Cyprus-Forum.com

[DT.]

yes i understand what it means

thats something we will never accept.. two states in any form

then your leader is lieing yet again because a two state solution is on offer not a unitary state

Yes, well, you can appreciate what it's like, when someone refuses to reciprocate your apologise to help move matters forward. You start treating them with utter contempt.

the apology was insincere so it was not taken seriously

please explain why it was insincere?

[YFred]

yes i understand what it means

thats something we will never accept.. two states in any form

then your leader is lieing yet again because a two state solution is on offer not a unitary state

Yes, well, you can appreciate what it's like, when someone refuses to reciprocate your apologise to help move matters forward. You start treating them with utter contempt.

the apology was insincere so it was not taken seriously

please explain why it was insincere?

Because he visited eoka and licked their arse before he made it. What do you think he told them in that meeting? Do you think he asked them if they minded?

[wyoming cowboy]

Listen VP, the problem is is that elements from your clan used the threat of a guarantee to start trouble knowing full well that Turkey would have a chance to intervene, the subject of a guarantee is out of the question when it comes to an EU nation such as Cyprus...To answer your question regarding what a BBF is is that there are two states, with their own constitution and state song, the Federal government will control the ports on both sides, collect taxes and have a federal police force, because cops from one state cannot go into another state...Basically control the ports air patterns, collect certain taxes and formulate foreign policy......where do you see a problem with that.....of course it will be a democracy and the federal govt will consist of mainly GC because we are the majority....No law each state makes cannot supercede the Federal Law....any questions feel free to ask

Why do you GCs want to get rid of our security?

[YFred]

Listen VP, the problem is is that elements from your clan used the threat of a guarantee to start trouble knowing full well that Turkey would have a chance to intervene, the subject of a guarantee is out of the question when it comes to an EU nation such as Cyprus...To answer your question regarding what a BBF is is that there are two states, with their own constitution and state song, the Federal government will control the ports on both sides, collect taxes and have a federal police force, because cops from one state cannot go into another state...Basically control the ports air patterns, collect certain taxes and formulate foreign policy......where do you see a problem with that.....of course it will be a democracy and the federal govt will consist of mainly GC because we are the majority....No law each state makes cannot supercede the Federal Law....any questions feel free to ask

Why do you GCs want to get rid of our security?

If it was as eas as that, there would be no need for any negotiations. Either you address the TC concernes or there will be no deal. Muhtar X realises that I hope before he pisses about any further wasting time.

[fwnh]

Listen VP, the problem is is that elements from your clan used the threat of a guarantee to start trouble knowing full well that Turkey would have a chance to intervene, the subject of a guarantee is out of the question when it comes to an EU nation such as Cyprus...To answer your question regarding what a BBF is is that there are two states, with their own constitution and state song, the Federal government will control the ports on both sides, collect taxes and have a federal police force, because cops from one state cannot go into another state...Basically control the ports air patterns, collect certain taxes and formulate foreign policy......where do you see a problem with that.....of course it will be a democracy and the federal govt will consist of mainly GC because we are the majority....No law each state makes cannot supercede the Federal Law....any questions feel free to ask

Why do you GCs want to get rid of our security?

wow that was quite clarifying cheers

[free_cyprus]

Why do you want security ? this is not the 1960s

Cyprus should be neutral Cyprus should have no links with Greece or turkey it should have no armies there of any kind and European union should be some kind of guarantor's but then again we have Greece and turkey best friends in nato yikes bad joke bad joke

[wyoming cowboy]

Where do you see the complications??? Put up a scenario that you think could occur if there was a true Federal Republic with no guarantees...Lets hear your concerns ....

Listen VP, the problem is is that elements from your clan used the threat of a guarantee to start trouble knowing full well that Turkey would have a chance to intervene, the subject of a guarantee is out of the question when it comes to an EU nation such as Cyprus...To answer your question regarding what a BBF is is that there are two states, with their own constitution and state song, the Federal government will control the ports on both sides, collect taxes and have a federal police force, because cops from one state cannot go into another state...Basically control the ports air patterns, collect certain taxes and formulate foreign policy......where do you see a problem with that.....of course it will be a democracy and the federal govt will consist of mainly GC because we are the majority....No law each state makes cannot supercede the Federal Law....any questions feel free to ask

Why do you GCs want to get rid of our security?

If it was as eas as that, there would be no need for any negotiations. Either you address the TC concernes or there will be no deal. Muhtar X realises that I hope before he pisses about any further wasting time.

[Liontaroui]

VP is right on that, it only takes a few idiots- hence why I support the Turkish troops being withdrawn SLOWLY. Also a good mixed militia, either police or a new infantry. Let's not forget that (a) we have a lot of shotguns and (b) both EOKA and TMT managed to get hold of guns.

YFred, I honestly don't want to get into an argument with you because you have very strong, inflexible ideas and it will degenerate into an argument- you don't want to see a middle ground. Don't take it the wrong way, there's 'GC' forum members of the same style. Sorry dude. All I was saying is that red line should have been traced out earlier, and as far as the RoC is concerned, it wasnt a red line 60 yrs ago because we werent mature enough as a country to let go of Greece's apron strings and we hadn't been invaded by the Turkish army. Again, don't jump down my throat- whether it was right or wrong is irrelevant to what I'm trying to say, but the fact is 99.9 % of GC would not want Turkey to have the right to unilateral intervention in any solution.

But re liontari who fed the guns to EOKA and TMT?? ... the guarantor states this is the whole argument we are making about no guarantors....

Were they guarantors at the time? They could STILL feed weapons in. I agree on no guarantors, but we need a very secure mechanism to ensure that TC's are effectively secure and so are GC, and feel it too. Look, I personally don't think that these days the TC have much to worry about but what I think is irrelevant, both sides need to feel a security if they are to enter any kind of partnership in good faith. That's why I made my suggestion- I'm sure there's an even better way.

Ofcourse they were guarantors, that how RoC was formed with England Turkey and Greece as guarantors. Why go through the same actions and supply people with guns if they have no control over the island hence nothing to gain like they did in the past?

No, they were both formed and armed pre- 1960

[fwnh]

you mean to tell me that eokab was not backed by the junta of greece and that tmt was not backed by turkey?

[Liontaroui]

I mean to tell you that neither was armed by Greece or Turkey IN THEIR CAPACITY AS GUARANTOR and that both were armed covertly pre- independance (and therefore guaranteeship).
Therefore whether there are guarantors or not measures have to be in place to ensure both communities both are and feel safe so as we can move forward.
Geddit?