Cyprus-Forum.com

[Oracle]

An anti-colonial struggle was definitely needed in Cyprus. But one which could unite the whole Cypriot people behind it.

I'm interested in hearing what efforts the TCs made in that direction.

[denizaksulu]

Why would TCs want to join any struggle to unite with Greece?

A question. You say:

People in those days were simple and conservative, and had enormous cultural and ethnic attachments to Greece.

I know people nowadays travel a lot, but back then - how many simple and conservative Cypriots do you think regularly visited Greece? My guess is that, even nowadays, far more of them make the journey to the UK, the home of their old hated Colonial Masters.

If the Brits were so hated as is often stated on here - why did so many Cypriots elect to go and live with them?

Grivas did at one stage extend his hand in friendship towards the TCs when the uprising began, and he even invited them to join the struggle and EOKA. Whilst the objective was ENOSIS, Grivas may have believed that the TCs would join because they too had suffered under Colonial Rule.

Gasman, whether you want to accept it or not, Cypriots have always had Hellenic Cultural, linguistic, and religious similarities and attachments. There is very little difference between a GC and a Cretan, and most people in the 1950s believed that it was only natural for Cyprus to achieve ENOSIS with Greece.

Most migration to the UK, occurred in the late 1960s and post 1974. Cypriots never hated the Brits, they just wanted self determination and wanted to end Colonial Rule. A very natural desire.

Obviously Grivas was cleverer than you... Grivas extended his hand in friendship towards the TCs, eh? Because they too suffered under the colonial rule, eh? What about the minorities suffering under the fascist Greek rule in Greece?


Any credible sources, Bafidi?


The fact is that Grivas knew that if he touches just a single TC Turkey would intervene both diplomatically and militarily... As a matter of a fact, Turkey urged Britain and Greece back in 1947 that "Enosis" would never be accepted by Turkey...

If he touched any TCs who were all anti-Enosist and ready to fight against Grivas; Grivas would have doubled his obstacles/enemies in front of Enosis... Furthermore he would have lost the international support he was expecting to gain and achieve Enosis...

Obviously, Grivas was at least 1000 times cleverer than you and most of the Hellenes(all who claims Greek descendent).

Grivas is the cleverest Hellene I've ever come across... but not as clever as the leader of TMT whoever he was...

Anyway, had TCs accepted Enosis or Grivasites won the Enosis struggle; or TCs accepted the so-called majority rule aka Greek rule overwhelming majority of TCs would have to immigrate and lost the so-called Cypriot citizenship...

Zeibek lost her citizenship under the now-infamous Article 19 of Greece's Citizenship Act first voted into the law in 1954 and which states that citizens of “foreign origin” can be deprived of their Greek nationality if they leave the country with the intention of settling abroad.

Panayote Dimitras, head of Greece's branch of the Helsinki Human Rights Monitor, said at least 7,000 people had been made stateless since the law was passed, including about 50 new cases this year. Over half the Muslim minority in Thrace is considered to be ethnic Turkish. And about 500 families living in the area are believed to be living in limbo after losing their identification papers.

http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/62/418.html

Grivas extended his hand in friendship towards the TCs, eh? Because they too suffered under the colonial rule, eh?

Insan, I will repeat exactly what I just told Y-Cunt.

You too are bordering insanity, and I believe it is time for you to give this gig up. Your contributions are pathetic, your research is lacking on many fronts and only serves to waste every one's time.

Your source is from 1997! Today, we have Muslim Officers in the Greek military, and the Muslim minority enjoy full citizenship rights as every other Greek citizen.

Your stupidity is legendary. Stop making a fool of yourself!

I don't mind all other TC forum contributions. Even VP is OK. He may be a fascist, but he has a brain. Both you and Y-Cunt don't!

As i told you Bafidi the moron, you have no sign of any intelligence neither even a nut size brain!

That law, Article 19 of Greece's Citizenship Act was first voted into the law in 1954 and enacted in 1955. Had your stupid dream Enosis become true; it would have been applied to all non-Greek people who were living in Cyprus for thousands of years! Vast majority of TCs would have been kicked out of Cyprus!

It doesn't matter weather the source is from 1997 or 1958. The aim of that racist law was to kick every non-Greek out of the so-called Greek territories once and for all... and they did this up until 1997! They made thousands of people stateless and appropriated their properties!

However, a retard like you, don't have even a nut size brain to comprehend this!

Insane, who are the non Greek people living in Cyprus for thousands of years. The Ottomans first invaded in 1571.

Article 19 only applied to citizens that left Greece and resided abroad. It was abolished in 1998!

http://www.greekembassy.org/embassy/Con ... ticle=2724

Also, you can not say for sure that Article 19 would have applied to the TCs.

Now stop making huge sweeping unverified statements and get lost.

As I told you before Insane, you have lost the plot, and if you visit Y-Cunt, we can safely say there are at least 2 brain cells in the room!

Yeah, retard bafidi it was abolished in 1998 but was too late for thousands of non-Greeks who lost their Greek citizenship and properties in Greece, as a result of this racist law which was intentionally enacted to kick non-Greeks out of the so-called Greek territories!

Greece’s "Article 19" Stateless Persons



Following international embarrassment, Article 19 of the Greek Citizenship Code, allowing the state to strip minority citizens of their citizenship, was abolished in 1998. Past "victims" of that article included stateless residents of Greece who had unjustly been stripped of their citizenship in first place, as they had never settled abroad, a prerequisite of Article 19. In the last two years, many ministers had been promising they would recover their citizenship. Finally, in mid-1999, they were asked to apply for naturalization, as if they were foreigners.

By early September 2000, only a dozen of the over 100 applicants have been granted citizenship. The whole process has been humiliating. It included a state recommendation that they change their names and an insistence they submit unnecessary documents. The first persons granted citizenship were Aysel Zeybek, Stateless Project Coordinator of our NGOs, her mother and two of her sisters (but not her father nor her younger sister), even though they refused to submit all unnecessary documents, thus proving that the procedure selected was abusive. A. Zeybek’s statement on the day of her swearing in as Greek citizen (11 September 2000) is telling:



"We are happy today, but it is not a great happiness. We are also sad and in wonder. There are 3 reasons for that…



First of all our father is still stateless. And the reason that he is not given Greek citizenship is because he does not have a clean penal record. He was fined many times as he was operating a small shop in our village without a license, which he could not get as he was a stateless person.



The second reason of our half happiness is that the 100-150 stateless persons who live in Greece have not all been granted Greek citizenship. The East Macedonia and Thrace Regional State Secretary General had said that all the stateless that have applied for Citizenship via Naturalization would be granted citizenship within 60 days. This promise given to these people, who were stateless for years, has not been honored.



The third point of our unhappiness is the procedure used to grant us Greek citizenship. The Greek state, to avoid further international embarrassment, was forced to first give us identity documents and now citizenship. But, instead of restoring our citizenship, it has applied the naturalization procedure. This is humiliating for us and we are denouncing it."

http://www.greekhelsinki.gr/english/pre ... e2000.html

You stupid moron! Keep bringing the official Greek lies from Greek embassy websites!

You are more stupid than I thought!

All citizenship rights were reinstated idiot!

Article 19
IV. Loss of Greek citizenship for the children of naturalized Greeks. 1. The children of naturalized Greeks, who became Greek according to article 11, can willingly loose the Greek citizenship, if: a) They are not of Greek origin, b) They retain the citizenship that they had at the time of naturalization of their parent and c) They declare their will for loss of the Greek citizenship to the Mayor or the President of the Community or to the Greek Consular Authority of the place of their residence, within one year from the time they come of age. A copy of the declaration is submitted immediately from the above authorities to the Ministry of the Interior, Public Administration and Decentralization. 2. For the loss of the Greek citizenship a decision is issued by the Minister of the Interior, Public Administration and Decentralization, which is published to the Government Gazette.

http://www.helleniccomserve.com/greek_citizenship2.html

The retard bafidi still speaks from his rear end without backing his nonsense with any credible sources.

Greek Sources Spreading Citizenship Misinformation - Macedonian Human Rights Groups
Saturday, May 01, 2010

The AMHRC and MHRMI said they "believe that the spreading of the misinformation is a deliberate attempt to dissuade Macedonians from taking action to restore their citizenship and property rights by giving them a false hope that the matter will soon be resolved by the Greek state. It is regrettable that these reports were naively ‘applauded’ by certain individuals and reported by some media outlets which failed to check their accuracy."

"As was announced on 23 April 2010, AMHRC/MHRMI, in cooperation with the Association of the Refugee Children from Aegean Macedonia of Melbourne and Victoria, the Association of Refugee Children from Aegean Macedonia (ARCAM) in Canada and Macedonian refugee associations in the Republic of Macedonia have decided to launch a campaign for legal action against the Greek state to restore citizenship and property rights to Macedonians from Greece. All these organisations appeal once more to Macedonians from Greece who lost their citizenship to join this important action," the AMHRCand MHRMI said.

http://www.eurasiareview.com/2010/05/gr ... nship.html

Macedonians are Greek you dingbat!

It is Greece's largest regions!



And Article 19 only applied to Naturalised Greeks, so stop making a fool of yourself!

Pufidik Bafidi the retard say so but hundred thousands of Macedonians say Macedonians are Macedonians! Whom to believe now, retard pafidi or hundred thousands of Macedonians?

My Macedonian neighbour does not understand Greek. She speaks Macedonian though. How confusing.

[Get Real!]

My Macedonian neighbour does not understand Greek. She speaks Macedonian though. How confusing.

Alexander ("the great”) was so Greek that he attacked, killed, and plundered everything Greek!

[denizaksulu]

An anti-colonial struggle was definitely needed in Cyprus. But one which could unite the whole Cypriot people behind it.

I'm interested in hearing what efforts the TCs made in that direction.

We have been here before Oracle. When EOKA and ENOSIS went hand in hand, how can anyone envisage the TCs helping to achieve ENOSIS. It saddens me that you keep on asking this question.

[denizaksulu]

My Macedonian neighbour does not understand Greek. She speaks Macedonian though. How confusing.

Alexander ("the great”) was so Greek that he attacked, killed, and plundered everything Greek!

Tell me about it GR. But then you detest him.Why are we going around this well trodden ground again?

[Piratis]

My Macedonian neighbour does not understand Greek. She speaks Macedonian though. How confusing

The "Macedonian" she speaks is merely a Bulgarian dialect. A Slavic language which has absolutely nothing to do with the original Macedonian language, which was a dialect of Greek.

[denizaksulu]

My Macedonian neighbour does not understand Greek. She speaks Macedonian though. How confusing

The "Macedonian" she speaks is merely a Bulgarian dialect. A Slavic language which has absolutely nothing to do with the original Macedonian language, which was a dialect of Greek.

Ofcourse P, ofcourse; whatever you say.

[Lit]

Why would TCs want to join any struggle to unite with Greece?

A question. You say:

People in those days were simple and conservative, and had enormous cultural and ethnic attachments to Greece.

I know people nowadays travel a lot, but back then - how many simple and conservative Cypriots do you think regularly visited Greece? My guess is that, even nowadays, far more of them make the journey to the UK, the home of their old hated Colonial Masters.

If the Brits were so hated as is often stated on here - why did so many Cypriots elect to go and live with them?

Grivas did at one stage extend his hand in friendship towards the TCs when the uprising began, and he even invited them to join the struggle and EOKA. Whilst the objective was ENOSIS, Grivas may have believed that the TCs would join because they too had suffered under Colonial Rule.

Gasman, whether you want to accept it or not, Cypriots have always had Hellenic Cultural, linguistic, and religious similarities and attachments. There is very little difference between a GC and a Cretan, and most people in the 1950s believed that it was only natural for Cyprus to achieve ENOSIS with Greece.

Most migration to the UK, occurred in the late 1960s and post 1974. Cypriots never hated the Brits, they just wanted self determination and wanted to end Colonial Rule. A very natural desire.

Obviously Grivas was cleverer than you... Grivas extended his hand in friendship towards the TCs, eh? Because they too suffered under the colonial rule, eh? What about the minorities suffering under the fascist Greek rule in Greece?


Any credible sources, Bafidi?


The fact is that Grivas knew that if he touches just a single TC Turkey would intervene both diplomatically and militarily... As a matter of a fact, Turkey urged Britain and Greece back in 1947 that "Enosis" would never be accepted by Turkey...

If he touched any TCs who were all anti-Enosist and ready to fight against Grivas; Grivas would have doubled his obstacles/enemies in front of Enosis... Furthermore he would have lost the international support he was expecting to gain and achieve Enosis...

Obviously, Grivas was at least 1000 times cleverer than you and most of the Hellenes(all who claims Greek descendent).

Grivas is the cleverest Hellene I've ever come across... but not as clever as the leader of TMT whoever he was...

Anyway, had TCs accepted Enosis or Grivasites won the Enosis struggle; or TCs accepted the so-called majority rule aka Greek rule overwhelming majority of TCs would have to immigrate and lost the so-called Cypriot citizenship...

Zeibek lost her citizenship under the now-infamous Article 19 of Greece's Citizenship Act first voted into the law in 1954 and which states that citizens of “foreign origin” can be deprived of their Greek nationality if they leave the country with the intention of settling abroad.

Panayote Dimitras, head of Greece's branch of the Helsinki Human Rights Monitor, said at least 7,000 people had been made stateless since the law was passed, including about 50 new cases this year. Over half the Muslim minority in Thrace is considered to be ethnic Turkish. And about 500 families living in the area are believed to be living in limbo after losing their identification papers.

http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/62/418.html

Grivas extended his hand in friendship towards the TCs, eh? Because they too suffered under the colonial rule, eh?

Insan, I will repeat exactly what I just told Y-Cunt.

You too are bordering insanity, and I believe it is time for you to give this gig up. Your contributions are pathetic, your research is lacking on many fronts and only serves to waste every one's time.

Your source is from 1997! Today, we have Muslim Officers in the Greek military, and the Muslim minority enjoy full citizenship rights as every other Greek citizen.

Your stupidity is legendary. Stop making a fool of yourself!

I don't mind all other TC forum contributions. Even VP is OK. He may be a fascist, but he has a brain. Both you and Y-Cunt don't!

As i told you Bafidi the moron, you have no sign of any intelligence neither even a nut size brain!

That law, Article 19 of Greece's Citizenship Act was first voted into the law in 1954 and enacted in 1955. Had your stupid dream Enosis become true; it would have been applied to all non-Greek people who were living in Cyprus for thousands of years! Vast majority of TCs would have been kicked out of Cyprus!

It doesn't matter weather the source is from 1997 or 1958. The aim of that racist law was to kick every non-Greek out of the so-called Greek territories once and for all... and they did this up until 1997! They made thousands of people stateless and appropriated their properties!

However, a retard like you, don't have even a nut size brain to comprehend this!

Insane, who are the non Greek people living in Cyprus for thousands of years. The Ottomans first invaded in 1571.

Article 19 only applied to citizens that left Greece and resided abroad. It was abolished in 1998!

http://www.greekembassy.org/embassy/Con ... ticle=2724

Also, you can not say for sure that Article 19 would have applied to the TCs.

Now stop making huge sweeping unverified statements and get lost.

As I told you before Insane, you have lost the plot, and if you visit Y-Cunt, we can safely say there are at least 2 brain cells in the room!

Yeah, retard bafidi it was abolished in 1998 but was too late for thousands of non-Greeks who lost their Greek citizenship and properties in Greece, as a result of this racist law which was intentionally enacted to kick non-Greeks out of the so-called Greek territories!

Greece’s "Article 19" Stateless Persons



Following international embarrassment, Article 19 of the Greek Citizenship Code, allowing the state to strip minority citizens of their citizenship, was abolished in 1998. Past "victims" of that article included stateless residents of Greece who had unjustly been stripped of their citizenship in first place, as they had never settled abroad, a prerequisite of Article 19. In the last two years, many ministers had been promising they would recover their citizenship. Finally, in mid-1999, they were asked to apply for naturalization, as if they were foreigners.

By early September 2000, only a dozen of the over 100 applicants have been granted citizenship. The whole process has been humiliating. It included a state recommendation that they change their names and an insistence they submit unnecessary documents. The first persons granted citizenship were Aysel Zeybek, Stateless Project Coordinator of our NGOs, her mother and two of her sisters (but not her father nor her younger sister), even though they refused to submit all unnecessary documents, thus proving that the procedure selected was abusive. A. Zeybek’s statement on the day of her swearing in as Greek citizen (11 September 2000) is telling:



"We are happy today, but it is not a great happiness. We are also sad and in wonder. There are 3 reasons for that…



First of all our father is still stateless. And the reason that he is not given Greek citizenship is because he does not have a clean penal record. He was fined many times as he was operating a small shop in our village without a license, which he could not get as he was a stateless person.



The second reason of our half happiness is that the 100-150 stateless persons who live in Greece have not all been granted Greek citizenship. The East Macedonia and Thrace Regional State Secretary General had said that all the stateless that have applied for Citizenship via Naturalization would be granted citizenship within 60 days. This promise given to these people, who were stateless for years, has not been honored.



The third point of our unhappiness is the procedure used to grant us Greek citizenship. The Greek state, to avoid further international embarrassment, was forced to first give us identity documents and now citizenship. But, instead of restoring our citizenship, it has applied the naturalization procedure. This is humiliating for us and we are denouncing it."

http://www.greekhelsinki.gr/english/pre ... e2000.html

You stupid moron! Keep bringing the official Greek lies from Greek embassy websites!

You are more stupid than I thought!

All citizenship rights were reinstated idiot!

Article 19
IV. Loss of Greek citizenship for the children of naturalized Greeks. 1. The children of naturalized Greeks, who became Greek according to article 11, can willingly loose the Greek citizenship, if: a) They are not of Greek origin, b) They retain the citizenship that they had at the time of naturalization of their parent and c) They declare their will for loss of the Greek citizenship to the Mayor or the President of the Community or to the Greek Consular Authority of the place of their residence, within one year from the time they come of age. A copy of the declaration is submitted immediately from the above authorities to the Ministry of the Interior, Public Administration and Decentralization. 2. For the loss of the Greek citizenship a decision is issued by the Minister of the Interior, Public Administration and Decentralization, which is published to the Government Gazette.

http://www.helleniccomserve.com/greek_citizenship2.html

The retard bafidi still speaks from his rear end without backing his nonsense with any credible sources.

Greek Sources Spreading Citizenship Misinformation - Macedonian Human Rights Groups
Saturday, May 01, 2010

The AMHRC and MHRMI said they "believe that the spreading of the misinformation is a deliberate attempt to dissuade Macedonians from taking action to restore their citizenship and property rights by giving them a false hope that the matter will soon be resolved by the Greek state. It is regrettable that these reports were naively ‘applauded’ by certain individuals and reported by some media outlets which failed to check their accuracy."

"As was announced on 23 April 2010, AMHRC/MHRMI, in cooperation with the Association of the Refugee Children from Aegean Macedonia of Melbourne and Victoria, the Association of Refugee Children from Aegean Macedonia (ARCAM) in Canada and Macedonian refugee associations in the Republic of Macedonia have decided to launch a campaign for legal action against the Greek state to restore citizenship and property rights to Macedonians from Greece. All these organisations appeal once more to Macedonians from Greece who lost their citizenship to join this important action," the AMHRCand MHRMI said.

http://www.eurasiareview.com/2010/05/gr ... nship.html

Macedonians are Greek you dingbat!

It is Greece's largest regions!



And Article 19 only applied to Naturalised Greeks, so stop making a fool of yourself!

Pufidik Bafidi the retard say so but hundred thousands of Macedonians say Macedonians are Macedonians! Whom to believe now, retard pafidi or hundred thousands of Macedonians?

My Macedonian neighbour does not understand Greek. She speaks Macedonian though. How confusing.

Its time to learn.

University of Pennsylvania Museum of Archaeology and Anthropology:
http://www.penn.museum/


Indiana University: The Asclepion
http://www.indiana.edu/~ancmed/intro.HTM

SunSITE Singapore: Olympics Through Time
http://sunsite.nus.edu.sg/olympics/preview/

Penn State: Ancient Greek People
http://www.personal.psu.edu/ldl137/web_ ... eople.html

Fordham University, The Jesuit University of New York talks about ancient Greek history. http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/ancient/asbook07.html

The Perseus Digital Library, Thomas R. Martin, An Overview of Classical Greek History from Mycenae to Alexander. http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/tex ... irect=true


Middlebury College: EUHEMERISM-Greek Mythic History
http://community.middlebury.edu/~harris ... kmyth.html

The Japanese know history. See here:
http://web.kyoto-inet.or.jp/org/orion/e ... greek.html

Ancient Greece - The British Museum
http://www.ancientgreece.co.uk/

Emory University: Odyssey Online
http://www.carlos.emory.edu/ODYSSEY/GREECE/home.html

Washington State University: Ancient Greece
http://www.wsu.edu:8080/~dee/GREECE/GREECE.HTM

The Classroom: Ancient Greece
http://www.gradebook.org/Ancient%20Greece.htm

Dartmouth College: Prehistoric Archaeology
http://projectsx.dartmouth.edu/classics ... index.html

Really, i can go on and on. BTW can anyone tell us when the Slavs in (FY) RoM first arrived in the Balkans? Thanks.

[Piratis]

My Macedonian neighbour does not understand Greek. She speaks Macedonian though. How confusing

The "Macedonian" she speaks is merely a Bulgarian dialect. A Slavic language which has absolutely nothing to do with the original Macedonian language, which was a dialect of Greek.

Ofcourse P, ofcourse; whatever you say.

I took a linguistics course in the US and I also researched the issue. So yes, you should listen to me. If you don't trust me go investigate the issue yourself and you will find that the so called "Macedonian" Language is just a Slavic language, and basically a dialect of Bulgarian. Nothing to do whatsoever with the original Macedonians who where not Slavs.

[Lit]

My Macedonian neighbour does not understand Greek. She speaks Macedonian though. How confusing.

Alexander ("the great”) was so Greek that he attacked, killed, and plundered everything Greek!

Here you go:

The Pre battle speeches of Alexander from the Duke University:

http://www.duke.edu/web/classics/grbs/F ... lesias.pdf

Duke University: Greek, Roman and Byzantine Studies:
http://www.duke.edu/web/classics/grbs/index.html

LOL