Cyprus-Forum.com

[DT.]

So, we now acknowledge that above morals and democracy come self interests. You should have no more concerns about the stance of the Angloamericans Piratis. They look after their interests and we should look after ours. Our debate now should concentrate on where our interests lie. With the EU or with Russia. Remember, picking the right partners is what true patriotism is all about. As far as the Georgian refugees are concerned, too bad ... or simply, bad luck! Anyone that talks about morals should as for now just shut it!

P.S. In my view, abstention is worse than voting against. The west, in this case, knows very well why we abstained and it does not need a forum member to spell it out to them. Flirting with Russia, on the other hand, has no positive bearing on our plight, rather it makes things worse for us, since we lose leverage with those that counts.

We are not the ones who violate the rights of anybody else. We are just not in the position to protect others, we are not a super-power.

Our world is jungle and we have to play the game. We have no other option.

Russia is a friendly country and we are not going to destroy our relationship with them so you and your friends will be left alone to get what you want from our island.

So you must understand now why the TCs reacted the way they did faced with your Enosis jungle...They too had no other option...They had to play the game...The game of survival!!!

It was not a game of survival, but a game of gaining as much as you could, even on our expense (as you admited in another post of yours)

You want to play the game with us? Fine. Game on. When in the end you will lose remember that you are the ones who declared the war on us on June 1958 and since then you never accepted to end this war in a way that will be satisfactory to us.

WRONG,Piratis...You started the war on the TCs in 1950 when you voted for Enosis with Greece...The game of SURVIVAL was on from that moment in history...
And you never stopped trying to get your way,not in 1960,not in 1963 and not in 1974...And you are still trying to have your own way with the TCs in 2010!!!! I wish you could see how much damage you are doing to Cyprus...Ask Bananiot,he will tell you...

Bananiot's racism and one-sidedness has unfortunately lost him all credibility with most GC's. He could have been useful once upon a time as a bridgebuilder but to go to the extents of exaggerating claims and making things up just to make his country look bad has pushed him way over the edge.
I see no differences with Bananiots and Denktash's positions now.

Then you are as short-sighted as the rest of them here,and that surprises me,DT...Because he tells you what you don't want to hear does not make him racist...You are willing to jump on an honest mistake to attack Bananiot's credibility...What is the difference between voting against the withdrawal of Russian troops and abstaining from the vote to allow the Georgian refugees back home...???What moral or ethical difference does it make...??? Try some empathy,DT..What would you think if Georgia abstained in a vote to allow the GC refugees to return to their homes in the North???

I didn't jump on this "honest" mistake Bir even though it was anything BUT honest. Bananiots preferences are those that make me and my community second class citizens on this island. I find that racist. I know his positions on the CYprob and I fully disagree with them and find them racist to the GC ethnic community.

On the other hand I have come to a full agreement on the Cyprob with many others over my time on this forum including Big Oz, Deniz, Kikapu and with you (last year). These positions that these individuals held however were nothing as one-sided as what Bananiot has been offering up.

As for Georgia, perhaps you mistook me for someone else but where did I say that I agreed with what the goverment did there? I think you will find I am one of the biggest critics of this govt and indeed of most GC politicians.

Now as far as empathy is concerned Bir, I'm surprised you have time to think about that considering that for the past 2 months you've been repeating the chant that the TC's have suffered 6 times more than the GC's. I can do that empathy as well. The TC's have no idea what real suffering is, hows that?

[Malapapa]

Then you are as short-sighted as the rest of them here,and that surprises me,DT...Because he tells you what you don't want to hear does not make him racist...You are willing to jump on an honest mistake to attack Bananiot's credibility...

Let Bananiot apologise for his honest mistake, if he is to improve his credibility; and then you can apologise too, for applauding this conscious or subconscious self-flagellation.

What is the difference between voting against the withdrawal of Russian troops and abstaining from the vote to allow the Georgian refugees back home...???

There is a clear difference. If there wasn't, abstentions wouldn't exist as a concept. A country can abstain but want to vote 'yes', abstain but want to vote 'no', or abstain and not want to vote at all, all for political reasons.

What moral or ethical difference does it make...??? Try some empathy,DT..What would you think if Georgia abstained in a vote to allow the GC refugees to return to their homes in the North???

I wouldn't be so naive as to believe that countries don't consider their actions very carefully when conducting international diplomacy, and use the abstention when they feel unable, for political reasons, to express a view.

[Get Real!]

Please tell us a single thing that Bananiot has made up.

His assumed IQ!

[Get Real!]

Yes please!

My favourite one:

Bananiot accepts a presidential council with rotating presidency
Denktash proposes in his 2003 Denktash plan a presidential council of 5GC's and 3TCs with rotating presidency

And the most important one... Bananiot accepts a Turkish boyfriend!

[Bananiot]

I expected better from you DT. You chose some issues from the Annan Plan and have accused me (and the 100 000 other Greek Cypriots who voted for solution back then), for supporting them and in so doing, agreeing with Denktash. You will need to try harder for Denktash voted against Denktash in this case and he was overjoyed by our "no", because he thought that the solution offered then was lethal for the sovereign Turkish Cypriot State he wanted to establish.

You have accused us for agreeing for a small Turkish contingent (600) with only small personal arms to remain on the island. At this moment we have 40 000 Turkish soldiers, armed to the teeth, and you have the audacity to claim that 600 of them is better than 40 000. You have claimed that we do not want the return of all refugees. Had we supported the Annan Plan, the vast majority of the refugees would be home by now. Today, due to your patriotic "no", not a single refugee has returned, and you have the audacity to talk about the plight of the refugees who were taken for a ride by Papadopoulos in 2004. "Why rush and support this racist plan, he told us in his message, when we can have a European solution after next week"? Where the hell is this solution and how can we expect the European partners to help us out when our foreign policy is aligned with Russia and Turkey's policy with the west? Tell us how ALL the refugees can return, barring a victorious war, or stop the populist rhetoric that leads you nowhere.

Do you realise that Turkey was overwhelmingly voted as a non permanent member of the Security Council while we call the international community to apply pressure on Turkey to shed its intransigence? Do you understand that you cannot spit on the face of your partners and then go and beg them to help solve your problem? When the GS Moon came to Cyprus, the patriotic forces went into a fit, claiming that he is coming to apply pressure on our side instead on the Turkish side. We have a fixation with "applying pressure" and sending "daily messages" and finding that the "key is in Ankara", but these things do not constitute a struggle nor do they do anything to create the possibilities for solution.

BBF remains the only viable option and if we cannot achieve this we will lose Cyprus forever. Those who cannot see this can keep pretending to be patriots. This might just soften their fatal error.

[boulio]

You have accused us for agreeing for a small Turkish contingent (600) with only small personal arms to remain on the island. At this moment we have 40 000 Turkish soldiers, armed to the teeth, and you have the audacity to claim that 600 of them is better than 40 000. You have claimed that we do not want the return of all refugees. Had we supported the Annan Plan, the vast majority of the refugees would be home by now.

stop your lies or major ommisions:

1)600 turkish soldiers would remain with full unilatteral intervention rights.
2)88,000 refugees would have returned if turkey kept her word.not a vast majority.

[Bananiot]

Morhou, Famagusta, buffer zone, 70 villages, make up the vast majority. Now, not a single refugee has returned. Really, its no match. Had Papadopoulos negotiated it, a large number would have returned to Karpas too! The guarantee treaties could have been worked out too. Turkey could have guaranteed the TC state and perhaps the EU the GC state, for a certain period, until all sick nationalists like yourself, bid us good bye.

[boulio]

how dare you call me a sick nationalist im not even cypriot you ass.morphou and famagusta would have been returned?we went over the famagusta issue a while back and i believe you got your ass handed to you by i believe sotos.large parts of the city would have been kept under t/c admin.comcerning morphou all the good farm land to the west of the city would be kept as well under t/c admin.57 villages would be reuturend and for the karpas it was taken off the table after annan 2 so dont bother about t pap not negotiating.when would the guranteor treaties going to be worked out exactly ?after we voted yes you ass?

[boulio]

http://kypros.org/Occupied_Villages/lefk-gen.html

why dont you check the above link and see how many villages would not be returned to the g/c state you idiot.theres even a english section if you forgot your greek, prick.

[Piratis]

So, we now acknowledge that above morals and democracy come self interests. You should have no more concerns about the stance of the Angloamericans Piratis. They look after their interests and we should look after ours. Our debate now should concentrate on where our interests lie. With the EU or with Russia. Remember, picking the right partners is what true patriotism is all about. As far as the Georgian refugees are concerned, too bad ... or simply, bad luck! Anyone that talks about morals should as for now just shut it!

P.S. In my view, abstention is worse than voting against. The west, in this case, knows very well why we abstained and it does not need a forum member to spell it out to them. Flirting with Russia, on the other hand, has no positive bearing on our plight, rather it makes things worse for us, since we lose leverage with those that counts.

We are not the ones who violate the rights of anybody else. We are just not in the position to protect others, we are not a super-power.

Our world is jungle and we have to play the game. We have no other option.

Russia is a friendly country and we are not going to destroy our relationship with them so you and your friends will be left alone to get what you want from our island.

So you must understand now why the TCs reacted the way they did faced with your Enosis jungle...They too had no other option...They had to play the game...The game of survival!!!

It was not a game of survival, but a game of gaining as much as you could, even on our expense (as you admited in another post of yours)

You want to play the game with us? Fine. Game on. When in the end you will lose remember that you are the ones who declared the war on us on June 1958 and since then you never accepted to end this war in a way that will be satisfactory to us.

WRONG,Piratis...You started the war on the TCs in 1950 when you voted for Enosis with Greece...The game of SURVIVAL was on from that moment in history...
And you never stopped trying to get your way,not in 1960,not in 1963 and not in 1974...And you are still trying to have your own way with the TCs in 2010!!!! I wish you could see how much damage you are doing to Cyprus...Ask Bananiot,he will tell you...

And since when voting for our island to unite with another entity is a "war"? Cyprus was part of the British and earlier Ottoman empires against the will of the vast majority of the Cypriot people. Why being part of a free Greek Republic which is what the vast majority of Cypriots themselves wanted, was "war" with you?

The fact is that you declared the war on GCs on June 1958 when you started burning homes and shops of innocent people and massacring others, for the sole reason that they were GCs. At about the same time you started to demand that we should be annihilate from half of our island.

That is when the war started and it hasn't ended since.