Paphitis wrote:Miltiades needs to understand that only Kikapu, Deniz and umit07 are the only TCs who are True Cypriots, for Bir is just as scandalous and anti Cyprus as VP, Expat, Zan, and Runaway. He only dresses like a lamb but is in actual fact a Grey Wolf!
umit07 wrote:I don't think your being fair on Bir at all Paphitis, what has he said that pisses you off sooo much?
I don't think BIR is being fair to the long suffering Cypriots who were killed, ethnically cleansed and are forbidden from enjoying their ancestral lands for over 35 years.
umit07 wrote:Paphitis, what we want personally and what can be achieved are totally different stories.
If Cyprus is not demilitarized from all foreign troops, then Cyprus can never be truly independent, since 2 foreign countries will always be meddling in our affairs until the powder keg erupts once more and then we are back to square one. All we want is to be left alone, so that Cyprus can flourish as an EU member.
umit07 wrote:I too like most TC's, also wanted a Turkish Army presence in Cyprus after any solution but now am willing to let it go.
Which is why you are regarded as a Cypriot. Bir only wants a reduction of Turkish troop numbers which means the GCs will also be within their rights to request the presence of thousands of Greek troops. So where will all this empathy and understanding leave us when we are both subjugated under 2 foreign powers and what kind of independent nation are we to have?
umit07 wrote:The odd thing is that most TC's don't care how many are stationed in Cyprus as long as the Guarantee Treaties stay intact.
So obviously, by your own admission, there is no empathy and understanding from the TCs. So why does Bir preach this and how do you expect the GCs to feel secure within their own country if Turkey is to have intervention rights, and by extension, Greece will also have intervention rights in Cyprus.
What happens if either of these nations conduct a coup or act in a manner that will undermine RoC sovereignty and independence. We have been dealt a harsh blow from both nations, and quite frankly, the GCs can never stomach a Treaty of Guarantee under any circumstances.
umit07 wrote:On the topic of the Guarantee treaties, TC's basically want some sort of assurance that any brokered deal will not be unilaterally adjusted like they where in 63.
That's where the EU comes in and this is exactly the reason why any solution should be based on a BBF, where all citizen rights are protected Federally, and are within EU Charter norms and rights are not afforded to ethnic groups. Anything different to this will potentially be disastrous.
umit07 wrote:As far as Bir's view on the truth finally coming out on the events between 63 and 74, I'm with him on this one. Blaming the TMT for everything that happened is nonsense, what pisses me off personally is that GC's here on the forum NEVER acknowledge their part in the TC's being forced to migrate away from their villages, yes the TMT may have had a hand in it but I believe this is exaggerated.
Find me just one GC on this forum that does not acknowledge the fact that the GCs also committed some crimes against the TCs between 63-74.
Why don't you ask Oracle, Piratis, Get Real!, Boomerang or Malapapa whether they acknowledge GC involvement which led to the nations demise and decline? You won't find one GC who does not accept their share of responsibility unless you speak to some weirdo such as YiaLoser. Even so, this does not justify or excuse Turkey's invasion, ethnic cleansing and continued occupation of Cyprus.
So we accept our fair share of responsibility! What next?
umit07 wrote:In my view, the day the settler pop. outnumbered the TC's was the day partition was cemented. The settlers being allowed to vote in the annan plan created precedent that these people have a say in Cyprus.
Well let's just hope your wrong shall we?
If not, then the TCs need to get serious and put forward an acceptable proposition for permanent partition, which will lead to their recognition as a State.
umit07 wrote:When it comes to your list Paphitis, I've never liked branding people for their views however much I might disagree with them. It's the same mentality that got us into this mess.
Since when will Freedom of Movement, Freedom of Residency, and
equal rights get us into the same mess we are in right now?
umit07 wrote:So Paphitis I ask you take me off your list of "True Cypriots" since it seems anyone who doesn't tow the line is a "traitor".
That is your prerogative to say this. But I have met you and so I can't accept your request to not be considered a Cypriot, as I would be telling lies and that is something I don't want to do.
Try harder ....
