Cyprus-Forum.com

[Bananiot]

Well, you should be amazed. You claim that Cyprus became a member of EU because Greece blackmailed the EU that it would veto enlargement if Cyprus was not accepted. As simple as that!

In this case it would be reasonable to assume that Greece will say to EU that we will not support the next enlargement that includes Turkey, unless Cyprus returns to pre 1974 ... and we lived happily ever after.

[Piratis]

The use of the word "blackmail" is wrong. To join the EU 2 things must be true:
1)Fulfill the criteria.
2)Be accepted by all current EU members.

1 is the responsibility of the candidate country.
2 is more complicated because not always everybody agrees who should be accepted and who should not (current example is Turkey). While there where countries in the EU that would prefer Cyprus not to be included, we fortunately had a friend with a veto power within EU that used this power to convince the rest to accept Cyprus.

Politics are based on balance of power and how this power is used, and not on verbal promises by some politicians.

In this case it would be reasonable to assume that Greece will say to EU that we will not support the next enlargement that includes Turkey, unless Cyprus returns to pre 1974 ... and we lived happily ever after.

This is irrelevant because:
1)Turkey occupies Cyprus and not EU.
2)A veto for Turkish membership doesn't mean the removal of Turkish troops.

So in this case using the power of veto would probably not bring the desired results, and thats why we will probably not use this veto.
Still, we do have that power, and we can use it to our benefit.

[Bananiot]

Well, you may think that behind the scenes negotiations do not exist in politics, I cannot change this for you. I thought I was stating the obvious. Greece never threatened the EU with using her veto right. Vetoing is like using an A bomb, not against the enemy but against yourself. The accession of Cyprus has to do with Helsinki 1999 and I suggest you read carefully what Papadopoulos had to say on Helsinki.

The idea that Cyprus will veto the accession of Turkey, or any other country, to the EU is utterly absurd. There are other small countries in Europe, like Luxemburg for example, but these countries are shown respect by the big players, because they are dead serious and behave rationally and in unison with the broader interests of the EU as a whole.

[Piratis]

Well, you may think that behind the scenes negotiations do not exist in politics

Who said that? What I said is that such decisions are not simply based on verbal promises. Also, this veto power, is a power that gives weight to what you say behind the scenes. Without this power Greece would have been taken much less seriously.

The idea that Cyprus will veto the accession of Turkey, or any other country, to the EU is utterly absurd. There are other small countries in Europe, like Luxemburg for example, but these countries are shown respect by the big players, because they are dead serious and behave rationally and in unison with the broader interests of the EU as a whole.

We didn't enter the EU to serve the big players interests. No country has done that. "EU as a whole", includes Cypriots, and as equal EU citizens we have the right to demand that our human rights are respected. If Turkey violates the human rights of several hundred thousands of EU citizens then I believe this is a good reason to reject their application if we want to.

[PEACE]

We entered the the EU because of Greece. The Greeks were clear that expansion could not be done without Cyprus. Thats how we entered even with the Cyprus problem unsolved.

Yes,we can say RC entered to EU with Greece's veto threat.Greece said that if EU don't accept Cyprus they will veto all other countries*!



*Countries: The ones who joined the EU with Cyprus in the last enlargement of EU.

[Bananiot]

In order to use your veto right in the EU you need political clout. Simitis was no cloud walker. He knew quite well that by threatening the EU members he could never assist in the direction of making Cyprus a candidate or a member of this exclusive club. The reasons EU could not accept Cyprus are so obvious even bash patriot Piratis could list them. He could only succeed if he convinced the stakeholders that it was Turkey that prevented a solution in Cyprus. Thus, he made his move in Helsinki and the door opened. Of course, at the time, he could never envisage that an "ultra nationalist" will be appointed president by AKEL, the champion of rapproachment and an agreed solution.

"Ultra nationalist" is a term used by members of AKEL all over Cyprus to describe the president at the on going party cell meetings that discuss the results of the recent euro parliament elections.

[Piratis]

In order to use your veto right in the EU you need political clout.

What you need to use veto is a very important reason. For Greece, Cyprus is something very important and therefore they could use the veto power.

He could only succeed if he convinced the stakeholders that it was Turkey that prevented a solution in Cyprus.

Turkey is preventing solution. They occupy part of Cyprus illegally, don't they?

"Ultra nationalist" is a term used by members of AKEL all over Cyprus to describe the president at the on going party cell meetings that discuss the results of the recent euro parliament elections.

You should say "by a small minority of AKEL members. Those that voted yes".

If you say Papadopoulos is "ultra-nationalists" then thinking in the same way I could say that Vasiliou-Cleredes are traitors that the great majority of GC do not trust anymore.

[MicAtCyp]

Correct me if I am wrong but as far as I remember it was not a matter of Veto of Greece as a member state of the EU. But rather a matter of approval of the enlargement by all the EU parliaments. All Parties in the Greek Parliament (with the exception of the Greek communist party-I am not sure) said they would not aprove the enlargement if Cyprus was not included.So it was not Simitis decision alone...

[Piratis]

Correct me if I am wrong but as far as I remember it was not a matter of Veto of Greece as a member state of the EU. But rather a matter of approval of the enlargement by all the EU parliaments. All Parties in the Greek Parliament (with the exception of the Greek communist party-I am not sure) said they would not approve the enlargement if Cyprus was not included.So it was not Simitis decision alone...

Yes, thats how it is. The use of the word "veto" might be wrong in this case, although it would seem like that if Greece was the only country that didn't approve the enlargement.
(I think the communist party would vote against enlargement anyways)