Cyprus-Forum.com

[DT.]

A humanitarian is one who has empathy and compassion for all people,even the "enemy"

A "humanitarian" who supports Institutional racism and accepts human rights violations? I don't think so.

Piratis,
It is easy to feel empathy and compassion for your own "side" ....
It is very easy as you are doing to turn a blind eye to the wrongs of your "side"...It takes an exceptional person to feel for the "other side" and to criticise his own "side" knowing he will draw their wrath...mark my words again, ONE DAY WHEN EVEN WORSE CALAMITIES WILL BE VISITED ON OUR BELOVED CYPRUS BECAUSE YOU AND YOUR THINK-ALIKES,BABANIOT WILL SHINE AS AN EXAMPLE OF WISDOM,LOGIC AND FORESIGHT...

You will be known as "those short-sighted,vengeful,bloody-minded,uncompromising,stubborn" Cypriots, and god knows there are plenty on the TC side like you,who have shot themselves in the foot,in pursuit of dominance and revenge...

So are you threatening us again with more calamities because we insist on democracy and human rights?

Real humanitarians do not support the human rights violations of any side. I, for example, do not support the human rights violations of any Cypriot, either he/she belongs to "my side" or the "other side". I support that all Cypriot citizens should have the 100% of their human rights.

You want to violate the human rights of GCs, and Bananiot supports you. Neither of you can be classified as humanitarians, but you are the complete opposite.

I am not threatening you Piratis,I am warning you,as good friends should when they see their friends on the wrong road...We do not support human right violations...We can see the realities,analyse the recent history,and tell you what is possible and what is not...We want a solution which will reduce the possibility of even worse calamities for Cyprus...You seem to have learned no lessons from our tragic past...In 1963 you were not able to stomach that 18% of Cypriots would hold 30 % of the power... No matter that you had 70% of the power...You chose to see the empty side of the glass.. The results are here to see...Now you are again showing no sign of compromise to achieve a workable and lasting solution..Logic and history tells me you might again live to regret your inflexible attitude..That is all I am saying...You can take it a a friendly warning or a threat...I don't have control over that...It is entirely up to you...

Bir, when you hold a veto right you have 100% of the power not 30%.

I hope your day job is not an accountant. How do you calculate that? I make it 30% (Power) + 20% (Veto) protection which sums up to 50%. Which meant you could not suffocate the TCs legally. Now, how do you get 100%?
Ottomans had 100%. Was it the same deal as the Ottomans?

DO you recall the TC's veto being used in 63 to suffocate the economy of the island by freezing tax collection? This was done in order to blackmail the government into accepting the tc position on municipalities.

When you can bankrupt the country, you hold 100% of the power in my book.

quote]

Sorry, I do not recal, as I was 5. All I recall is bullets coming from the Church on the Starvos hill at that age.

I wasn't alive in 1789 either but I still know what happened during the French Revolution. As for the bullets, then I'll start a new thread with you about the differences of being fired at with a martini rifle or an F5 fighter Jet

Was there no room for negotiations?

There was plenty of room for negotiations. The Makarios proposed amendments were just that. PROPOSED. The Turkish PM at the time pleaded with Kucuk to stay in government and negotiate them but Kucuk's response was that he'd rather withdraw the TC's to Turkey than do that. The fact that kucuk and denktash's ministers in government left behind plans descibing the withdrawal from government creates valid evidence to support the argument that had makarios not proposed those changes something else would have been found to use as an excuse.

Was the only choice to tear the country appart? Was that really the only reason for the 63 troubles. Please read the Akritas plan.
Did enosis really play no part in the 63 troubles?

You tell me if this was reason enough. Have YOU read the Akritas plan?

[Kikapu]

Bir, when you hold a veto right you have 100% of the power not 30%.

I hope your day job is not an accountant. How do you calculate that? I make it 30% (Power) + 20% (Veto) protection which sums up to 50%. Which meant you could not suffocate the TCs legally. Now, how do you get 100%?
Ottomans had 100%. Was it the same deal as the Ottomans?

DT is very accurate when he says, that any veto power equals 100% regardless of who makes it. It is totally undemocratic. For example, if the RoC is the sole veto user against Turkey's EU membership, even though they are only 1/27th of the EU club as we speak, that 1 veto equals to 100% power against Turkey's membership. It gets even worse when we equate the population of the RoC versus the population of the EU, which is very close to 1/500. A veto power of any kind is always 100% against the wishes of the majority. Let me say it again, veto vote of any kind is totally undemocratic.!

[BirKibrisli]

No,NO...Bananiot has an identity,citizen of the world,and common values,humanitarianism,....

I don’t know how you arrived at this conclusion unless you assume that a “humanitarian” is one that supports Turkish Cypriots!

Compassion for the downtrodden is at the very heart of a humanitarian but you’ll never find Bananiot campaigning for any of them! If anything he supports the Anglo-American war machine; the makers of widows and refugees!

What can I say? You’ve got some serious misconceptions in your head!

A humanitarian is one who has empathy and compassion for all people,even the "enemy", and not just his own kind...I have never read a post by Bananiot that supports the Anglo-American war machine...When I do,I will surely tick him off...

I can't have any empathy with a people who have downgraded my democratic and human rights.

I will actually spit when I see a TC!

If we ever meet,Paphidis,I will rememer to bring an umbrella!!!

There is absolutely no chance you and I will EVER meet as I can't respect anyone who supports an Apartheid system in Cyprus where my rights will be less than yours.

You can buzz off, because I only meet with Cypriots who regard me as their equal!

Good,I won't need to carry an umbrella everywhere I go when I visit Cyprus then...

[Paphitis]

Rubbish, paphitis wants to spit on each and every TC indiscriminately. That is vulgar, barbaric and utterly unacceptable. One, I said to Birkibrisli, could have wished the worse for such a person but me and Birkibrisli would never wish such a thing. Anyway, this moron has already admitted that spitting is an evil thing to do!

What is even more unacceptable is how anyone would find it acceptable for an entire race to be discriminated against because of their race. Slavery was abolished long ago.

Being spat on is the least of your problems, because quite frankly, many would be prepared to go further than that, and bullets don't have that warm wet feel to it and they don't tickle either!

[Piratis]

A humanitarian is one who has empathy and compassion for all people,even the "enemy"

A "humanitarian" who supports Institutional racism and accepts human rights violations? I don't think so.

Piratis,
It is easy to feel empathy and compassion for your own "side" ....
It is very easy as you are doing to turn a blind eye to the wrongs of your "side"...It takes an exceptional person to feel for the "other side" and to criticise his own "side" knowing he will draw their wrath...mark my words again, ONE DAY WHEN EVEN WORSE CALAMITIES WILL BE VISITED ON OUR BELOVED CYPRUS BECAUSE YOU AND YOUR THINK-ALIKES,BABANIOT WILL SHINE AS AN EXAMPLE OF WISDOM,LOGIC AND FORESIGHT...

You will be known as "those short-sighted,vengeful,bloody-minded,uncompromising,stubborn" Cypriots, and god knows there are plenty on the TC side like you,who have shot themselves in the foot,in pursuit of dominance and revenge...

So are you threatening us again with more calamities because we insist on democracy and human rights?

Real humanitarians do not support the human rights violations of any side. I, for example, do not support the human rights violations of any Cypriot, either he/she belongs to "my side" or the "other side". I support that all Cypriot citizens should have the 100% of their human rights.

You want to violate the human rights of GCs, and Bananiot supports you. Neither of you can be classified as humanitarians, but you are the complete opposite.

I am not threatening you Piratis,I am warning you,as good friends should when they see their friends on the wrong road...We do not support human right violations...We can see the realities,analyse the recent history,and tell you what is possible and what is not...We want a solution which will reduce the possibility of even worse calamities for Cyprus...You seem to have learned no lessons from our tragic past...In 1963 you were not able to stomach that 18% of Cypriots would hold 30 % of the power... No matter that you had 70% of the power...You chose to see the empty side of the glass.. The results are here to see...Now you are again showing no sign of compromise to achieve a workable and lasting solution..Logic and history tells me you might again live to regret your inflexible attitude..That is all I am saying...You can take it a a friendly warning or a threat...I don't have control over that...It is entirely up to you...

The power you had was more like 50%, not 30%.

30% was the civil servant positions allocated to your 18% minority. So basically a TC secretary had twice as much chance to get a government position that a GC secretary. That is the kind of institutional racism you imposed on us. As if we are still living in the middle ages that you could divide people into Muslims with more rights and Christians with less.

If you can not see how these things are unfair, then you are the one who has not learned the lesson.

Your racism has been creating problems to Cypriots for more than 400 years, but don't expect from us to surrender our rights. We know what our rights are, and we will continue fighting for justice, equality and democracy for as long as it takes and we will never regret for this.

[BirKibrisli]

A humanitarian is one who has empathy and compassion for all people,even the "enemy"

A "humanitarian" who supports Institutional racism and accepts human rights violations? I don't think so.

Piratis,
It is easy to feel empathy and compassion for your own "side" ....
It is very easy as you are doing to turn a blind eye to the wrongs of your "side"...It takes an exceptional person to feel for the "other side" and to criticise his own "side" knowing he will draw their wrath...mark my words again, ONE DAY WHEN EVEN WORSE CALAMITIES WILL BE VISITED ON OUR BELOVED CYPRUS BECAUSE YOU AND YOUR THINK-ALIKES,BABANIOT WILL SHINE AS AN EXAMPLE OF WISDOM,LOGIC AND FORESIGHT...

You will be known as "those short-sighted,vengeful,bloody-minded,uncompromising,stubborn" Cypriots, and god knows there are plenty on the TC side like you,who have shot themselves in the foot,in pursuit of dominance and revenge...

So are you threatening us again with more calamities because we insist on democracy and human rights?

Real humanitarians do not support the human rights violations of any side. I, for example, do not support the human rights violations of any Cypriot, either he/she belongs to "my side" or the "other side". I support that all Cypriot citizens should have the 100% of their human rights.

You want to violate the human rights of GCs, and Bananiot supports you. Neither of you can be classified as humanitarians, but you are the complete opposite.

I am not threatening you Piratis,I am warning you,as good friends should when they see their friends on the wrong road...We do not support human right violations...We can see the realities,analyse the recent history,and tell you what is possible and what is not...We want a solution which will reduce the possibility of even worse calamities for Cyprus...You seem to have learned no lessons from our tragic past...In 1963 you were not able to stomach that 18% of Cypriots would hold 30 % of the power... No matter that you had 70% of the power...You chose to see the empty side of the glass.. The results are here to see...Now you are again showing no sign of compromise to achieve a workable and lasting solution..Logic and history tells me you might again live to regret your inflexible attitude..That is all I am saying...You can take it a a friendly warning or a threat...I don't have control over that...It is entirely up to you...

The power you had was more like 50%, not 30%.

30% was the civil servant positions allocated to your 18% minority. So basically a TC secretary had twice as much chance to get a government position that a GC secretary. That is the kind of institutional racism you imposed on us. As if we are still living in the middle ages that you could divide people into Muslims with more rights and Christians with less.

If you can not see how these things are unfair, then you are the one who has not learned the lesson.

Your racism has been creating problems to Cypriots for more than 400 years, but don't expect from us to surrender our rights. We know what our rights are, and we will continue fighting for justice, equality and democracy for as long as it takes and we will never regret for this.

So Makarios decided that the TCs will have no power at all,and watch them walk away into the sunset laughing behind his hand...For 11 years nobody thought about the democratic or human rights of the TCs...But that was not "institutional racism" I suppose...The TCs deserved it,right???

Anyway,good luck to you,Piratis....And I do hope you will never regret it...

[YFred]

Bir, when you hold a veto right you have 100% of the power not 30%.

I hope your day job is not an accountant. How do you calculate that? I make it 30% (Power) + 20% (Veto) protection which sums up to 50%. Which meant you could not suffocate the TCs legally. Now, how do you get 100%?
Ottomans had 100%. Was it the same deal as the Ottomans?

DT is very accurate when he says, that any veto power equals 100% regardless of who makes it. It is totally undemocratic. For example, if the RoC is the sole veto user against Turkey's EU membership, even though they are only 1/27th of the EU club as we speak, that 1 veto equals to 100% power against Turkey's membership. It gets even worse when we equate the population of the RoC versus the population of the EU, which is very close to 1/500. A veto power of any kind is always 100% against the wishes of the majority. Let me say it again, veto vote of any kind is totally undemocratic.!

But you ignored my comment. 100% is like it was in the Ottoman days. Now are you saying that the two are the same.
Can you confirm what DT believes that the reason why 63 happened was the problem with the TCs and their veto and that enosis had no part to play in it? Are you one with your fellow true democratic friends, and does it apply here on the forum or just when it suits you and your friends?

[Paphitis]

A humanitarian is one who has empathy and compassion for all people,even the "enemy"

A "humanitarian" who supports Institutional racism and accepts human rights violations? I don't think so.

Piratis,
It is easy to feel empathy and compassion for your own "side" ....
It is very easy as you are doing to turn a blind eye to the wrongs of your "side"...It takes an exceptional person to feel for the "other side" and to criticise his own "side" knowing he will draw their wrath...mark my words again, ONE DAY WHEN EVEN WORSE CALAMITIES WILL BE VISITED ON OUR BELOVED CYPRUS BECAUSE YOU AND YOUR THINK-ALIKES,BABANIOT WILL SHINE AS AN EXAMPLE OF WISDOM,LOGIC AND FORESIGHT...

You will be known as "those short-sighted,vengeful,bloody-minded,uncompromising,stubborn" Cypriots, and god knows there are plenty on the TC side like you,who have shot themselves in the foot,in pursuit of dominance and revenge...

So are you threatening us again with more calamities because we insist on democracy and human rights?

Real humanitarians do not support the human rights violations of any side. I, for example, do not support the human rights violations of any Cypriot, either he/she belongs to "my side" or the "other side". I support that all Cypriot citizens should have the 100% of their human rights.

You want to violate the human rights of GCs, and Bananiot supports you. Neither of you can be classified as humanitarians, but you are the complete opposite.

I am not threatening you Piratis,I am warning you,as good friends should when they see their friends on the wrong road...We do not support human right violations...We can see the realities,analyse the recent history,and tell you what is possible and what is not...We want a solution which will reduce the possibility of even worse calamities for Cyprus...You seem to have learned no lessons from our tragic past...In 1963 you were not able to stomach that 18% of Cypriots would hold 30 % of the power... No matter that you had 70% of the power...You chose to see the empty side of the glass.. The results are here to see...Now you are again showing no sign of compromise to achieve a workable and lasting solution..Logic and history tells me you might again live to regret your inflexible attitude..That is all I am saying...You can take it a a friendly warning or a threat...I don't have control over that...It is entirely up to you...

The power you had was more like 50%, not 30%.

30% was the civil servant positions allocated to your 18% minority. So basically a TC secretary had twice as much chance to get a government position that a GC secretary. That is the kind of institutional racism you imposed on us. As if we are still living in the middle ages that you could divide people into Muslims with more rights and Christians with less.

If you can not see how these things are unfair, then you are the one who has not learned the lesson.

Your racism has been creating problems to Cypriots for more than 400 years, but don't expect from us to surrender our rights. We know what our rights are, and we will continue fighting for justice, equality and democracy for as long as it takes and we will never regret for this.

So Makarios decided that the TCs will have no power at all,and watch them walk away into the sunset laughing behind his hand...For 11 years nobody thought about the democratic or human rights of the TCs...But that was not "institutional racism" I suppose...The TCs deserved it,right???

Anyway,good luck to you,Piratis....And I do hope you will never regret it...

Makarios only wanted to do away with this institutionalized racism and it was your choosing to walk (crawl?) away like the spoilt brats you are...

[BirKibrisli]

A humanitarian is one who has empathy and compassion for all people,even the "enemy"

A "humanitarian" who supports Institutional racism and accepts human rights violations? I don't think so.

Piratis,
It is easy to feel empathy and compassion for your own "side" ....
It is very easy as you are doing to turn a blind eye to the wrongs of your "side"...It takes an exceptional person to feel for the "other side" and to criticise his own "side" knowing he will draw their wrath...mark my words again, ONE DAY WHEN EVEN WORSE CALAMITIES WILL BE VISITED ON OUR BELOVED CYPRUS BECAUSE YOU AND YOUR THINK-ALIKES,BABANIOT WILL SHINE AS AN EXAMPLE OF WISDOM,LOGIC AND FORESIGHT...

You will be known as "those short-sighted,vengeful,bloody-minded,uncompromising,stubborn" Cypriots, and god knows there are plenty on the TC side like you,who have shot themselves in the foot,in pursuit of dominance and revenge...

So are you threatening us again with more calamities because we insist on democracy and human rights?

Real humanitarians do not support the human rights violations of any side. I, for example, do not support the human rights violations of any Cypriot, either he/she belongs to "my side" or the "other side". I support that all Cypriot citizens should have the 100% of their human rights.

You want to violate the human rights of GCs, and Bananiot supports you. Neither of you can be classified as humanitarians, but you are the complete opposite.

I am not threatening you Piratis,I am warning you,as good friends should when they see their friends on the wrong road...We do not support human right violations...We can see the realities,analyse the recent history,and tell you what is possible and what is not...We want a solution which will reduce the possibility of even worse calamities for Cyprus...You seem to have learned no lessons from our tragic past...In 1963 you were not able to stomach that 18% of Cypriots would hold 30 % of the power... No matter that you had 70% of the power...You chose to see the empty side of the glass.. The results are here to see...Now you are again showing no sign of compromise to achieve a workable and lasting solution..Logic and history tells me you might again live to regret your inflexible attitude..That is all I am saying...You can take it a a friendly warning or a threat...I don't have control over that...It is entirely up to you...

The power you had was more like 50%, not 30%.

30% was the civil servant positions allocated to your 18% minority. So basically a TC secretary had twice as much chance to get a government position that a GC secretary. That is the kind of institutional racism you imposed on us. As if we are still living in the middle ages that you could divide people into Muslims with more rights and Christians with less.

If you can not see how these things are unfair, then you are the one who has not learned the lesson.

Your racism has been creating problems to Cypriots for more than 400 years, but don't expect from us to surrender our rights. We know what our rights are, and we will continue fighting for justice, equality and democracy for as long as it takes and we will never regret for this.

So Makarios decided that the TCs will have no power at all,and watch them walk away into the sunset laughing behind his hand...For 11 years nobody thought about the democratic or human rights of the TCs...But that was not "institutional racism" I suppose...The TCs deserved it,right???

Anyway,good luck to you,Piratis....And I do hope you will never regret it...

Makarios only wanted to do away with this institutionalized racism and it was your choosing to walk (crawl?) away like the spoilt brats you are...

Well,we haven't spit the dummy,at least...

[Bananiot]

The biggest lie that can be told is that Makarios 13 points were just a proposition. That is absolutely rubbish and indeed, DT forgets that Inonu told Makarios when he visited him in Ankara (State visit it was) in 1963 to drop it, in almost a fatherly way, because this would harm Cyprus a great deal. However, DT, to his credit, remembers that Inonu did ask the TC's to return to the RoC but Kucuk declined, because they were on the recieving end and had to face the full criminal menace of the paramilitarists who wanted to implement the changes by the use of force. This proves another point about the role of Ankara which we can discuss some other time, perhaps.