Cyprus-Forum.com

[Get Real!]

Epiktitos, you are the one who is confused because it’s the Cypriots who speak “Greek” (<- it’s only a label) correctly and the Greeks who have come up with their own dialect of ancient Cypriot!

http://www.usc.edu/uscnews/stories/3208.html

When Cyprus and Cypriotism flourished and the Cypriots were the masters of the Mediterranean, countries like Greece and Turkey did not even exist!

That paper proves nothing more than that Cyprus was inhabited by Greeks from as far back as the time the alphabet became recognisably more like that used today.

In case you missed it, the narrative that “Greeks” (read Mycenaeans) arrived on Cyprus goes on to say that they were a UNEDUCATED people who came and found Cypriots (natives) ALREADY having an alphabet which they later adopted themselves!

Also, anyone who came to live on Cyprus would’ve been assimilated into Cypriotism within a decade or two just as happens anywhere else in the world.

Why then you famous Cypriots not educated them in your language, in your culture etc. Something seems wrong in your British made theory

That's based on your assumption that "Greek culture" all came from Greece! But in reality, even Christianity came from Cyprus and then spread to Greece because Cyprus was the FIRST country outside the holy land to adopt it!

If anything, it is the Greeks who have adopted Cypriot culture!

[Oracle]

Epiktitos, you are the one who is confused because it’s the Cypriots who speak “Greek” (<- it’s only a label) correctly and the Greeks who have come up with their own dialect of ancient Cypriot!

http://www.usc.edu/uscnews/stories/3208.html

When Cyprus and Cypriotism flourished and the Cypriots were the masters of the Mediterranean, countries like Greece and Turkey did not even exist!

That paper proves nothing more than that Cyprus was inhabited by Greeks from as far back as the time the alphabet became recognisably more like that used today.

In case you missed it, the narrative that “Greeks” (read Mycenaeans) arrived on Cyprus goes on to say that they were a UNEDUCATED people who came and found Cypriots (natives) ALREADY having an alphabet which they later adopted themselves!

Also, anyone who came to live on Cyprus would’ve been assimilated into Cypriotism within a decade or two just as happens anywhere else in the world.

GR! You are confusing the spoken word with the written word.

The link doesn't say "UNEDUCATED", but "illiterate" ... quite different in academic terms. The tradition then was to narrate stories and training, orally, not write them down. Greek was devised primarily as a spoken language, hence the emphasis on harmonics and accentuation.

So the story of the alphabet begins long after the other signs of Greek civilisation.

Even your article says:

The earliest Greek script - Linear B - stems from the Minoan civilization, which thrived on Crete. Indeed, Knossos is the major Mycenaean site of the earliest Greek writing, which dates at about 1400 B.C.
Eventually, this script evolved into another syllabic script - the Cypriot Syllabary - which was used by the Greeks of Cyprus and first appeared in the mid-11th century B.C.

and:

A similar system was used in the Cypriot syllabic script, though in Cyprus, every consonant was written.

By the mid-9th century B.C., when the Phoenicians began living in Cyprus, the Greek scribes were entrenched in using the Cypriot syllabic script.

and:

"The Greeks acquired the Phoenician script at some point and converted it into the Greek alphabet," he said.

He only talks of Greeks (not Cypriots) living alongside Phoenicians:

"My contention is that that happened on Cyprus, when the Greeks and Phoenicians were living next door to each other.

[Get Real!]

GR! You are confusing the spoken word with the written word.

The link doesn't say "UNEDUCATED", but "illiterate" ... quite different in academic terms. The tradition then was to narrate stories and training, orally, not write them down. Greek was devised primarily as a spoken language, hence the emphasis on harmonics and accentuation.

Very entertaining but no peanut I’m afraid!

So the story of the alphabet begins long after the other signs of Greek civilisation.

Even your article says:

The earliest Greek script - Linear B - stems from the Minoan civilization, which thrived on Crete. Indeed, Knossos is the major Mycenaean site of the earliest Greek writing, which dates at about 1400 B.C.
Eventually, this script evolved into another syllabic script - the Cypriot Syllabary - which was used by the Greeks of Cyprus and first appeared in the mid-11th century B.C.

and:

A similar system was used in the Cypriot syllabic script, though in Cyprus, every consonant was written.

By the mid-9th century B.C., when the Phoenicians began living in Cyprus, the Greek scribes were entrenched in using the Cypriot syllabic script.

and:

"The Greeks acquired the Phoenician script at some point and converted it into the Greek alphabet," he said.

He only talks of Greeks (not Cypriots) living alongside Phoenicians:

"My contention is that that happened on Cyprus, when the Greeks and Phoenicians were living next door to each other.

That's because Woodward is using the NARRATIVE that "Greeks" were living there because his emphasis is the LOCATION of the birthplace of the alphabet without challenging this narrative for argument’s sake!

But of course, the infamous narrative assumes that…

1. Greeks arrived in Cyprus without any evidence whatsoever.
2. That once they did, no assimilation of them took place whatsoever!
3. That these “unable/unwilling to assimilate" Greeks learned Cypriot to give Greece the trophy!!!

Now do you understand Oracle, why this narrative isn’t worth the paper it is written on?

[Oracle]

... If anything, it is the Greeks who have adopted Cypriot culture!

I'm not arguing against what to my mind is the most likely scenario which is that Greeks of Cyprus co-evolved along with Greeks of other islands and locations whilst sharing common goals aims and, mostly, alliances against enemies to these shared values. All parts of a whole.

But, what you say above is nonsense. Unless you can explain how the key elements of Greek culture, such as Amphitheatres and temples, as found in Cyprus are merely later examples of far older versions found in Greece?

[Get Real!]

... If anything, it is the Greeks who have adopted Cypriot culture!

I'm not arguing against what to my mind is the most likely scenario which is that Greeks of Cyprus co-evolved along with Greeks of other islands and locations whilst sharing common goals aims and, mostly, alliances against enemies to these shared values. All parts of a whole.

But, what you say above is nonsense. Unless you can explain how the key elements of Greek culture, such as Amphitheatres and temples, as found in Cyprus are merely later examples of far older versions found in Greece?

Again, you are calling the temples "Greek culture" because the widespread narrative has taught you to do so!

[Oracle]

... If anything, it is the Greeks who have adopted Cypriot culture!

I'm not arguing against what to my mind is the most likely scenario which is that Greeks of Cyprus co-evolved along with Greeks of other islands and locations whilst sharing common goals aims and, mostly, alliances against enemies to these shared values. All parts of a whole.

But, what you say above is nonsense. Unless you can explain how the key elements of Greek culture, such as Amphitheatres and temples, as found in Cyprus are merely later examples of far older versions found in Greece?

Again, you are calling the temples "Greek culture" because the widespread narrative has taught you to do so!

No. Because the earlier versions (prototypes) of amphitheatres etc are found in Greece (upon which the newer theatres we see today were rebuilt) and other Greek settlement areas. The slightly older versions where adopted and later built in Cyprus. I'm not denying civilisation dates to at least 10,000 years ago in Cyprus, but so it does too in Greece. It was the same group of people who inhabited this whole region. Splintered and came back again. Always co-operating (eventually) by ties that bind. Merchants sailing back and forth across the whole Mediterranean including Sicily and beyond.

[Oracle]

GR! You are confusing the spoken word with the written word.

The link doesn't say "UNEDUCATED", but "illiterate" ... quite different in academic terms. The tradition then was to narrate stories and training, orally, not write them down. Greek was devised primarily as a spoken language, hence the emphasis on harmonics and accentuation.

Very entertaining but no peanut I’m afraid!

Are you denying that the oral tradition came first?

So the story of the alphabet begins long after the other signs of Greek civilisation.

Even your article says:

The earliest Greek script - Linear B - stems from the Minoan civilization, which thrived on Crete. Indeed, Knossos is the major Mycenaean site of the earliest Greek writing, which dates at about 1400 B.C.
Eventually, this script evolved into another syllabic script - the Cypriot Syllabary - which was used by the Greeks of Cyprus and first appeared in the mid-11th century B.C.

and:

A similar system was used in the Cypriot syllabic script, though in Cyprus, every consonant was written.

By the mid-9th century B.C., when the Phoenicians began living in Cyprus, the Greek scribes were entrenched in using the Cypriot syllabic script.

and:

"The Greeks acquired the Phoenician script at some point and converted it into the Greek alphabet," he said.

He only talks of Greeks (not Cypriots) living alongside Phoenicians:

"My contention is that that happened on Cyprus, when the Greeks and Phoenicians were living next door to each other.

That's because Woodward is using the NARRATIVE that "Greeks" were living there because his emphasis is the LOCATION of the birthplace of the alphabet without challenging this narrative for argument’s sake!

But of course, the infamous narrative assumes that…

1. Greeks arrived in Cyprus without any evidence whatsoever.
2. That once they did, no assimilation of them took place whatsoever!
3. That these “unable/unwilling to assimilate" Greeks learned Cypriot to give Greece the trophy!!!

Now do you understand Oracle, why this narrative isn’t worth the paper it is written on?

That's because that is YOUR narrative!

[Get Real!]

That's because that is YOUR narrative!

Luckily, I'm not alone...

Constructing an archaeological narrative: The Hellenization of Cyprus

http://www.stanford.edu/dept/archaeolog ... /paper.pdf

[Oracle]

That's because that is YOUR narrative!

Luckily, I'm not alone...

Constructing an archaeological narrative: The Hellenization of Cyprus

http://www.stanford.edu/dept/archaeolog ... /paper.pdf

Still trying to hang on to some student's draft thesis paper as "credible evidence" GR!?

[Get Real!]

That's because that is YOUR narrative!

Luckily, I'm not alone...

Constructing an archaeological narrative: The Hellenization of Cyprus

http://www.stanford.edu/dept/archaeolog ... /paper.pdf

Still trying to hang on to some student's draft thesis paper as "credible evidence" GR!?

Do you reckon we should all just abandon common sense and jump on the Hellenic mythological bandwagon?

How academic of you!