Cyprus-Forum.com

[DTA]

In the Korean war in the 50s,military psychologists carried out a test to find out which nation's soldiers were least immune to "enemy misinformation or propaganda",in other words,the ones least likely to waver from their duty...And the winner was.........THE TURKISH SOLDIERS....

That is because we are the turks that fights

Sure we are...

means much more than some 'poem':


At the moment I'm writing this, all the hospital corridors in Japan are filled with the wounded. Our own wounded boys are being sent to Japan from Korea by airplane... mostly to Japan's General and Apex hospitals.

When I came to Japan for a couple of days to mail my photos and (journalistic) reports, I got a telephone call in the early morning. The hospital's doctors asked me I needed to hop in a car and go to the hospital right away. In a situation like this, the word "request" has no meaning. Our boys in the hospital could not communicate with the doctors in the doctors' language. I happily rushed to the hospital.

Let me explain the courtesy and attitude of our boys in their own words. I asked one of the young men whose body was riddled with holes, carrying ten to fifteen wounds, "What's wrong?"

As much as he was capable of mustering, in a sweet tone, he replied, "I have nothing, efendim!"

This attitude from the Turkish soldiers so affected the American doctors, they were in tears.

"We never, ever saw any kind of wounded like these men. These men act as if their bullet, machine gun and bomb wounds are nonexistent. The wounded from any other nation, in similar shape, would be crying and shaking in their situation. Your boys never utter a word of complaint.

These American doctors, so moved by the uncomplaining attitude of the Turkish soldiers, attempted to go the extra mile to minimize their pain.

"Aci!.." This is the first Turkish word ("pain") that the American doctors in the Tokyo and Anex hospitals learn. Every time they encounter a wound, an aching chest, a throbbing back, when they feel with their fingers, they ask in Turkish:

"Aci?.."

In the Anex hospital, we stood in front of a bed. A Turkish soldier, so young, one would call him a kid. Wrapped totally in bandages. His name is Ahmet Cicek. (Chi-chek.) From "Cankir." Many parts of his body were injured from an exploding bomb.

What's wrong?" I asked.

"Nothing is wrong..."

(My darling boy!)

The doctor unwrapped the bandage from one of his hands. I could never have imagined a hand to be in such a mutilated shape.

Signaling one of the patient's fingers, the doctor told me in English:

"Tell him we need to amputate this finger from the root...today."

When the other doctors noticed my reluctance, they continued:

"What's the matter? This is very important."

Ahmet Cicek from Cankir first looked at me with foggy eyes... then at the men, dressed in white.

I protested. I added I had much experience, spending days and nights in hospitals, and mentioned by helping them I needed to be free in my actions:

"Please permit me, Doctor, don't make me give this boy such news."

The doctors replied, "However, he must know what is to happen to him. And we must begin the operation immediately."

When he noticed the ongoing argument, Ahmet Cicek from Cankir asked, "What are they saying, big brother?"

I finally revealed: "Ahmet. One of your fingers is no good anymore, my son. If it's not removed, your whole hand will be endangered. They now want to take you into the operating room."

At that moment, something happened I would have never expected. Ahmet Cicek began to laugh! Yes, he was laughing:

"Only one finger, big brother?"

"Yes... Only one finger!"

"Really, what is there to be sad about? I already realized that finger could rot my entire arm four days ago. I was going to cut it myself, but I didn't have enough strength in my other hand. I tried, but I couldn't. Let them cut it.... nine fingers are enough!"

Very touching indeed,DTA...

Now watch the Greek sewer rats come out to play...

the thing is bir I swear me an you were not natioanalist but the attitudes of the majority of GC her have made us so. ten years ago I thought that the cyprus issues was just because of a turkish land grab, but then i learnt about the history and thought that bbf was the best route, but now oracle, b25 and there friends are making me rethink that.

DTA...if you find some time go back and read some of my early posts from 2005...You will be amazed..The funny thing is I am still the same person...There is only one mistake i would correct now..I tought at the time that my father was chased out of Cyprus by the TMT...I was wrong..
Anyway, I still believe that the ideal solution for Cyprus is a unitary state,based on democratic values,one-vote-one-value,without the slightest concession to peoples ethnic origins..But you can't have that with the fanatical GC/Greek mentality exhibited on this forum by many people...I have no reason to doubt this forum is a representative of the real Cyprus reality out there..You have the Kikapus,Bananiots,miltiadeses,Denizs,DTAs,Kifeases,humanists,kafeneses, and Birkibrislis out there...But you also have the Oracles,B25s,Epsilons,Growups,Piratises,boomerangs,Malapapas what have you...And we know that it is not the moderates who carry public opinion in times of conflict,it is the fanatics...Hence only a BBF with guaranteed TC political equality can work safely in practice in Cyprus...And that is what I am supporting now...But in my heart lies a unifed Cyprus,where our ethnic differences are not set in concrete politically...

I would love for their to be a true cypriot nation where the greek and turk would not be an issue but my time on this forum has taught me that is not what the majority of the GC want. I consider my self a moderate, and people like militetes are moderates as well but in truth, in real truth.... he would favour the GCs and I would favor the the TC and there in lies the cypriot problem even the moderates favor 'their indentity' over the other

this is not just with milities thought Get real who he considers himself a real cypriot and who I have a lot of time for, as well as DT who again I have a lot of time for, favor GCs and I dont blame them because I feel the same about TCs, I hope I am making sense because I have had a lot to drink.- get real Dt when Im next in cyprus lets meet up for a coffee.

In truth deniz and bennouit are the only ones that can reunite cyprus because I feel they are cypriots before TCs or GCs, where the rest of us including me and many others are not, many will dispute this but the truth is these are the only two on the forum that I have seen put the cypriot identity and unification before anything else. it is a same that it is only two people.

[miltiades]

In the Korean war in the 50s,military psychologists carried out a test to find out which nation's soldiers were least immune to "enemy misinformation or propaganda",in other words,the ones least likely to waver from their duty...And the winner was.........THE TURKISH SOLDIERS....

That is because we are the turks that fights

Sure we are...

means much more than some 'poem':


At the moment I'm writing this, all the hospital corridors in Japan are filled with the wounded. Our own wounded boys are being sent to Japan from Korea by airplane... mostly to Japan's General and Apex hospitals.

When I came to Japan for a couple of days to mail my photos and (journalistic) reports, I got a telephone call in the early morning. The hospital's doctors asked me I needed to hop in a car and go to the hospital right away. In a situation like this, the word "request" has no meaning. Our boys in the hospital could not communicate with the doctors in the doctors' language. I happily rushed to the hospital.

Let me explain the courtesy and attitude of our boys in their own words. I asked one of the young men whose body was riddled with holes, carrying ten to fifteen wounds, "What's wrong?"

As much as he was capable of mustering, in a sweet tone, he replied, "I have nothing, efendim!"

This attitude from the Turkish soldiers so affected the American doctors, they were in tears.

"We never, ever saw any kind of wounded like these men. These men act as if their bullet, machine gun and bomb wounds are nonexistent. The wounded from any other nation, in similar shape, would be crying and shaking in their situation. Your boys never utter a word of complaint.

These American doctors, so moved by the uncomplaining attitude of the Turkish soldiers, attempted to go the extra mile to minimize their pain.

"Aci!.." This is the first Turkish word ("pain") that the American doctors in the Tokyo and Anex hospitals learn. Every time they encounter a wound, an aching chest, a throbbing back, when they feel with their fingers, they ask in Turkish:

"Aci?.."

In the Anex hospital, we stood in front of a bed. A Turkish soldier, so young, one would call him a kid. Wrapped totally in bandages. His name is Ahmet Cicek. (Chi-chek.) From "Cankir." Many parts of his body were injured from an exploding bomb.

What's wrong?" I asked.

"Nothing is wrong..."

(My darling boy!)

The doctor unwrapped the bandage from one of his hands. I could never have imagined a hand to be in such a mutilated shape.

Signaling one of the patient's fingers, the doctor told me in English:

"Tell him we need to amputate this finger from the root...today."

When the other doctors noticed my reluctance, they continued:

"What's the matter? This is very important."

Ahmet Cicek from Cankir first looked at me with foggy eyes... then at the men, dressed in white.

I protested. I added I had much experience, spending days and nights in hospitals, and mentioned by helping them I needed to be free in my actions:

"Please permit me, Doctor, don't make me give this boy such news."

The doctors replied, "However, he must know what is to happen to him. And we must begin the operation immediately."

When he noticed the ongoing argument, Ahmet Cicek from Cankir asked, "What are they saying, big brother?"

I finally revealed: "Ahmet. One of your fingers is no good anymore, my son. If it's not removed, your whole hand will be endangered. They now want to take you into the operating room."

At that moment, something happened I would have never expected. Ahmet Cicek began to laugh! Yes, he was laughing:

"Only one finger, big brother?"

"Yes... Only one finger!"

"Really, what is there to be sad about? I already realized that finger could rot my entire arm four days ago. I was going to cut it myself, but I didn't have enough strength in my other hand. I tried, but I couldn't. Let them cut it.... nine fingers are enough!"

Very touching indeed,DTA...

Now watch the Greek sewer rats come out to play...

the thing is bir I swear me an you were not natioanalist but the attitudes of the majority of GC her have made us so. ten years ago I thought that the cyprus issues was just because of a turkish land grab, but then i learnt about the history and thought that bbf was the best route, but now oracle, b25 and there friends are making me rethink that.

DTA...if you find some time go back and read some of my early posts from 2005...You will be amazed..The funny thing is I am still the same person...There is only one mistake i would correct now..I tought at the time that my father was chased out of Cyprus by the TMT...I was wrong..
Anyway, I still believe that the ideal solution for Cyprus is a unitary state,based on democratic values,one-vote-one-value,without the slightest concession to peoples ethnic origins..But you can't have that with the fanatical GC/Greek mentality exhibited on this forum by many people...I have no reason to doubt this forum is a representative of the real Cyprus reality out there..You have the Kikapus,Bananiots,miltiadeses,Denizs,DTAs,Kifeases,humanists,kafeneses, and Birkibrislis out there...But you also have the Oracles,B25s,Epsilons,Growups,Piratises,boomerangs,Malapapas what have you...And we know that it is not the moderates who carry public opinion in times of conflict,it is the fanatics...Hence only a BBF with guaranteed TC political equality can work safely in practice in Cyprus...And that is what I am supporting now...But in my heart lies a unifed Cyprus,where our ethnic differences are not set in concrete politically...

I would love for their to be a true cypriot nation where the greek and turk would not be an issue but my time on this forum has taught me that is not what the majority of the GC want. I consider my self a moderate, and people like militetes are moderates as well but in truth, in real truth.... he would favour the GCs and I would favor the the TC and there in lies the cypriot problem even the moderates favor 'their indentity' over the other

this is not just with milities thought Get real who he considers himself a real cypriot and who I have a lot of time for, as well as DT who again I have a lot of time for, favor GCs and I dont blame them because I feel the same about TCs, I hope I am making sense because I have had a lot to drink.- get real Dt when Im next in cyprus lets meet up for a coffee.

In truth deniz and bennouit are the only ones that can reunite cyprus because I feel they are cypriots before TCs or GCs, where the rest of us including me and many others are not, many will dispute this but the truth is these are the only two on the forum that I have seen put the cypriot identity and unification before anything else. it is a same that it is only two people.

Let me get this straight. Your outlook and beliefs concerning Cyprus and its people has been manipulated and re-manufactured because of this forum and of some posters !! Let me express my concern that there are Cypriots around who are influenced by comments made on a public forum and furthermore revert to nationalistic tribe concerning polemic bullshit that war mongers sustain and naive people digest .
I have been on this forum for 4 years . I have not deflected from my views one millimeter , I have steadfastly refused when under attack to refer to the past and apportion blame for the conflict , always putting the blame squarely on the shoulders of the nationalistic bullshitters , G/Cs and T/Cs alike who consider either the Greeks or the Turks as some super fighting machines , pure nonsense since both lack common sense and discipline , the West has inflated their ego as one would expect, ie telling the Greeks , Churchill , during WW2 that if Britain had a battalion of Greek soldiers the war would have come to a victorious much earlier. What bollocks , what patronizing shit and yet unsophisticated people accept it as correct.
Listen boys , let me tell you that the bravest soldier is one who fights for peace , one who detests and tries to avoid conflict not the rubblerouser or the suicide bomber who are victims of their own utter stupidity.
Its time to realize guys that the forum is not representative of the Cypriot people , wake up and face reality. They were no angels through out the conflict , there was no massacre taking place that forced Turkey to invade and put in motion a plan she had long ago worked out .
The real enemies of Cyprus are those nations in whose name the Cypriot extremists commit the most vulgar acts.
The situation at the moment is simple . The Turkish army must withdraw , the Greek army must withdraw, the Cypriots will have to ditch both of these nations embrace their true homeland and negotiate a solution not based on how many police stations will be flying the Turkish flag and how many the Greek flag.
TMT and EOKA B enlisted in their extreme forces Cypriots who hated each other , Cypriots filled with the crap as to the prowess of either the Greek or Turkish army , willing to intimidate and to kill . T/Cs were intimidated by EOKA B just as they were intimidated by the feared Grey Wolves , paramilitaries adversely influenced by nationalistic nonsense.
TMT forced T/Cs into enclaves , so did EOKA B , the move by the T/Cs into enclaves was actively encouraged and insisted upon by the extremists , both EOKAB and TMT.
I'm always sorry to note the negative effect that some on this forum exhort on members and would like to remind all that I have never wavered from my inbred principles , have not budged one inch , have never allowed my behaviour ( apart from my well known colourful language) to be dictated by extremists or people who simply believe that only war is an option in solving the Cyprob.

Let me also refer once more to the EOKA struggle of 1955-1959 and once again state that I took a small part having enlisted in the youth movement ANE . I supported the struggle to rid Cyprus of the British occupation , I supported the end goal which was the desired result of the overwhelming majority of the Cypriot people. There was nothing the matter with the overwhelming majority demanding that they and they alone would chart their own destiny.
With hindsight and much later my views and those of thousands of other G/Cs who supported the end goal changed and accepted that the goal was not the ideal one , independence was , the struggle should have been one of Cypriots against the imperialist forces of Britain. Too late to change what already occurred but never too late to embrace OUR nation , get rid of our relations , they are nothing but bloody trouble , get rid of their nationalistic bullshit flags stick them up theirs and hist the flag of our nation.

Some of you think that the pseudo state will survive and improve financially once free trade is in place , I asked before , what exactly does the "trnc" have to trade with the rest of the world , where is the manufacturing infrastructure , the agricultural efficiencies to spurn exports of produce , tourism and sale of G/C properties to cheapskates are the only areas along with gambling , prostitution and rampant corruption , I know it happens elsewhere but in the "trnc" corruption is so rampant is beyond reproach.

ps. a note on the Turkish soldier who laughed at being told that one of his fingers would be amputated. He appeared so happy , poor sod , I wonder if he was told his prick was about to be removed !
What bolloucks indeed !

[Viewpoint]

Miltiades what do you think about the effect GCs have had on his viewpoint towards unification? He appears to have like the rest of us seen that without strict solutionguidelines you cannot trust GCs.

[miltiades]

Miltiades what do you think about the effect GCs have had on his viewpoint towards unification? He appears to have like the rest of us seen that without strict solutionguidelines you cannot trust GCs.

The overwhelming majority of the G/C people want to live in peace with their compatriots the T/Cs. Their anger is aimed at the nation of Turkey which nation they consider , and rightly so , as the invader and occupier of a part of Cyprus. I have yet to meet a G/C who shares the beliefs that some on this forum have expressed. May I also say that I have yet to meet a T/C who wants Turkey to remain permanently in occupation of the northern part. Stability , peace , respect of each others fears and concerns must be a two way process and I'm happy to have known so many Cypriots who want just that.
Unless a solution is negotiated whereby all Cypriots become free of their cancerous association with wrongly perceived motherlands conflict will develop sometime in the future . No G/C will ever accept the permanency of Turkeys pressence on this island.
The people who talk about heroics and the usual nationalistic tripe will be the first to run away with tails between their legs.
Cyprus is not Turkish , not one bloody inch of , and it is neither Greek , it belongs to those Cypriots who consider it as their homeland, those that have as a motherland a foreign nation are the obstacles to finding a solution based upon the interests of Cyprus and its future generations. These foreign countries have done immense damage to our people more so the invading country who continues to treat Cyprus as a part of the now defunct Ottoman empire.

[Viewpoint]

Miltiades you are not addressing reality nor have you answered my question even bir has realized that without a very strict agreement the tcs will never support the departure of the TA, nor will they move forward if anything put before them smells remotely of handinv over their future to the majority whom we know do not have their best interests at heart and will use every opportunity to take control of the nortg state. So in order to get rid of the culprit as you call them placing sole blame on the TA which imo is not right but lets not go there you have to compromise to a degree that will entice TCs enough to support the departure of the TA. Are you ready to do this? And why is that yoh make excuses for those onthis forum who have the balls tobreflect exactly what the gcs really feel but tend to hide from tcs arent you knowingly placing us in danger?

[observer]

In the Korean war in the 50s,military psychologists carried out a test to find out which nation's soldiers were least immune to "enemy misinformation or propaganda",in other words,the ones least likely to waver from their duty...And the winner was.........THE TURKISH SOLDIERS....

I have learnt this too, but I have wondered how many Koreans/Chinese spoke Turkish! It's easier to be immune to enemy misinformation and propaganda if you don't understand a word.

However, it is probably true that the average mehmetcik came from tougher conditions than the majority of other countries supplying UN soldiers so was less affected by rough conditions.

[EricSeans]

No wonder the bnp in the uk gets votes

coo and telling response what did you say to the Greek that fights?

If you care so much why live in the uk???

Because my family's land all 50 dumums of it in pathos has been taken from us and is being used by GCs, and also my family had to flee for their lives.

by the way what did you say to 'the greek that fights' thread

do you support the bnp then?

PATHOS?

[BirKibrisli]

In the Korean war in the 50s,military psychologists carried out a test to find out which nation's soldiers were least immune to "enemy misinformation or propaganda",in other words,the ones least likely to waver from their duty...And the winner was.........THE TURKISH SOLDIERS....

I have learnt this too, but I have wondered how many Koreans/Chinese spoke Turkish! It's easier to be immune to enemy misinformation and propaganda if you don't understand a word.

However, it is probably true that the average mehmetcik came from tougher conditions than the majority of other countries supplying UN soldiers so was less affected by rough conditions.

I don't think language was an issue,Observer...They carried out psychological tests,i assume in the soldiers' own languages, and came up with the result I mentioned...

[BirKibrisli]

Miltiades what do you think about the effect GCs have had on his viewpoint towards unification? He appears to have like the rest of us seen that without strict solutionguidelines you cannot trust GCs.

The overwhelming majority of the G/C people want to live in peace with their compatriots the T/Cs. Their anger is aimed at the nation of Turkey which nation they consider , and rightly so , as the invader and occupier of a part of Cyprus. I have yet to meet a G/C who shares the beliefs that some on this forum have expressed. May I also say that I have yet to meet a T/C who wants Turkey to remain permanently in occupation of the northern part. Stability , peace , respect of each others fears and concerns must be a two way process and I'm happy to have known so many Cypriots who want just that.
Unless a solution is negotiated whereby all Cypriots become free of their cancerous association with wrongly perceived motherlands conflict will develop sometime in the future . No G/C will ever accept the permanency of Turkeys pressence on this island.
The people who talk about heroics and the usual nationalistic tripe will be the first to run away with tails between their legs.
Cyprus is not Turkish , not one bloody inch of , and it is neither Greek , it belongs to those Cypriots who consider it as their homeland, those that have as a motherland a foreign nation are the obstacles to finding a solution based upon the interests of Cyprus and its future generations. These foreign countries have done immense damage to our people more so the invading country who continues to treat Cyprus as a part of the now defunct Ottoman empire.

It is easy,miltiades,for you to say these things,because if the Turkish Army withdraws,together with most of the settlers,as it is demanded by the GCs,and things get out of hand again via nationalist/extremist provocations,it will be the TCs who will be helpless and vulnerable once again,not the GCs...The GCs have shown no appreciation of the devastating effect of the demand for Enosis with Greece on the TCs at the time,neither have they really shown any understanding or remorse for the plight of the TCs between 1963-74...You yourself are making the same mistake if you think the TMT was powerful enough to force the TCs into enclaves,without the help(so to speak) of the EOKA (A or B do not matter to the Tcs) followed by the actions of the GC leadership to wrestle the power from the TCs...If the push comes to shove in a united Cyprus the moderate GCs will be unable and probably unwilling to help the TCs survive...Too much is at the stake for the TCs...Sorry,but this is what certain forumers here made us realise...I have no reason to believe this Forum does not represent the average GC opinion,and the strength of the hatred and bitterness AGAINST ALL THINGS..OOPS...Turkish and TC was quite an eye-opener for me...Intellectually i still believe that a unitary democratic state without any concessions for ethnic backgrounds is the best solution...But emotionally,deep in my heart, I know it is not possible for the TCs to take that risk...And given my time and experiences on this Forum,i cannot blame them...

[boomerang]

really bir?....30 odd years with the gates locked and stagnation rotting in nicely, how do you then explain the newly founded wealth of the tcs since their standard rose?...via emplpyment and opportunities?...

hate you say, huh?...i see...not enough huh?...you are so transparent and it really shows through your posts...

as i said earlier you are a child of the yesterday era...