Cyprus-Forum.com

[Oracle]

Poor Oracle is trying to save your sorry arse Paphitis but what can she possibly do when you’ve set them up so nicely and you got slam dunked!

Suicidal tendencies are the hardest to deal with… sooner or later the patient always wins!

Don't trash my efforts as purely face saving. I made some seriously valid points up there! The maths has done my little head in ...

[Paphitis]

Poor Oracle is trying to save your sorry arse Paphitis but what can she possibly do when you’ve set them up so nicely and you got slam dunked!

Suicidal tendencies are the hardest to deal with… sooner or later the patient always wins!

Don't trash my efforts as purely face saving. I made some seriously valid points up there! The maths has done my little head in ...

You're doing fine. Your posts are great!

And the TCs don't have a leg to stand on. Still no proof that the TMT was attacked by militants.

There is more information that will be divulged later!

[BirKibrisli]

Bananiot,
The TC belief was that Yorgadjis was the most fanatical EOKA member,and later on ,as minister for Interiror,he was the operational head of the EOKA remnants...He was thus despised and feared...Do you believe this was the case???

The above are just TC myths and exaggerations. Yorgadjis yielded much power and influence within the Makarios cabinet, but was never more influential over former EOKA members than Grivas and Makarios themselves. There were no EOKA remnants. The organisation did not exist. There were many former EOKA fighters who were rewarded with positions of High Office or became senior public servants.

There was only the CNG and Cyprus Police, who were under the command of Makarios, followed by Yorgadjis and Grivas. TMT strongholds at Kophinou and Kokkina were attacked by the CNG, for blocking the Nicosia to Limassol highway at Kophinou and for Turkish arms smuggling in Kokkina. Even after weeks of CNG and police patrols being attacked, Makarios hesitated and did not want to attack the TMT. Eventually CNG personnel were killed from TMT ambush along the highway, and so Makarios was left with no other choice. The strongholds were reluctantly attacked, and this is what the TMT wanted.

Yes BIR, TMT kept ambushing ROC CNG and police, some were killed, and then the ROC attacked back.

You still refuse to answer my question...There was no CNG in 1963,the two sides could NOT come to an agreement between 1960 -63 to form it...So,
WHO WERE THE GC PARAMILITARIES WHO WERE ATTACKING MY ENCLAVE IN NICOSIA AT THE END OF DECEMBER 1963,IF NOT EOKA REMNANTS????????

Here we go again, you self-serving Turk.

The TCs disrupted governmental processes, organised illegal gangs of TMT with their own insurgent army, prepared enclaves to assist the partition of Cyprus and then you have the audacity to complain if our ministers defend the territorial integrity of the Republic of Cyprus by organising a Greek Cypriot defence!

Spot on!

There was Civil Disobedience from TMT supporting Turkish Cypriots to further Partition, and Yorgadjis responded by sending in the Police!

So are you saying that all TCs killed during this time were TMT and there were no innocent TCs picked on the road side and killed. My god the police were killing innocent civilians. RoC RIP.

YFred,please be kind to Paphidis...He is very happy in his ignorance,his denial of the facts you and I lived through in Cyprus...Sudden onset of reality might send him further around the bend...Have pity on him!Let him stew in his own juices...

Do you want to tall us about the stash of TMT weapons your father stashed under your bed? Weapons that were probably used to ethnically cleanse Armenians from Old Nicosia and which were probably used against the RoC's Police in order to spark the violence to further your Partition objectives.

Sure...The weapons were for defending ourselves against possible EOKA attacks...They were not under my bed but in my bed,to hide them from the British...The place was Yialia,in Paphos,and the time was 1957-58...Anything else you would like to know????

The atmosphere on the island was tense. On December 21, 1963, serious violence erupted in Nicosia when a Greek Cypriot police patrol, ostensibly checking identification documents, stopped a Turkish Cypriot couple on the edge of the Turkish quarter. A hostile crowd gathered, shots were fired, and two Turkish Cypriots were killed. As the news spread, members of the underground organizations began firing and taking hostages. North of Nicosia, Turkish forces occupied a strong position at St. Hilarion Castle, dominating the road to Kyrenia on the northern coast. The road became a principal combat area as both sides fought to control it. Much intercommunal fighting occurred in Nicosia along the line separating the Greek and Turkish quarters of the city (known later as the Green Line). Turkish Cypriots were not concentrated in one area, but lived throughout the island, making their position precarious. Vice-President Küçük and Turkish Cypriot ministers and members of the House of Representatives ceased participating in the government.

http://countrystudies.us/cyprus/13.htm

So BIR, can you tell us about the weapons your father stashed under your bed, when in actual fact there were no EOKA paramilitaries and the whole incident you were referring to involved violent TC crowds within the Nicosia enclave and Cyprus Police?

As you can see, after 2 TCs were killed in the incident, the TCs were already prepared and also began firing and Turkish paramilitaries took control of St. Hilarion. Quite amazing since there was no violence up to that point.

I guess the TMT was getting ready for Partition!

AS I always say,there is noone as blind as one who refuses to see...OR READ....Even your own quotes sink your arguments....

As the news spread, members of the underground organizations began firing and taking hostages.

Who were these UNDERGROUND organisations they are talking about???
If not TMT and the EOKA...

Stop fooling yourself,Pafidi...I understand you don't want to entertain the thought that your HEROES could be capable of atrocities,but that does not change the facts...EOKA was only disbanded on paper...Their members and other recruits formed paramilitary groups and were responsible for cowardly attacks on TC enclaves for months after the incident you described above...By the way in that incident one of the killed was a woman who was riding in the car stopped by the GC Police..You are right in that incident it was GC police in uniform,but those who kept attacking us in our enclaves for months to come were not in uniform...You go figure who they were and why they kept attacking TC enclaves all around the island,resulting in hundreds of TC deaths over some months...Get some reality into your thick head and save yourself from my wrath....Or your end is nearrrrr...

[BirKibrisli]

Bananiot,
The TC belief was that Yorgadjis was the most fanatical EOKA member,and later on ,as minister for Interiror,he was the operational head of the EOKA remnants...He was thus despised and feared...Do you believe this was the case???

The above are just TC myths and exaggerations. Yorgadjis yielded much power and influence within the Makarios cabinet, but was never more influential over former EOKA members than Grivas and Makarios themselves. There were no EOKA remnants. The organisation did not exist. There were many former EOKA fighters who were rewarded with positions of High Office or became senior public servants.

There was only the CNG and Cyprus Police, who were under the command of Makarios, followed by Yorgadjis and Grivas. TMT strongholds at Kophinou and Kokkina were attacked by the CNG, for blocking the Nicosia to Limassol highway at Kophinou and for Turkish arms smuggling in Kokkina. Even after weeks of CNG and police patrols being attacked, Makarios hesitated and did not want to attack the TMT. Eventually CNG personnel were killed from TMT ambush along the highway, and so Makarios was left with no other choice. The strongholds were reluctantly attacked, and this is what the TMT wanted.

Yes BIR, TMT kept ambushing ROC CNG and police, some were killed, and then the ROC attacked back.

You still refuse to answer my question...There was no CNG in 1963,the two sides could NOT come to an agreement between 1960 -63 to form it...So,
WHO WERE THE GC PARAMILITARIES WHO WERE ATTACKING MY ENCLAVE IN NICOSIA AT THE END OF DECEMBER 1963,IF NOT EOKA REMNANTS????????

Here we go again, you self-serving Turk.

The TCs disrupted governmental processes, organised illegal gangs of TMT with their own insurgent army, prepared enclaves to assist the partition of Cyprus and then you have the audacity to complain if our ministers defend the territorial integrity of the Republic of Cyprus by organising a Greek Cypriot defence!

Spot on!

There was Civil Disobedience from TMT supporting Turkish Cypriots to further Partition, and Yorgadjis responded by sending in the Police!

So are you saying that all TCs killed during this time were TMT and there were no innocent TCs picked on the road side and killed. My god the police were killing innocent civilians. RoC RIP.

YFred,please be kind to Paphidis...He is very happy in his ignorance,his denial of the facts you and I lived through in Cyprus...Sudden onset of reality might send him further around the bend...Have pity on him!Let him stew in his own juices...

Do you want to tall us about the stash of TMT weapons your father stashed under your bed? Weapons that were probably used to ethnically cleanse Armenians from Old Nicosia and which were probably used against the RoC's Police in order to spark the violence to further your Partition objectives.

Sure...The weapons were for defending ourselves against possible EOKA attacks...They were not under my bed but in my bed,to hide them from the British...The place was Yialia,in Paphos,and the time was 1957-58...Anything else you would like to know????

EOKA didn't target TCs!

Is that what your father told you while putting you to sleep with fairy tales...????

[boomerang]

why did the UN escorted cars from nicosia to kyrenia...who was taking pot shots at them?...

[BirKibrisli]

why did the UN escorted cars from nicosia to kyrenia...who was taking pot shots at them?...

No one ...The escorts were a precautionary measure,and rightly so given the heat at the time...As far as I know not one shot was fired at any of the convoys for the whole duration 1963-74....If you know differently I am willing to listen...

[boomerang]

why did the UN escorted cars from nicosia to kyrenia...who was taking pot shots at them?...

No one ...The escorts were a precautionary measure,and rightly so given the heat at the time...As far as I know not one shot was fired at any of the convoys for the whole duration 1963-74....If you know differently I am willing to listen...

my recollection is that the convoys were UN organized because of pot shots...it was unsafe to travel on your own...

if as you say it was for precautionary measures, why would the UN organize convoys?...was there a threat or there was action for the UN to take these measures...

[Bananiot]

So, it is just a matter of mathematics now, according to one of our most fanatical forumer. If 1000 TC's were killed by the GC's, 250 GC's killed by the TC's and it is a fair game. Equilibrium!

The Arabs are 100 million and the Israelis 5 million and if 1million Arabs are killed by the Israelis, the Arabs would maintain equilibrium by killing 5 million Israelis and here you have it. The Middle East issue over and done.

Our issue here, however, is Yiorgadjis. This scheming obscure character who switched allegiance with the greatest of ease and was involved in a number of murders or attempted murders. This person would have no moral obstacles to annihilate all Turkish Cypriots. Why didn't he, the fanatical and the skeptic ask. Because Turkey, a mere 40 miles away as we sadly found out in 1974, had warned him that "we are watching every single move of yours". Believe it or not, there is a lot of background politics involved in politics and in similar fashion Israel warned Sadam in 1991 that a chemical attack on Israel would result in the disappearance of Baghdad from the face of the earth.

[halil]

Thanks to Halil and Bananiot. Please keep them coming.

YFred, may be it is not nice to write down these terrible things again and again..... as long as ignoring what was happened in 63's nothing left.....




On 1 January 1964 the Daily Herald reported: "When I came across the Turkish Cypriot homes they were an appalling sight. Apart from the walls they just did not exist. I doubt if a napalm attack could have created more devastation. Under roofs which had caved in I found a twisted mass of bed springs, children's cots, and grey ashes of what had once been tables, chairs and wardrobes. In the neighbouring village of Ayios Vassilios I counted 16 wrecked and burned out homes. They were all Turkish Cypriot. In neither village did I find a scrap of damage to any Greek Cypriot house."

On 14 January 1964 the Daily Telegraph reported that the Turkish Cypriot inhabitants of Ayios Vassilios had been massacred on 26 December 1963, and reported their exhumation from a mass grave in the presence of the Red Cross. A further massacre of Turkish Cypriots, at Limassol, was reported by The Observer on 16 February 1964, and there were many more. On 17 February 1964 the Washington Post reported that "Greek Cypriot fanatics appear bent on a policy of genocide." The Greek Cypriot Minister of the Interior admitted[120] that he had controlled the attack in Limassol himself.

British troops in Cyprus at the time did what they could to protect the Turkish Cypriots, and their efforts are remembered to this day, but the scale and ferocity of the Greek Cypriot attacks, and lack of political will in London, made their task impossible. On 6 February 1964 a British patrol found armed Greek Cypriot police attacking the Turkish Cypriots of Ayios Sozomenos, but they were unable to stop the attack.

On 13 February 1964 the Greeks and Greek Cypriots attacked the Turkish Cypriot quarter of Limassol with tanks, killing 16 and injuring 35. On 15 February 1964 The Daily Telegraph reported: "It is a real military operation which the Greek Cypriots launched against the six thousand inhabitants of the Turkish Cypriot Quarter yesterday morning. A spokesman for the Greek Cypriot Government has recognised this officially. It is hard to conceive how Greek and Turkish Cypriots may seriously contemplate working together after all that has happened."


On 10 September 1964 the UN Secretary-General reported (UN doc. S/5950):
"UNFICYP carried out a detailed survey of all damage to properties throughout the island during the disturbances, . . . . . . . . . it shows that in 109 villages, most of them Turkish-Cypriot or mixed villages, 527 houses have been destroyed while 2,000 others have suffered damage from looting. In Ktima 38 houses and shops have been destroyed totally and 122 partially. In the Orphomita suburb of Nicosia, 50 houses have been totally destroyed while a further 240 have been partially destroyed there and in adjacent suburbs."


The Turkish Cypriots were forced to withdraw into defended enclaves, and it was therefore in January 1964, not in 1974, that Cyprus was divided. On 14 January 1964 "Il Giorno" of Italy reported: "Right now we are witnessing the exodus of Turkish Cypriots from the villages. Thousands of people abandoning homes, land, herds. Greek Cypriot terrorism is relentless. This time the rhetoric of the Hellenes and the statues of Plato do not cover up their barbaric and ferocious behaviour." The Turkish Cypriots had to establish an elected authority to govern themselves whilst confined in their enclaves.

[DT.]

On 1 January 1964 the Daily Herald reported: "When I came across the Turkish Cypriot homes they were an appalling sight. Apart from the walls they just did not exist. I doubt if a napalm attack could have created more devastation.

Perhaps he should ask the GC's that were cooked in napalm what napalm really feels like.

One upmanship on violence, scoring points with who can provide the better article from a foreign journalist that shows who suffered more.

We all know who suffered, we all know the TAF was relentless in their bombing of civilian targets, the Turkish soldiers in their executions and rapes...we all know Sampson who was heading through Kaimakli calling kids in the street like my uncle to join him on the jeep (thankfully he stayed back but his mates went) was not heading into Kaimakli for a picnic but for a slaughter.

Keep playing your games everyone.