Cyprus-Forum.com

[Acikgoz]

[CopperLine]

True solution, my foot, Piratis. In 2004 you voted for the Turkish army to stay in Cyprus and for the settlers to keep coming (sorry Kikapu, solution in 2004 would have stemmed the influx of settlers). Now you have the audacity to ask for true solution. Do you think this is a game and you can play or quit at will?

The aim of the Turkish army was to partition Cyprus and make 1/3rd of Cyprus Turkish. With Annan plan the Turkish army would have achieved its aim.

You voted for the legalization of the results of the invasion and as far as the Settlers go none would leave, more would come, and 10s of thousands of them would be given the Cypriot citizenship and roam free in the whole Cyprus.

Whatever, Piratis. Whatever.

You are still left without settlement. You are still left with a declining TC proportion of the population and an increasing proportion of Turkish citizens. Each further day that this goes on the difficulty of securing any kind of viable settlement let alone an equitable one becomes more and more unlikely. Let's assume for one illusory moment that your historical description was accurate and true : so what ? You still are not one iota closer to securing a settlement. Your position is utterly irrelevant to sorting the Cyprus problem but I wholeheartedly agree that you have a right to piss in the wind for another forty years.

[CopperLine]

Pratis, I now see this going on for a few decades, consider most the immigrants came in the last decade, their children will be born here, they will have made their homes and lives here. You will never be able to "get rid of them". THEY ARE HERE TO STAY, and they are a damn sight closer to countrymen than our supposed bretheren the Greek Cypriots.

When Crete was liberated they send all the Turks back to Turkey even though those Turks were in Crete for 2 centuries. So how do you know that the Turkish Settlers in Cyprus are "here to stay"?

The Turkish Settlers are not welcomed to Cyprus because they were brought here by Turkey with the intention of changing the demographics of our island. Therefore when Cyprus will be liberated they will go back to their homeland.

Piratis,you've often posted about the rights of people and how you are a supporter of human rights. Here you say that Turks were expelled from Crete despite two centuries of living there (on that logic French and British Canadians and British and Irish Australians should start packing their bags as well) in ....when ? .. in 1898. And you think that the ways and means of 1898 are okay for today ? Today international and other law,including basic human rights law - which you have repeatedly said are so important to you - has prohibited (quite rightly) exactly what you are advocating and sympathetic to. So which is it to be : respect of human rights and upholding international law or expelling Turks and Turkish Cypriots ? Which one Piratis ?

For all Turkish Cypriots their homeland is Cyprus (there's a clue in the suffix 'Cypriot'). For many if not most Turkish people in Cyprus the return to their 'homeland' would not be a choice but would be under coercion. And coercing people through an expulsion based on their ethnicity is what you've also said that you are against, ethnic cleansing. So which is it to be Piratis : consistency in respect of human rights and upholding international law or ethnic cleansing ? Which one, Piratis ?

[Get Real!]

You are still left without settlement. You are still left with a declining TC proportion of the population and an increasing proportion of Turkish citizens. Each further day that this goes on the difficulty of securing any kind of viable settlement let alone an equitable one becomes more and more unlikely. Let's assume for one illusory moment that your historical description was accurate and true : so what ? You still are not one iota closer to securing a settlement. Your position is utterly irrelevant to sorting the Cyprus problem but I wholeheartedly agree that you have a right to piss in the wind for another forty years.

Tell that to the US, Britain, EU, and every other corrupt power out there who only abide by whichever international laws suit them!

Don’t expect Cypriots to “accommodate” themselves within the new world disorder of absurdities and illegalities!

What doesn’t make sense and doesn’t work, simply cannot exist!

[Bananiot]

There you are Copperline. The whole world is corrupt and lucky for the world we are steadfast in upholding international law and saving face for the world. Bad luck for the Palestinians we forgot the international law and sided with Israel when we thought the Jewish state would wipe Turkey from the face of the earth during the recent crisis. Piratis was dead right then, just like everybody else we should look after our own interests, he judged, and at one instance he canceled himself out. Now, he talks about international law again ...

[RichardB]

What is the British ex pat population in the occupied area of Cyprus?

A figure of 22,000 was mentioned on the ITV 'Homes from Hell' programme. That's quite a lot of ex pats living in hell, in homes which aren't theirs.

Didn't realise it was that many!

Be interesting to get figures on how many have moved over in the last couple of years since the Orams case etc.

That must be 7-8% of the population in the north

Out of interest what is the number of Brits now in the ROC (yes I know I could look it up but its been a long day and I can't be arsed.)

[paliometoxo]

I thought the Turks where tc s now?

[AWE]

I thought the Turks where tc s now?

Many are now and they will get to vote in a referendum on any proposed solution, as they did with AP4, therefore any solution that doesn't take into consideration their interest is likely to fail this test.

Of course any solution that does take in to account their situation is likely to fail the same test in the south. So any solution rejected by RoC /GCs strengthens the TRNC/TCs/TR position of 'they don't want a solution based on a BBF as agreed in the '70s'.

Stalemate.

[Piratis]

Pratis, I now see this going on for a few decades, consider most the immigrants came in the last decade, their children will be born here, they will have made their homes and lives here. You will never be able to "get rid of them". THEY ARE HERE TO STAY, and they are a damn sight closer to countrymen than our supposed bretheren the Greek Cypriots.

When Crete was liberated they send all the Turks back to Turkey even though those Turks were in Crete for 2 centuries. So how do you know that the Turkish Settlers in Cyprus are "here to stay"?

The Turkish Settlers are not welcomed to Cyprus because they were brought here by Turkey with the intention of changing the demographics of our island. Therefore when Cyprus will be liberated they will go back to their homeland.

Piratis,you've often posted about the rights of people and how you are a supporter of human rights. Here you say that Turks were expelled from Crete despite two centuries of living there (on that logic French and British Canadians and British and Irish Australians should start packing their bags as well) in ....when ? .. in 1898. And you think that the ways and means of 1898 are okay for today ? Today international and other law,including basic human rights law - which you have repeatedly said are so important to you - has prohibited (quite rightly) exactly what you are advocating and sympathetic to. So which is it to be : respect of human rights and upholding international law or expelling Turks and Turkish Cypriots ? Which one Piratis ?

For all Turkish Cypriots their homeland is Cyprus (there's a clue in the suffix 'Cypriot'). For many if not most Turkish people in Cyprus the return to their 'homeland' would not be a choice but would be under coercion. And coercing people through an expulsion based on their ethnicity is what you've also said that you are against, ethnic cleansing. So which is it to be Piratis : consistency in respect of human rights and upholding international law or ethnic cleansing ? Which one, Piratis ?

Deporting the illegal Settlers is not "ethnic cleansing". Ethnic cleansing is what the Turks did against us, and the illegal Settlers that they bring on our island is yet another one of their crimes.

You have no problem with the ethnic cleansing of the Cypriot people and you want to force on Cyprus some "solution" based on the results of this ethnic cleansing that would create some "Turkish State" on land were Greeks have been the vast majority for 1000s of years, but you have a problem with us re-claiming our own territory and reverting the illegal Turkification attempted by Turkey?

Cyprus will be liberated sooner or later, and those settlers will be send back to Turkey regardless of how much time passes. If this will result in any human right violation of those people then the blame for this rest 100% on the Turkish government and the Turkish army.

If you push somebody down from a tall building you can't blame the law of gravity for his fall. Similarly if you send Settlers illegally to Cyprus you can't blame the Cypriots for enforcing their laws and defending their own country from the foreign invaders. The one responsible for the Settlers problem is Turkey and nobody else.

[Piratis]

I thought the Turks where tc s now?

Many are now and they will get to vote in a referendum on any proposed solution, as they did with AP4, therefore any solution that doesn't take into consideration their interest is likely to fail this test.

So it seems that today the term "Turkish Cypriot" denotes somebody who is about as native to Cyprus as "Sri Lankan Cypriots". (with the difference that most "Sri Lankan Cypriots" are legally in Cyprus, while most "Turkish Cypriots" are not)

Of course any solution that does take in to account their situation is likely to fail the same test in the south. So any solution rejected by RoC /GCs strengthens the TRNC/TCs/TR position of 'they don't want a solution based on a BBF as agreed in the '70s'.

Stalemate.

The same can go the other way. Or you think that the Turkish "Cypriots" will vote in favor of any BBF solution?