Cyprus-Forum.com

[YFred]

There should be a 5 part meeting where all sides can talk face to face and put all the issues on the table,aiming to hammer out a compromise-otherwise this never ending charade will get nowhere,just as it has done for decades....whoever refuses to attend it gets the blame..

Only one side decides what it is prepared to agree ... the RoC!

Sure, roc can then agree with it self. Talking to ones self is one thing but agreeing with is another. Keep on taking the tablets old girl.

[wyoming cowboy]

There are scenarios where both sides can be appeased regarding the guarantor situation, noone seems to want to go that route, Nato could guarantee Cyprus's independence, as it guarantees the independence of all nato countries. Other then Turkey what other nato country has internal problems?

[observer]

There are scenarios where both sides can be appeased regarding the guarantor situation, noone seems to want to go that route, Nato could guarantee Cyprus's independence, as it guarantees the independence of all nato countries. Other then Turkey what other nato country has internal problems?

The Czech Republic and Slovakia don't, now that they have decided to go their own ways.

Nor do Croatia and Slovenia, now that they have decided to go their own ways.

Their could be a hint in there for Cyprus

[B25]

There are scenarios where both sides can be appeased regarding the guarantor situation, noone seems to want to go that route, Nato could guarantee Cyprus's independence, as it guarantees the independence of all nato countries. Other then Turkey what other nato country has internal problems?

The Czech Republic and Slovakia don't, now that they have decided to go their own ways.

Nor do Croatia and Slovenia, now that they have decided to go their own ways.

Their could be a hint in there for Cyprus

Were any of the above invaded by foreign forces, murdered, raped, colonised and ethnically cleansed the indiginous people????

Why do you think they are similar to Cyprus, total rubbish.

They bear no parallels and people who try to use such ridiculous examples are those desperate to split this country up.

Cyprus is one, no north or south, just one, but has a occupying arming illegally station here and constantly threatening its people.

Enough of this talk of dividing our island.

[Viewpoint]

There are scenarios where both sides can be appeased regarding the guarantor situation, noone seems to want to go that route, Nato could guarantee Cyprus's independence, as it guarantees the independence of all nato countries. Other then Turkey what other nato country has internal problems?

The Czech Republic and Slovakia don't, now that they have decided to go their own ways.

Nor do Croatia and Slovenia, now that they have decided to go their own ways.

Their could be a hint in there for Cyprus

Were any of the above invaded by foreign forces, murdered, raped, colonised and ethnically cleansed the indiginous people????

Why do you think they are similar to Cyprus, total rubbish.

They bear no parallels and people who try to use such ridiculous examples are those desperate to split this country up.

Cyprus is one, no north or south, just one, but has a occupying arming illegally station here and constantly threatening its people.

Enough of this talk of dividing our island.

You and blind people like you are in for an almighty shock when these talks collapse.

[Epiktitos]

Right! I geddit!

I think they've agreed on quite a lot of waddevers, just none of the IMPORTANT stuff lol!

Yes, but to stress that.... any agreement on waddevers to date becomes null and void if they fail to agree on the remaining waddevers. ..... cos the only important waddever that has been agreed, and it was agreed at the outset, is that nothing is agreed 'til everything has been agreed.

What are the chances of "everything" being agreed?

I don't understand this logic.

The logic is that any particular offer (say to accept 50,000 settlers) is not isolated and unilateral; this caveat prevents the other side from making political miles out of a good faith offer, for example the way they do in their oft-repeated condemnation of the EU for accepting a "divided" island into the EU despite the GCs rejecting the AP, which the tcs accepted it; or the other gem of constantly bringing up the EUs "broken promise" to end the "embargo" in justifying the refusal to honour commitments made under the EU customs protocol.

Thank you newbie. That makes sense.

What doesn't make sense is why I can't make any anagrams out of your name

Another way to look at the settlement talks over the years is as a kind of Fruit Machine, A One-Armed Bandit Machine of the type they have in places like Las Vegas.These machines have "hold" buttons on each of the spinning reels so that a player can "hold" a favourable position on one or some of the reels 'til the next pull of the handle.

Over the years the Turkish negotiating position has been to try and claim the "hold" positions from the previous talks; and as we all know Turkey goes on and on about the positions in previous negotiations, particularly the last and late Annan Scam.

Do keep telling you all, it's all about Fruit.

Sorry if can just add,... nothing agreed til all agreed = no hold buttons.

My worry is that an over-generous offer may be made with a view to "nothing agreed till all agreed" and then suddenly it's all agreed and we're stuck with an unwanted agreement.

The "nothing is agreed until everything is agreed" approach is the safety mechanism against exactly this: if the other side seems ready to agree, and you're bound to your promise of accepting 50,000 anatolian peasants, you then come up with a final unacceptable demand, such "no guarantors", and maybe even get the parliament to pass a motion to that effect, just so no one is in any doubt.

I wish grown men wouldn't play these games of piling on ever-increasingly absurd caveats simply because they think in the end all can be revoked to the shout of "fooled ya!"

I disagree with pretty much everything that has been "agreed" (50,000 As, rotating presidency, bizonalism or bicommunalism). It would be kinder if they just stopped and changed tack rather than continue dishonestly, as though they will reach some kind of strong, sensible agreement built upon this pile of cards.

The '50,000 Anatolians' is a particularly revolting 'turn' since there were, only, about 100,000 TCs. This would constitute a huge increase to stomach on top of apparently conceding that Turkey had a 'right' to invade (otherwise why negotiate in this way?) and inject her citizens into us. But of course, we did something majorly 'wrong' for which we needed a Presidential public apology, so the rest just follows.

The whole thing has gone too far and they should just call in the EU to explicitly state to Turkey the only acceptable conditions for a modern European country.

The negotiations are a farce. Anything the turks are prepared to accept is worse than the status quo. For the RoC, the talks are a rearguard action so as to not lose the moral high ground and risk any kind of creeping pseudo-recognition. The talks cost nothing for the turks since they lack the moral high ground anyway; all they can do is hope for a miracle in the form of a colossal strategic blunder, like accepting the AP.

The well has been sufficiently poisoned that I doubt that anything will be resolved until the political and economic cost of their occupation exceeds whatever benefit they perceive to earn from it. When this day will occur is anyone's guess.

[observer]

There are scenarios where both sides can be appeased regarding the guarantor situation, noone seems to want to go that route, Nato could guarantee Cyprus's independence, as it guarantees the independence of all nato countries. Other then Turkey what other nato country has internal problems?

The Czech Republic and Slovakia don't, now that they have decided to go their own ways.

Nor do Croatia and Slovenia, now that they have decided to go their own ways.

Their could be a hint in there for Cyprus

Were any of the above invaded by foreign forces, murdered, raped, colonised and ethnically cleansed the indiginous people????

Why do you think they are similar to Cyprus, total rubbish.

They bear no parallels and people who try to use such ridiculous examples are those desperate to split this country up.

Cyprus is one, no north or south, just one, but has a occupying arming illegally station here and constantly threatening its people.

Enough of this talk of dividing our island.

Nor did I say that any of the above were invaded ... etc. although Croatia, Slovenia and probably all the other bits of former-Yugoslavia that will eventually be allowed into NATO for political reasons do bear a certain similarity to Cyprus in that separation has resulted in peaceful co-operation, or at least co-existence, where there was bloodshed before.

As for your statement that Cyprus is one, no north or south, it's a long time since I was at school, but I remember no law of nature saying that Cyprus had to be one political unit. Whether Cyprus is one or not, like borders everywhere, is a political decision.

[Oracle]

There are scenarios where both sides can be appeased regarding the guarantor situation, noone seems to want to go that route, Nato could guarantee Cyprus's independence, as it guarantees the independence of all nato countries. Other then Turkey what other nato country has internal problems?

The Czech Republic and Slovakia don't, now that they have decided to go their own ways.

Nor do Croatia and Slovenia, now that they have decided to go their own ways.

Their could be a hint in there for Cyprus

Cyprus has no parallels with former Czechoslovakia.

But 'Turkey' and Kurdistan, 'Turkey' and Asia Minor, 'Turkey' and Hatay etc etc ... those can fit your "hint" hypothesis.

[observer]

There are scenarios where both sides can be appeased regarding the guarantor situation, noone seems to want to go that route, Nato could guarantee Cyprus's independence, as it guarantees the independence of all nato countries. Other then Turkey what other nato country has internal problems?

The Czech Republic and Slovakia don't, now that they have decided to go their own ways.

Nor do Croatia and Slovenia, now that they have decided to go their own ways.

Their could be a hint in there for Cyprus

Cyprus has no parallels with former Czechoslovakia.

But 'Turkey' and Kurdistan, 'Turkey' and Asia Minor, 'Turkey' and Hatay etc etc ... those can fit your "hint" hypothesis.

I do find with this lady that a little obsession goes a long way..

[YFred]

There are scenarios where both sides can be appeased regarding the guarantor situation, noone seems to want to go that route, Nato could guarantee Cyprus's independence, as it guarantees the independence of all nato countries. Other then Turkey what other nato country has internal problems?

Perhaps the good people of Uranus can be called to guarantee us. What's the matter with you people? You can have anybody to guarantee you including USSR, and all you care about is who guarantees us. Contol freaks or what? You decide yours and we are perfectly capable of deciding for ourselves. Do you hear a single TC saying anything about who can and cannot be your guarantors. No. so top this nonsense, now. You hear. Yeeee Haaaaaa dig digidig digidig digidig.