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Strong Greece in the interest of Cyprus and whole EU ...

How can we solve it? (keep it civilized)

Postby Gasman » Sat May 08, 2010 6:27 pm

And here:

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUKTRE64649120100507

Greek PM must bow to calls for catharsis

...My rage is huge when I see the tragedy of the looting of Greek people's wealth," he told a parliament debate on his austerity bill on Thursday, accusing the previous government of waste and corruption.

"One minister paid 28,000 euros (24,103 pounds) for office curtains...They will be prosecuted."

Opinion polls show Greeks are more willing to suffer belt-tightening measures to exit a debt crisis shaking the euro zone if those they hold responsible for their woes -- corrupt politicians and businessmen -- pay...


where Papandreou himself clearly places the blames on Greeks themselves, no one else.

Unbelievably politicians have been immune from prosecution?

A main hurdle to fighting corruption is a constitutional law protecting politicians suspected of wrongdoing from prosecution unless parliament lifts their immunity. Several parliamentary committees have been investigating scandals but no politician has ever been brought to justice.

The ruling party itself has shown some desire to reform. In a letter to parliament, 48 of its younger members petitioned to investigate all those who have held public office in the last 20 years and confiscate whatever cannot be justified.

"We must have catharsis in our political system to rescue our political ethos and restore our role as parliamentarians," they said.


But, hey, if Oracle says it is everyone's fault but the Greeks - she must be right - after all she is an 'Oracle'.
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Postby Paphitis » Sat May 08, 2010 7:01 pm

Gasman wrote:And here:

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUKTRE64649120100507

Greek PM must bow to calls for catharsis

...My rage is huge when I see the tragedy of the looting of Greek people's wealth," he told a parliament debate on his austerity bill on Thursday, accusing the previous government of waste and corruption.

"One minister paid 28,000 euros (24,103 pounds) for office curtains...They will be prosecuted."

Opinion polls show Greeks are more willing to suffer belt-tightening measures to exit a debt crisis shaking the euro zone if those they hold responsible for their woes -- corrupt politicians and businessmen -- pay...


where Papandreou himself clearly places the blames on Greeks themselves, no one else.

Unbelievably politicians have been immune from prosecution?

A main hurdle to fighting corruption is a constitutional law protecting politicians suspected of wrongdoing from prosecution unless parliament lifts their immunity. Several parliamentary committees have been investigating scandals but no politician has ever been brought to justice.

The ruling party itself has shown some desire to reform. In a letter to parliament, 48 of its younger members petitioned to investigate all those who have held public office in the last 20 years and confiscate whatever cannot be justified.

"We must have catharsis in our political system to rescue our political ethos and restore our role as parliamentarians," they said.


But, hey, if Oracle says it is everyone's fault but the Greeks - she must be right - after all she is an 'Oracle'.


Papandreou is blaming the Greek people. But he also cites mismanagement from the previous administration but understands fully that the previous administration was unable to Govern effectively since they too wanted to introduce drastic austerity measures just over 2 years ago and were met with similar protests from Anarchists who look for any opportunity. Opinion polls began to swing against them and they lost the election.

And as you can see, the present administration is facing even more stern opposition from the immature Greek electorate, but thankfully, the PASOK Government is now left with no choice but to hit back very hard and give the people a good dose of much needed medicine. They will scream and yell, but they will now take their medicine whether they like it or not.

There was no criminal activity within the previous administration. It was just a situation that was beyond their control and beyond any one's control. Greeks can not be Governed easily.

Oracle is wrong!. The Greek People are predominately to blame. Greek Governments are also to blame for not having the balls to deal with the irresponsible Greek populace. Greece has some 1,000,000 public servants. The public sector needs to be downsized and Greeks will soon learn that nepotism or jobs created for the boys and girls is now a thing of the past.
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Postby Gasman » Sat May 08, 2010 7:05 pm

I've been reading this week that one of the reasons for all these 'anarchists' is the poor Greek education system. They find it hard to get jobs and remain at home with mummy and daddy keeping them. And have plenty of time to go out demonstrating?
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Postby Paphitis » Sat May 08, 2010 7:12 pm

Also, I don't believe Oracle is blaming everyone else for Greece's dire economic problems. I believe she is fully aware of all the issues and problems that Greece faces!

I only recall her mentioning that Defense expenditure is a factor, bought about by Greece troubled relationship with Turkey. And this is quite true. Defense expenditure is a factor, but it is not the reason why Greece is almost bankrupt since defense expenditure has always been around 4.0% of GDP and is only slightly more higher than other EU states.
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Postby Paphitis » Sat May 08, 2010 7:17 pm

Gasman wrote:I've been reading this week that one of the reasons for all these 'anarchists' is the poor Greek education system. They find it hard to get jobs and remain at home with mummy and daddy keeping them. And have plenty of time to go out demonstrating?


Not true!

Greece has one of the highest literacy rates in the world. It also has one of the hisghest ratios of citizens with tertiary or higher qualifications in the world.

Education in Greece is free, and Governments have been spending huge amounts of money to improve the education system. I hope that this is not changed or reduced. Greece can continue to offer massive funding to the education and tertiary system as long as other areas are addressed. Education is of paramount importance!

Yes, unemployment is an issue. But you can't expect the state to create more unnecessary jobs that are not required. Unemployment is also a problem in other countries. It is not unique to Greece.
Last edited by Paphitis on Sat May 08, 2010 7:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Oracle » Sat May 08, 2010 7:20 pm

Paphitis wrote:Also, I don't believe Oracle is blaming everyone else for Greece's dire economic problems. I believe she is fully aware of all the issues and problems that Greece faces!

I only recall her mentioning that Defense expenditure is a factor, bought about by Greece troubled relationship with Turkey. And this is quite true. Defense expenditure is a factor, but it is not the reason why Greece is almost bankrupt since defense expenditure has always been around 4.0% of GDP and is only slightly more higher than other EU states.


Greece's protracted, but necessary, military expenditure is being swept aside because the rest of the EU do not want to meet their financial responsibilities and help Greece with defending EU borders!

But things are changing:

Today ...
Italian Finance Minister Giulio Tremonti urged Germany to show its leadership on the Greek crisis, saying helping Greece is in the interest of the common European good.
Last edited by Oracle on Sat May 08, 2010 7:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Gasman » Sat May 08, 2010 7:21 pm

Not what I've been reading about their education system at all. And also been reading they have the highest rate of youth unemployment in the EU?
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Postby Gasman » Sat May 08, 2010 7:26 pm

Not what I've been reading about their education system at all. And also been reading they have the highest rate of youth unemployment in the EU?

And very high ratio of students who leave Greece to get their higher education and who tend to then find jobs outside Greece.

The debate about the Greek education system has been raging on for years. You must be aware of it?
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Postby Paphitis » Sat May 08, 2010 7:26 pm

Oracle wrote:
Paphitis wrote:Also, I don't believe Oracle is blaming everyone else for Greece's dire economic problems. I believe she is fully aware of all the issues and problems that Greece faces!

I only recall her mentioning that Defense expenditure is a factor, bought about by Greece troubled relationship with Turkey. And this is quite true. Defense expenditure is a factor, but it is not the reason why Greece is almost bankrupt since defense expenditure has always been around 4.0% of GDP and is only slightly more higher than other EU states.


Greece's protracted, but necessary, military expenditure is being swept aside because the rest of the EU do not want to meet their finacial responsibilities and help Greece with defending EU borders!

But things are changing:

Today ...
Italian Finance Minister Giulio Tremonti urged Germany to show its leadership on the Greek crisis, saying helping Greece is in the interest of the common European good.


The EU has been assisting Greece with border security!

http://www.frontex.europa.eu/

As for other defense matters, that is purely Greece and NATO's responsibility, not the EU.
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Postby Paphitis » Sat May 08, 2010 7:28 pm

Gasman wrote:Not what I've been reading about their education system at all. And also been reading they have the highest rate of youth unemployment in the EU?


That has nothing to do with Greece's high quality education system.

The education system is not to blame for high unemployment at all! Students are migrating elsewhere partly because Greece does not offer the right opportunities for them and the right remuneration.
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