Cyprus-Forum.com

[erolz]

Erolz, what we are asking is return to legality. If you refuse this, it is not our fault.

We demanded nothing maximal. What we demand is for the RoC compromise (which is the only legal thing) to be allowed to function as it should.

Sorry to labour this point but

You claim to be asking for a 'return to legality', yet you also claim that the illegal and unconsitutional acts by the GC admin in the 60's (refusing to implement 30% government jobs as per the consitution, refusal to implement provisions on municipalites as per the constituion, refusal to accept and recognise the supreme courts ruling on such) were 'valid' based on those provisions being 'unfair' whilst at the same time charactersing the legal and consitutional response of the TC community to use their veto powers to block the acceptance of the budget as 'retalitation' to these prior illegal and unconstituional acts by GC leadership as "an abuse of power" on the part of TC leadership.

It is hard given the above to not come to a conclusion that to your idea of 'legality' is very different to mine, just as our ideas on what democracy demands are also very different.

[Piratis]

Erolz, what you say simply proves my point that what we are asking: return to legality, RoC recognition etc, is not a maximalistic goal since the return to such legality is far from the ideal for us.

After 1960 many GCs wanted union with Greece, and many TCs wanted partition. This is what brought the disaster. The 1960 agreements were the compromise. Now we abandoned our demands for enosis, can you also abandon your demands for partition so we can finally settle for the only compromise ever agreed?

Coming to the particular of the 30% governmental positions, yes I believe it is unfair. You disagree? I believe that TCs should voluntarily accept this percentage to go down to their population percentage. I also believe we have the right to challenge this law throw the European courts. Beyond that I never said that we have the right to remove this legal right of yours. what you say is what happened the 60s, were both sides had aims that were not the independence of one united Cyprus. I never claimed that what we should do now should be what we have done in the 60s. If you do the same, then RoC can work for both communities.

[erolz]

Erolz, what you say simply proves my point that what we are asking: return to legality, RoC recognition etc, is not a maximalistic goal since the return to such legality is far from the ideal for us.

We are getting cross threaded here (mainly my fault) but I have never said return to 60's agrements was maximalist, just that insiting on recognition of RoC as it is today (and not as it is under 60's agreements) by Turkey was maximalist.

Now we abandoned our demands for enosis, can you also abandon your demands for partition so we can finally settle for the only compromise ever agreed?

I believe the GC community then had two interconnected demands firstly that a GC numerical majority should have the right to impose it's purely GC desires on the TC community (whatever those GC as opposed to Cypriot desire may have been) and enosis. I accept the GC community today has abandoned ENOSIS - I am not so convinced they have abandoned the first desire.

Coming to the particular of the 30% governmental positions, yes I believe it is unfair. You disagree? I believe that TCs should voluntarily accept this percentage to go down to their population percentage. I also believe we have the right to challenge this law throw the European courts. Beyond that I never said that we have the right to remove this legal right of yours. what you say is what happened the 60s, were both sides had aims that were not the independence of one united Cyprus. I never claimed that what we should do now should be what we have done in the 60s. If you do the same, then RoC can work for both communities.

OK that is clearer but I guess I need to try and explain how your approach / interpretation to what happened in the 60's makes me fear otherwise. If you were to admit that the GC admins actions in the 60's re refusing to implement the 30% ratio and implement the municplaites sections of the 60s agreements and then ignore the supreme court ruling on this issue where illegal and inappropriate ways to seek to change what they considered unfair provisions then - it would be easier to accept that you also think that would / should be the case in a future return to the 60 agreements. In reverse if when we have discussion about this period the only response you make to the then GC admins actions on these issues is to talk about how it is right to change 'unfair' laws and make no condemnation of the GC means of doing this and also cvharterise the legal and consitituional acts of the TC admin made in respionse as an 'abuse of power' it is much harder for me to accept what you say above at face value.

[Viewpoint]

Piratis

Coming to the particular of the 30% governmental positions, yes I believe it is unfair. You disagree? I believe that TCs should voluntarily accept this percentage to go down to their population percentage. I also believe we have the right to challenge this law throw the European courts.

GC mindset has not changed at all, they will take everything to EU courts until Akritas is activated and they create the greek cypriot state with us as a minority, the underhand hidden agendas that we fear and fuels our warranted mistrust of GCs is clearly evident in what Piratis says, if we cant agree it with you we will force through the EU and get revenge for 1974....they are not what they seem...take extreme care..

[-mikkie2-]

refusing to implement 30% government jobs as per the consitution

Erol,

If you refered to your favourite web site (www.cyprus-conflict.net) you will find that it says that the government did its best to recruit the 30% TC's into government jobs. They could not fill these posts because there were not enough qulaified people to do these jobs! The government did not refuse to implement this. They simply could not do it.

[erolz]

refusing to implement 30% government jobs as per the consitution

Erol,

If you refered to your favourite web site (www.cyprus-conflict.net)

Firstly thats not my favourite website. It's not even my favourite cyprus related website - that would have to be www.cyprus-forum.com

Secondly a link to the relevant part would be nice and useful and helpful

you will find that it says that the government did its best to recruit the 30% TC's into government jobs. They could not fill these posts because there were not enough qulaified people to do these jobs! The government did not refuse to implement this. They simply could not do it.

Maybe so. It's also possible that this was used as an 'excuse' I guess but I do not have a view one way or another. For convience sake let's say I accpet that.

What about refusal to implement the municiplites provisions and the subsequent refusal of GC admin of RoC to accept the supreme court ruling on the issue?