Cyprus-Forum.com

[bg_turk]

Hello everybody,

As far as I understand a significant portion of those residing in the TRNC are refugees, who have properties left in the South, which they are not alllowed to access nor use.

My question is why are TC so passive about this? Why aren't they actively pursuing their rights in the ECHR to reclaim what was apparently stolen from them for no fault of their own, similar to what GC experienced in the North. Why are they awarded compensations in ECHR, and TC not? If GC theory that TC are victims of an aggression is true, then what is the principal difference between lost properties of GC and TC?

And I want to inquire on two more issues concerning the laws in the South:

1. How did turkish cypriots get married before 1974 since apparently Section 34 of the Marriage Law did not allow a Turkish Cypriot professing the Muslim faith to enter into a civil marriage, as the case in ECHR of Selim v. Cyprus shows:

http://www.echr.coe.int/Eng/Press/2002/ ... epress.htm

2. Are there any ammendments to the voting system since the ECHR judgement of Aziz v. Cyprus:

http://www.echr.coe.int/Eng/Press/2004/ ... 220604.htm

3. And finally if any GC wants to obtain a TRNC citizenship on the grounds that they were born on that land what is the procedure for that. Is it possible? What is the status of the Greek minority, are they granted TRNC citizenship?

Thank you in advance for your replies.

[DigenisAkritas]

TC's were granted full RoR under the Annan Plan, 100% could return, His Excellency President Tasos Papadopoulos offered this himself. Greeks were only given 25% RoR, whose complaining?

[bg_turk]

So how did TC get married before 1974, I would be really greatful if somebody clarifies this to me.

Did the law banning marriage between citizens professing the muslim faith exist back then too and if so were TC marriages illegal?

Here are the detail of the case Selim v. Cyprus:
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"On 8 January 1999 Kemal Selim, a Cypriot national, applied to the Municipality of Nicosia to marry a Romanian national, Ion Ramona. On 28 January 1999, he was informed that Section 34 of the Marriage Law did not allow a Turkish Cypriot professing the Muslim faith to enter into a civil marriage.

The applicant complains that he was forced to marry in Romania without any of his family or friends being able to attend. On 14 February 1999, on his return to Cyprus with his wife, at Larnaca International Airport, the immigration authorities refused entry to his wife unless the applicant paid 300 Cypriot pounds (CYP) to cover, if need be, the cost of her repatriation to Romania. The applicant paid. On 31 March 2000 the applicant’s wife applied to the Cyprus Immigration authorities and was granted the status of a resident alien, as she had lived with the applicant as his wife for one year from the date of their marriage. The CYP 300 was returned to the applicant.

The applicant complained under Articles 8 (right to respect for family life), 12 (right to marry and found a family), 13 (right to an effective remedy) and 14 (prohibition of discrimination).

The case has been struck out following a friendly settlement in which 5,080 Cyprus pounds (CYP) is to be paid for any pecuniary and non-pecuniary damage and CYP 3,000 for costs and expenses. (The judgment is available only in English.)"
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[Agios Amvrosios]

My jeweller is Turkish Cypriot but his wife is Greek Cypriot and they went to Beirut( Paris of the Middle East) to tie the knot, inthe sixties.

I said Yallah She said Wahlla come sit next to me Abdullah

[Agios Amvrosios]

Who said that Turks are not allowed to return. I know of Specific examples in Paphos- they are healthy happy and no body is givng them a hard time. They had a bit of a run around to get their properties becuase of the gross inefficiencies of the Cypriot public service.

[Piratis]

How did turkish cypriots get married before 1974 since apparently Section 34 of the Marriage Law did not allow a Turkish Cypriot professing the Muslim faith to enter into a civil marriage, as the case in ECHR of Selim v. Cyprus shows:

I believe that before 74, the official marriage was the religious marriage. So muslims could get married to muslims and christians to christians.

Now civil marriage is required (some conflicts with church existed over this) and things have changed. I assume that this law didn't change for TCs also because there was no agreement with the TC community about this.

Are there any ammendments to the voting system since the ECHR judgement of Aziz v. Cyprus:

About this you should actually complain to TCs. We would be more than glad if all Cypriots could vote together, one person one vote, but TCs do not accept that. Actually I perfectly agree with this from ECHR:

The applicant complained that he was refused permission to be registered on the electoral roll, in order to vote in the parliamentary elections of 27 May 2001, because he was a member of the Turkish-Cypriot community. He relied on Article 3 of Protocol No. 1 (right to free elections) and Article 14 (prohibition of discrimination) of the Convention.

So basically discrimination in the voting rights based on race is prohibited. Tell that to TCs!!

And finally if any GC wants to obtain a TRNC citizenship on the grounds that they were born on that land what is the procedure for that. Is it possible? What is the status of the Greek minority, are they granted TRNC citizenship?

SOme points about this:
1) The number of GCs that want to get a "citizenship" of a pseudo state is almost none.
2) There are some Greek Cypriots that didn't live after the invasion. Their number was reduced to a minimum because of the way they were treated.
3) If all GCs refugees return to their homes, what they would have in "TRNC" would not be a GC minority but a GC majority.
4) No, they don't give "TRNC" citizenships to GC refugees.

[bg_turk]

Thank you for your reply Piratis.

But I am still unclear about whether those GC who chose to stay in the TRNC after the "invasion" have TRNC citizenship.

I am also wondering how well are they integrated in the North, do they speak turkish for example?

Maybe some TC can answer this.

[MicAtCyp]

bg_turk,

It seems your whole posting is just a huge personal enquiry. Can you imagine each and every foreigner stepping in and starting a new thread with his questions about the Cyprob?

RE: paragraph 6
http://www.cyprus-forum.com/cyprus1566.html

Nevertheless it's upto the other members to inform you or not. In the meantime you can make a search in this forum using Key words and I am sure you will get all your answers. For your first enquiry (TC properties) try also the keyword "Guardian".

[Piratis]

But I am still unclear about whether those GC who chose to stay in the TRNC after the "invasion" have TRNC citizenship

I have the BTSS citizenship, the SDFSDFS citizenship, and whatever other citizenship you want. I can print such "citizenships" from my computer.

Just like I can print the "ASDFADSSDF" citizenship and it will mean nothing to anybody else except me, the "TRNC citizenship" means nothing to anybody else except Turks.

What our refugees need is not meaningless papers, they want return to legality, so they can return to their homes in safety under the laws of a recognized country which is part of the UN and EU.

[bg_turk]

Thank you for your answers. I will make no more inquiries.