Cyprus-Forum.com

[YFred]

From today's 30 May 2010 Politis review of Davutoglu's book.

"Cyprus has a central position in the world land mass, since it is equidistant from Europe, Asia and Africa. Together with Crete, it is on a line which crosses the shipping lanes. Cyprus occupies a position between the Straits which separate Europe from Asia and the Suez canal, whhich separates Europe from Africa, while simultaneously forms a base, an aircraft carrier which can control the pulse of the sea lanes of Aden and Hormuz, along with the basins of the Caspian and the Gulf, the most important links of Eurasia and Africa. A nation that ignores Cyprus cannot be active in world regional politics".

With this newly published quotation from the book it is obvious that the professor of Turkish foreign policy is firmly fixed in the 19th century. China is a nation obviously ignoring Cyprus, so is Japan. Are these two nations out of world politics because they ignore Cyprus?

As for Cyprus being a base and aircraft carrier and all that crap the professor is spouting, on this point at least General George Grivas in his memoiers, published 50years ago (!!!) had a wiser approach. Grivas had the lucidity to realise that the development of modern navies with carrier groups neutralised the importance of land bases like Cyprus and Crete.

The insistence of seeing the world as mix of lines and basins is reminiscent of a child playing with his buckets at the sea side. It is apparent that this guy has not heard of cruise missiles and satellite derived intelligence. At least modern children have moved from buckets and basins to mobile phones and computers which can log into Googlearth. He ought to try Googlearth at some point in his career.

WHen the railway link between China and Europe opens up and container traffic can move faster, more cheaply and reliably between the two continents, then I wonder what Davutoglu will do with this basins and lines theory of the region.

Why don't we kick the British bases out of Cyprus and lease them to china, I gather that China is looking for an island in the med. See which century USA and Nato are in. Grivas was not exactly an intelctual, he was a murderer.

If what you said is true regarding technology, why did USA ask for Incirlik to be made available, during the Iraq war?

[Nikitas]

http://www.euinfrastructure.com/news/ch ... rail-link/

Look at this map of the proposed rail link between China and the UK, traversing the whole of Europe from east to west. Passenger time between Beijing and London 25 hours. Cargo three times as long, ie 75 hours, now compare that with sea travel of three weeks.

China has already leased half of Piraeus port for its container traffic and Qatar leased a port on the west of Greece for its LPG European terminal. And Davutoglu is still stuck in his basins and lines on the map.

Grivas was a general with military ability which he managed to illustrate against a modern army. I do not share his political views, but on the utility of bases he must have been right, otherwise the USA would not be investing in seven fleets each with its own carrier group.

It is these anachronistic ideas about Cyprus being the center of the world and an unsinkable aircraft carrier and such bullshit that is the root of the problem of the island. It is the imagination of these blackboard strategists that is mostly to blame.

[YFred]

http://www.euinfrastructure.com/news/china-europe-rail-link/

Look at this map of the proposed rail link between China and the UK, traversing the whole of Europe from east to west. Passenger time between Beijing and London 25 hours. Cargo three times as long, ie 75 hours, now compare that with sea travel of three weeks.

China has already leased half of Piraeus port for its container traffic and Qatar leased a port on the west of Greece for its LPG European terminal. And Davutoglu is still stuck in his basins and lines on the map.

Grivas was a general with military ability which he managed to illustrate against a modern army. I do not share his political views, but on the utility of bases he must have been right, otherwise the USA would not be investing in seven fleets each with its own carrier group.

It is these anachronistic ideas about Cyprus being the center of the world and an unsinkable aircraft carrier and such bullshit that is the root of the problem of the island. It is the imagination of these blackboard strategists that is mostly to blame.

You have not answered why USA needed Turkey when she has so much technology at her disposal.

I gather Chinese wanted a bigger facility and would pay Greece's dept, but she said no.

[Omer Seyhan]

Sveral posters have mentioned the brilliance of Turkish foreign minister Davutoglu and see him as a source of hope due to his enlightened views.

Well these are excerpts from Mr Davutoglu's book, recently translated into Greek, title Strategic Depth.

"Cyprus is a stable base, an air craft carrier able to control the Persian Gulg, the Caspian Sea region and the sea lanes of Aden and Hormuz.... geopolitically and geostrategically Turkey must control Cyprus even if there were not a single Moslem on the island".

"Turkey must be ready to respond with the necessary toughness to anyone who threatens its strateigc objective".

And what are these strategic objectives? In the book Davutoglu describes the future Turkey as an islamic nation, which mobilizes the remnants of Ottomans in Balkan countries towards changes that "cannot exclude any possibility" and proposes a peaceful displacement of Greece in the Aegean.

First we had Taksim and Enosis of the north in Cyprus. Now we see Megali Idea being promoted by the Turkish FM who wants to reinstate Turkish influence in its former imperial colonies. Now, this is a guy that some consider enlightened. Saints preserve us from those that are not!

Don't forget he is Kissinger's pupil. What a ghastly man Davutoglu is....

[Omer Seyhan]

Sveral posters have mentioned the brilliance of Turkish foreign minister Davutoglu and see him as a source of hope due to his enlightened views.

Well these are excerpts from Mr Davutoglu's book, recently translated into Greek, title Strategic Depth.

"Cyprus is a stable base, an air craft carrier able to control the Persian Gulg, the Caspian Sea region and the sea lanes of Aden and Hormuz.... geopolitically and geostrategically Turkey must control Cyprus even if there were not a single Moslem on the island".

"Turkey must be ready to respond with the necessary toughness to anyone who threatens its strateigc objective".

And what are these strategic objectives? In the book Davutoglu describes the future Turkey as an islamic nation, which mobilizes the remnants of Ottomans in Balkan countries towards changes that "cannot exclude any possibility" and proposes a peaceful displacement of Greece in the Aegean.

First we had Taksim and Enosis of the north in Cyprus. Now we see Megali Idea being promoted by the Turkish FM who wants to reinstate Turkish influence in its former imperial colonies. Now, this is a guy that some consider enlightened. Saints preserve us from those that are not!

Don't forget he is Kissinger's pupil. What a ghastly man Davutoglu is....

To add to that, lets hope Cypriots who believe they are Turkish more than Cypriot will read this and realise why Turkey is in Cyprus. Did you think they came to save you?

You're sitting on an air craft carrier!

[YFred]

...the problem with G.C.s and mainland Greeks has always been the fact that they expect others to fight their wars for them.

You'd make a great standup comedian...


1963/64: The Turkish Air force napalms GCs to save the TCs from certain defeat at Kokkina.

1967: The Turkish threat to bomb GCs again saves the TCs once more from certain defeat at Kofinou.

1974: Turkey launches a full scale military invasion allegedly to save TCs from the Greek coup.


Now tell me… who is fighting whose battles? It seems to me that the GCs were beating the TC renegade resistance to a pulp EVERY TIME and they had to call mommy to save themselves!

Idiot!

Wow, what a revelation, the GCs never called upon their brothers from greece to bring to cyprus 10000 soldiers despite the fact that they had 5 to 1 ratio in manpower and arms. Where they had tanks to small arms fire of the TCs.

GR you have always been and will always be a prize firat class plonker.

[Nikitas]

"You have not answered why USA needed Turkey when she has so much technology at her disposal."

Because it would be faster to reach northern Iraq from the Mediterranean, that is by transporting troops from Europe through Turkey. In the end the Americans and all others managed OK via the Gulf. And please do not forget that Turkey was deemed necessary back then only because Syrian ports were not available. Had they been available the comparative ease of driving through Syria would decrease the value of Turkey to zilch.

But above all else, Cyprus was NOT an importante base for the operations in Iraq which proves that Davutoglu and others overemphasise the importance of the island as a base etc. Now it only remains for them to realise this and leave us alone.

[YFred]

"You have not answered why USA needed Turkey when she has so much technology at her disposal."

Because it would be faster to reach northern Iraq from the Mediterranean, that is by transporting troops from Europe through Turkey. In the end the Americans and all others managed OK via the Gulf. And please do not forget that Turkey was deemed necessary back then only because Syrian ports were not available. Had they been available the comparative ease of driving through Syria would decrease the value of Turkey to zilch.

But above all else, Cyprus was NOT an importante base for the operations in Iraq which proves that Davutoglu and others overemphasise the importance of the island as a base etc. Now it only remains for them to realise this and leave us alone.

When did Syrian ports become available to US. Have I missed something? Have they ever been, or are we playing a childish game. I guess Lebonan ports would have been even quicker?

[Nikitas]

No Syrian ports are not available. But the assumption that they will NEVER be available is not sound strategy.

[insan]

Sveral posters have mentioned the brilliance of Turkish foreign minister Davutoglu and see him as a source of hope due to his enlightened views.

Well these are excerpts from Mr Davutoglu's book, recently translated into Greek, title Strategic Depth.

"Cyprus is a stable base, an air craft carrier able to control the Persian Gulg, the Caspian Sea region and the sea lanes of Aden and Hormuz.... geopolitically and geostrategically Turkey must control Cyprus even if there were not a single Moslem on the island".

"Turkey must be ready to respond with the necessary toughness to anyone who threatens its strateigc objective".

And what are these strategic objectives? In the book Davutoglu describes the future Turkey as an islamic nation, which mobilizes the remnants of Ottomans in Balkan countries towards changes that "cannot exclude any possibility" and proposes a peaceful displacement of Greece in the Aegean.

First we had Taksim and Enosis of the north in Cyprus. Now we see Megali Idea being promoted by the Turkish FM who wants to reinstate Turkish influence in its former imperial colonies. Now, this is a guy that some consider enlightened. Saints preserve us from those that are not!

Don't forget he is Kissinger's pupil. What a ghastly man Davutoglu is....

To add to that, lets hope Cypriots who believe they are Turkish more than Cypriot will read this and realise why Turkey is in Cyprus. Did you think they came to save you?

You're sitting on an air craft carrier!

... and with Omer's plain logic, flat viewpoint; he wants Cyprus to be someone else's aircraft carrier... such as EU's; thus US's... did/do you think they came/come to save you? Or all they care about is the rich natural resources of middle east and cacauses? ... and keep dominating/controlling the whole world as they wish? Poor Ömer...