of thousands of euros on.

Rather myopic, dontcha think!

[Milo]

Up until a few years ago O, foreigners only had permission from the Council of Ministers to buy one property. Us Brits and Russians that is. I think there was a window of opportunity for locals to make money at the start, but for foreigners we all soon found out that any money you managed to squeeze out of sale soon got ate up by the Developer cancelling your contract for you the Lawyer charging excessive fees and then IF you came away with a profit CGT,s so any profit all gone I sold my first and only property here purely because I could,nt get the Deeds, the Cypriot man who bought was,nt concerned about them, he is now.

Buying one property for any of us has more than enough insurmountable problems. Buying more would be a death sentence health wise. Investors always take gambles, thats upto them.

Others just bought a property with in many cases their life savings, yet two more cases in Larnaca today (in fact most days)one who had been struggling for five years for justice, another for over three years, cases in Paralimni Court never stop. You need to do some proper research on the subject.

Anyone foreign who has made hundreds of thousands of euros on property in Cyprus came in from the planet Ogg and left again As I,ve never heard of them.

[Svetlana]

The problem with Brits, Russians etc speculating with property in Cyprus is that they have several properties on the go!

If one goes wrong; that is all we hear about!

They remain quiet about the umpteen they have made hundreds of thousands of euros on.

Rather myopic, dontcha think!

I don't think anyone has suggested that there are not many painfree property purchases. The point is, the Law as it stands, do not protect purchasers when things go wrong. With the downturn in the property market, things are going to go wrong, much more often, than in the past. Surely laws are in place to protect allparties to a transaction?

[bill cobbett]

At the back of my mind... the victims in all this mess go far beyond those directly involved (and again best wishes to L and others in their disputes), the victims must also include the general CY Taxpayer (and there are some am sure).

How many millions of Euros (or could it be billions?) are owed by developers to the CY Treasury? Sums that ain't due 'til the title transfer process is started? How many schools and general hospitals or roads or health-care or even arms for defence etc etc would those ball-park amounts buy?

If am right goes to show the power of the developer lobby and the ineptitude and weakness of government in the face of it, when it doesn't act to make a small change to the law and, amongst benefits to house purchasers, collect taxes due.

Even more generally where does this fiasco leave the CY economy? Is it sitting on a time-bomb because of wider implications, given the sums that may be involved in this mess?

[CBBB]

At the back of my mind... the victims in all this mess go far beyond those directly involved (and again best wishes to L and others in their disputes), the victims must also include the general CY Taxpayer (and there are some am sure).

How many millions of Euros (or could it be billions?) are owed by developers to the CY Treasury? Sums that ain't due 'til the title transfer process is started? How many schools and general hospitals or roads or health-care or even arms for defence etc etc would those ball-park amounts buy?

If am right goes to show the power of the developer lobby and the ineptitude and weakness of government in the face of it, when it doesn't act to make a small change to the law and, amongst benefits to house purchasers, collect taxes due.

Even more generally where does this fiasco leave the CY economy? Is it sitting on a time-bomb because of wider implications, given the sums that may be involved in this mess?

Well the Banks are screwed, even if they repossess the property that has mortgages on it, what can they do with it?

The fact that the Chairman of the Bank of Cyprus is also one of the biggest developers in Paphos won't help matters, except for him!

[bill cobbett]

At the back of my mind... the victims in all this mess go far beyond those directly involved (and again best wishes to L and others in their disputes), the victims must also include the general CY Taxpayer (and there are some am sure).

How many millions of Euros (or could it be billions?) are owed by developers to the CY Treasury? Sums that ain't due 'til the title transfer process is started? How many schools and general hospitals or roads or health-care or even arms for defence etc etc would those ball-park amounts buy?

If am right goes to show the power of the developer lobby and the ineptitude and weakness of government in the face of it, when it doesn't act to make a small change to the law and, amongst benefits to house purchasers, collect taxes due.

Even more generally where does this fiasco leave the CY economy? Is it sitting on a time-bomb because of wider implications, given the sums that may be involved in this mess?

Well the Banks are screwed, even if they repossess the property that has mortgages on it, what can they do with it?

The fact that the Chairman of the Bank of Cyprus is also one of the biggest developers in Paphos won't help matters, except for him!

Absolutely mate, and isn't this the largest part of this incestuous problem...

Developers = Banks = Government ?????

[B25]

At the back of my mind... the victims in all this mess go far beyond those directly involved (and again best wishes to L and others in their disputes), the victims must also include the general CY Taxpayer (and there are some am sure).

How many millions of Euros (or could it be billions?) are owed by developers to the CY Treasury? Sums that ain't due 'til the title transfer process is started? How many schools and general hospitals or roads or health-care or even arms for defence etc etc would those ball-park amounts buy?

If am right goes to show the power of the developer lobby and the ineptitude and weakness of government in the face of it, when it doesn't act to make a small change to the law and, amongst benefits to house purchasers, collect taxes due.

Even more generally where does this fiasco leave the CY economy? Is it sitting on a time-bomb because of wider implications, given the sums that may be involved in this mess?

Well the Banks are screwed, even if they repossess the property that has mortgages on it, what can they do with it?

The fact that the Chairman of the Bank of Cyprus is also one of the biggest developers in Paphos won't help matters, except for him!

Absolutely mate, and isn't this the largest part of this incestuous problem...

Developers = Banks = Government ?????

You left out lawyers mate, the biggest culprits.

Developers = Banks = Lawyers = Government ??

[bill cobbett]

At the back of my mind... the victims in all this mess go far beyond those directly involved (and again best wishes to L and others in their disputes), the victims must also include the general CY Taxpayer (and there are some am sure).

How many millions of Euros (or could it be billions?) are owed by developers to the CY Treasury? Sums that ain't due 'til the title transfer process is started? How many schools and general hospitals or roads or health-care or even arms for defence etc etc would those ball-park amounts buy?

If am right goes to show the power of the developer lobby and the ineptitude and weakness of government in the face of it, when it doesn't act to make a small change to the law and, amongst benefits to house purchasers, collect taxes due.

Even more generally where does this fiasco leave the CY economy? Is it sitting on a time-bomb because of wider implications, given the sums that may be involved in this mess?

Well the Banks are screwed, even if they repossess the property that has mortgages on it, what can they do with it?

The fact that the Chairman of the Bank of Cyprus is also one of the biggest developers in Paphos won't help matters, except for him!

Absolutely mate, and isn't this the largest part of this incestuous problem...

Developers = Banks = Government ?????

You left out lawyers mate, the biggest culprits.

Developers = Banks = Lawyers = Government ??

ooooooops , yes def throw them in to the equation.

[Milo]

At the back of my mind... the victims in all this mess go far beyond those directly involved (and again best wishes to L and others in their disputes), the victims must also include the general CY Taxpayer (and there are some am sure).

How many millions of Euros (or could it be billions?) are owed by developers to the CY Treasury? Sums that ain't due 'til the title transfer process is started? How many schools and general hospitals or roads or health-care or even arms for defence etc etc would those ball-park amounts buy?

If am right goes to show the power of the developer lobby and the ineptitude and weakness of government in the face of it, when it doesn't act to make a small change to the law and, amongst benefits to house purchasers, collect taxes due.

Even more generally where does this fiasco leave the CY economy? Is it sitting on a time-bomb because of wider implications, given the sums that may be involved in this mess?

Developers taxes are anyones guess but the inland revenue is actually chasing a BUYER for the now bankrupt developers taxes, so maybe they have found a loophole.

For campaigners, the crux of the problem is that we have a system resulting from general inaction by successive governments; an absence of clamping down on conniving developers, lawyers and banks; bureaucracy and alleged corruption in public administration; a lack of confidence in the local legal process; and a body of property law that is not sufficient for preventing or penalising abuse.

The amnesty planned again this time, didn’t work five years ago, and it won’t work now. Developers simply can’t afford to have Title Deeds issued because of their mortgages. I refer to the practice of allowing a developer to register a sales contract with the Land Registry instead of a Title Deed, the government has created a monster.

What really needs to happen is for a team of qualified legal experts to sit down, scrap the whole lot of the existing law, and rewrite it on a healthy basis. What is happening now is like giving an injection to a dead body which is already in the morgue.

It has been suggested by campaigners that one way of solving the deeds problem is for the government to focus on the estimated €5 billion in transfer tax it would realise if and when the 100,000+ outstanding deeds are issued. This would create options for dealing with the developers’ estimated €4 billion debt.
The bottom line is that if the government gives a guarantee to everyone that they will get Title Deeds, this would solve the problem overnight, and help the economy.”

When loans go bad, the banks tend to chase the deed-less “owner” of a house standing on mortgaged land rather than the person who took actually out the mortgage.

Why would developers make payments on a mortgage when they know they will not be penalised if they don’t?

[denizaksulu]

At the back of my mind... the victims in all this mess go far beyond those directly involved (and again best wishes to L and others in their disputes), the victims must also include the general CY Taxpayer (and there are some am sure).

How many millions of Euros (or could it be billions?) are owed by developers to the CY Treasury? Sums that ain't due 'til the title transfer process is started? How many schools and general hospitals or roads or health-care or even arms for defence etc etc would those ball-park amounts buy?

If am right goes to show the power of the developer lobby and the ineptitude and weakness of government in the face of it, when it doesn't act to make a small change to the law and, amongst benefits to house purchasers, collect taxes due.

Even more generally where does this fiasco leave the CY economy? Is it sitting on a time-bomb because of wider implications, given the sums that may be involved in this mess?

You are a brave man indeed BC to be able to tell the truth like that without the usual criticism and condemnation from certain corners of the cf. (small letters as Thats how much the cf is valued now.)