Cyprus-Forum.com

[insan]

... It seems the target was not the civilians and there's no report that civilians were targeted..

For the revisionist Turks who deny the slaughter they sow.

Eye-witness accounts by the BBC of GC civilian casualties from bombs, shells and Napalm-like burns, later CONFIRMED.

Please click on the VIDEO in this article to see civilian GC casualties from Turkish jets, indiscriminately attacking ...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/date ... 037898.stm

The eye-witness GC doctor did not mention anything abt the ones died or wounded by napalm bombs were civilians or not...

[BirKibrisli]

Unlike you, I always answer when I am asked a direct question.

The question is: Do you think that the TCs should again have gains on our expense, and even more than those that they had with the 1960 agreements? If yes, why?

Instead of answering the question you are trying to give an excuse to everything the Turks and TCs did, while you aparently do not show the same kind of understanding to the actions of GCs.

You can't ask from me to acknowledge the suffering of TCs and the crimes committed against them (which I did) and then at the same time try to excuse all crimes of the TCs and Turkey against us presenting them as the "innocent children" who were misled and have no responsibility for their actions.

I can and I will keep asking you to acknowledge the pain and suffering of the TCs,in the past and at the present...Till you stop playing lipservice to it,and till it penetrates your heart...
Now,Piratis,tell me, What was happening to the TCs between 1963-74???Why were the Piratisess of that period not concerned about the democratic and human rights of the TCs who were forced to desert their villages in fear of their lives???Why were the Makarios government happy to sit back and see tens of thousands of them,myself included, leave their beloved island,their homeland,their place of birth because they saw no future in Cyprus for themselves and their children???

Try answering this quesion without putting the blame back on the TCs,and we might get somewhere...else I will keep singing your song from here till the end of time,till the balance of power changes and you forget your highly evolved democratic and human rights principles and come to kill me in the middle of the night...If I am stupid enough to return to Cyprus to live with the likes of you...

Makarios did make proposals for reforms that would make the imposed constitution a more democratic one but Turkey and TCs turned them down at once and choose to fight to keep their unfair privileges on our expense.

Democracy and human rights is what we were demanding for centuries from the Ottoman and the British Imperialists, so we could peacefully and democratically decide the destiny of our own island, but our request was always refused since these Imperialists wanted to rule our island instead of allowing us to do so.

When did you accept democracy and human rights in Cyprus? You never accepted democracy, you never accepted human rights for all, and you never accepted that Cypriots should be equal without racist discriminations.

This started from the Ottoman rule when you divided people into Muslims with more rights and Christians with less rights. In the 50s you started to demand the ethnic cleansing of the vast majority of Cypriots from the north part of our island and the total separation of the two communities. Then in 1960 you and your Imperialist partners imposed a constitution that divided Cypriots into Greeks with less rights and Turks with privileges. In 1963 you turned down proposals that would make the constitution more democratic. And in 1974 you put into actions the plan you had since the 50s, ehtnically cleansed the vast majority of Cypriots and occupied 1/3rd of our country.

So when did YOU accept democracy and human rights? You never did in the past, and you don't accept it now. You always find some lame excuse to refuse democracy and human rights.

You failed the test,Piratis...you couldnt show any real empathy and compassion for the TC plight of the 63-74 period...you are incapable of any real emotion or understanding of the human condition..You are a robot programmed to repeat the same old democracy tape...Your type is the type who are so convinced they are absolutley right in everything they do,tht they would committ massacres on a whole population for revenge. You scare me...I cannot possibly recommend that the TCs trust you and your kind...There will be no solution...Get ready for the final battle..I can promise you I will not be there....

[BirKibrisli]

To change tack a little, are there any plausible theories as to what Turkey's motives were in permitting/emcouraging this rag-tag group of students to stage such a landing? In strict military and strategic terms this was surely madness. It was a case of sending lambs to their slaughter.

This was exactly my question Tim. This is why I asked if they went there for a picnic.

These people were 500 armed men, and they were obviously armed and brought to Cyprus by Turkey.

If they were indeed so helpless as Bir says, then why were they send to Cyprus by Turkey? Are the Turkish Generals idiots?

Bir asked if Turkey woke up one day and decided it was a nice day to drop some napalm on Cyprus. Apparently dropping napalm on Cyprus was not something decided that day, but a plan conceived much earlier. Bringing those 500 people in Cyprus so Turkey could come later and "save" them by bombing innocent people with napalm was apparently part of the plan.

If anybody has some more logical explanation then I would like to hear it.

You see Tim??? Piratis always finds some Turkish consiracy in everything...It doesnt suit him to think that perhaps the Turkish government simply wanted them off the streets for political reasons...The Prime Minister at the time, Ismet Inonu was the man who had signed Cyprus away to the British in 1923...Perhaps he didnt want to be reminded of that ,day after day by street protests......He was a proud,stubborn and rather difficult individual...
He obviously stuffed up big time with the students,and had to make ammends...He couldnt sit back and let them all be slaughtered like lambs...Such things would never cross Piratis's mind of course...Then he might have to account for the actions of the GC military at the time...Better to blame everything on the Turks and the TC...And have the hide to expect these people to come running into his arms,in a democratic state with human rights...It would be laughable if not so sad...

Turkey sends 500 armed men in Cyprus to attack us and you want to blame us for this? Didn't they send them in order to fight against us? Wasn't this the purpose of getting armed and coming to Cyprus?

And I have to correct you on something which you are VERY mistaken. I do not expect the TCs to "come running in my arms". I know very well that the TCs will settle for nothing less than stealing from us half of our country as per their plan of the 1950s which remains unchanged until today.

Can you read English,Piratis...???500 poorly trained and armed TC students,fighting 5000 well equipped GC fighters...They came because they feared for the lives of their families...They were desperate...What does that tell you about the period??? NOOOO NOT THAT TURKEY WAS USING THEM AS BAIT TO INVADE...tRY SOMETHING REAL AND ORIGINAL..tHEY WANTED TO DIE WITH THEIR PEOPLE..nOT WATCH IT FROM tURKEY...wHAT DOES THAT TELL YOU?????

[BirKibrisli]

The Fractures of a Struggle:
Remembering and Forgetting Erenköy

Rebecca Bryant
George Mason University

http://www.prio.no/upload/Rebecca%20Bryant.doc

Not a single mention of the word "napalm". Presenting the TMT as heroes. She even talks about how they were bringing weapons from Turkey to Cyprus in the 50s with no mention about how those weapons were used: To attack innocent Greek Cypriots and start the inter-communal conflict.

I read 3 pages of this document (and made a search for the word "napalm") and it was more than enough to understand what it was all about.

In many occasions in this forum I exposed PRIO as a pro-Turkish organization. This document is yet another confirmation.

What about Cengiz Topel,Piratis???....Could you bring yourself to comment on his human rights...He was a soldier doing his job..Was captured,tortured,and torn to pieces by your mob...Can you bring yourself to feel for him??? Lets hear how you will justify the cruel treatment of a prisoner of war!!!

What was his job? To invade our country and kill Cypriots?

Are you now supporting murderers Bir? (as long as they are Turkish of course!)

Bir's Logic:

Turkish murderer = good. Deserves his human rights.
Greek Cypriots = all bad. None of them deserve human rights.

What about Cengiz Topel??? Where was his human rights as a prisoner of war???? Did you approve of his being torn to pieces alive,Piratis??? Would you have liked to be there to watch it???would you get great pleasure from it?? One less Turk to worry about when the battle comes???

[Piratis]

Unlike you, I always answer when I am asked a direct question.

The question is: Do you think that the TCs should again have gains on our expense, and even more than those that they had with the 1960 agreements? If yes, why?

Instead of answering the question you are trying to give an excuse to everything the Turks and TCs did, while you aparently do not show the same kind of understanding to the actions of GCs.

You can't ask from me to acknowledge the suffering of TCs and the crimes committed against them (which I did) and then at the same time try to excuse all crimes of the TCs and Turkey against us presenting them as the "innocent children" who were misled and have no responsibility for their actions.

I can and I will keep asking you to acknowledge the pain and suffering of the TCs,in the past and at the present...Till you stop playing lipservice to it,and till it penetrates your heart...
Now,Piratis,tell me, What was happening to the TCs between 1963-74???Why were the Piratisess of that period not concerned about the democratic and human rights of the TCs who were forced to desert their villages in fear of their lives???Why were the Makarios government happy to sit back and see tens of thousands of them,myself included, leave their beloved island,their homeland,their place of birth because they saw no future in Cyprus for themselves and their children???

Try answering this quesion without putting the blame back on the TCs,and we might get somewhere...else I will keep singing your song from here till the end of time,till the balance of power changes and you forget your highly evolved democratic and human rights principles and come to kill me in the middle of the night...If I am stupid enough to return to Cyprus to live with the likes of you...

Makarios did make proposals for reforms that would make the imposed constitution a more democratic one but Turkey and TCs turned them down at once and choose to fight to keep their unfair privileges on our expense.

Democracy and human rights is what we were demanding for centuries from the Ottoman and the British Imperialists, so we could peacefully and democratically decide the destiny of our own island, but our request was always refused since these Imperialists wanted to rule our island instead of allowing us to do so.

When did you accept democracy and human rights in Cyprus? You never accepted democracy, you never accepted human rights for all, and you never accepted that Cypriots should be equal without racist discriminations.

This started from the Ottoman rule when you divided people into Muslims with more rights and Christians with less rights. In the 50s you started to demand the ethnic cleansing of the vast majority of Cypriots from the north part of our island and the total separation of the two communities. Then in 1960 you and your Imperialist partners imposed a constitution that divided Cypriots into Greeks with less rights and Turks with privileges. In 1963 you turned down proposals that would make the constitution more democratic. And in 1974 you put into actions the plan you had since the 50s, ehtnically cleansed the vast majority of Cypriots and occupied 1/3rd of our country.

So when did YOU accept democracy and human rights? You never did in the past, and you don't accept it now. You always find some lame excuse to refuse democracy and human rights.

You failed the test,Piratis...you couldnt show any real empathy and compassion for the TC plight of the 63-74 period...you are incapable of any real emotion or understanding of the human condition..You are a robot programmed to repeat the same old democracy tape...Your type is the type who are so convinced they are absolutley right in everything they do,tht they would committ massacres on a whole population for revenge. You scare me...I cannot possibly recommend that the TCs trust you and your kind...There will be no solution...Get ready for the final battle..I can promise you I will not be there....

Massacres are committed by those who can not respect the democratic choices of people, and they instead use force to try to impose their will.

If you had accepted that Cypriots could be free to peacefully and democratically take decisions for their own island then not a single nose would brake. But when you resort to force in order to impose your will in an undemocratic way then a chain of violence begins. And the only way to brake this chain of violence is to finally accept what you didn't when the circle of blood started: Democracy and human rights.

[Oracle]

... It seems the target was not the civilians and there's no report that civilians were targeted..

For the revisionist Turks who deny the slaughter they sow.

Eye-witness accounts by the BBC of GC civilian casualties from bombs, shells and Napalm-like burns, later CONFIRMED.

Please click on the VIDEO in this article to see civilian GC casualties from Turkish jets, indiscriminately attacking ...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/date ... 037898.stm

The eye-witness GC doctor did not mention anything abt the ones died or wounded by napalm bombs were civilians or not...

It's very sad to witness your desperation to rewrite history to suit your "new Turkish nation of Cyprus". They must pay you well to nit-pick constantly and post profusely your re-written version.

But, they didn't use the term "civilian" as formally as we do, perhaps not realising the desperate distinction Turks would attempt many years later to appear careful (we saw how careful they were in 1974, or were there no civilian casualties then as well, insan?). Makarios used the term "innocent" people and the fact the investigator at no point called any of them soldiers and clearly it was not a Military establishment/hospital ... plus the doctor said people were rushing in to the hospital crying for help means they weren't brought in by military vehicles or some such means.

Also this is in the accompanying BBC article and not queried or denied by the interviewer after what he saw for himself.

The Greek-led Cypriot government said Turkish jets had dropped 750lbs (340 kg) of bombs and napalm on their strongholds in north-west Cyprus.

"The whole area is on fire," said a spokesman for the Cypriot government.

"We cannot estimate casualties but there must be hundreds. Whole villages have been wiped out."

[Piratis]

To change tack a little, are there any plausible theories as to what Turkey's motives were in permitting/emcouraging this rag-tag group of students to stage such a landing? In strict military and strategic terms this was surely madness. It was a case of sending lambs to their slaughter.

This was exactly my question Tim. This is why I asked if they went there for a picnic.

These people were 500 armed men, and they were obviously armed and brought to Cyprus by Turkey.

If they were indeed so helpless as Bir says, then why were they send to Cyprus by Turkey? Are the Turkish Generals idiots?

Bir asked if Turkey woke up one day and decided it was a nice day to drop some napalm on Cyprus. Apparently dropping napalm on Cyprus was not something decided that day, but a plan conceived much earlier. Bringing those 500 people in Cyprus so Turkey could come later and "save" them by bombing innocent people with napalm was apparently part of the plan.

If anybody has some more logical explanation then I would like to hear it.

You see Tim??? Piratis always finds some Turkish consiracy in everything...It doesnt suit him to think that perhaps the Turkish government simply wanted them off the streets for political reasons...The Prime Minister at the time, Ismet Inonu was the man who had signed Cyprus away to the British in 1923...Perhaps he didnt want to be reminded of that ,day after day by street protests......He was a proud,stubborn and rather difficult individual...
He obviously stuffed up big time with the students,and had to make ammends...He couldnt sit back and let them all be slaughtered like lambs...Such things would never cross Piratis's mind of course...Then he might have to account for the actions of the GC military at the time...Better to blame everything on the Turks and the TC...And have the hide to expect these people to come running into his arms,in a democratic state with human rights...It would be laughable if not so sad...

Turkey sends 500 armed men in Cyprus to attack us and you want to blame us for this? Didn't they send them in order to fight against us? Wasn't this the purpose of getting armed and coming to Cyprus?

And I have to correct you on something which you are VERY mistaken. I do not expect the TCs to "come running in my arms". I know very well that the TCs will settle for nothing less than stealing from us half of our country as per their plan of the 1950s which remains unchanged until today.

Can you read English,Piratis...???500 poorly trained and armed TC students,fighting 5000 well equipped GC fighters...They came because they feared for the lives of their families...They were desperate...What does that tell you about the period??? NOOOO NOT THAT TURKEY WAS USING THEM AS BAIT TO INVADE...tRY SOMETHING REAL AND ORIGINAL..tHEY WANTED TO DIE WITH THEIR PEOPLE..nOT WATCH IT FROM tURKEY...wHAT DOES THAT TELL YOU?????

Why did the TCs start the inter-communal conflict in 1958? You talk as if it is the GCs who attacked the TCs, and TCs were forced to defend themselves. The contrary happened. It is the TCs (with the backing of Turkey) who attacked the GCs, and it is the GCs who had to fight back in order to protect their families and their human and democratic rights.

[Oracle]

... Can you read English,Piratis...???500 poorly trained and armed TC students,fighting 5000 well equipped GC fighters...They came because they feared for the lives of their families...They were desperate...What does that tell you about the period??? NOOOO NOT THAT TURKEY WAS USING THEM AS BAIT TO INVADE...tRY SOMETHING REAL AND ORIGINAL..tHEY WANTED TO DIE WITH THEIR PEOPLE..nOT WATCH IT FROM tURKEY...wHAT DOES THAT TELL YOU?????

Can you stop with the drama queen act as this whole story was "rearranged" to improve the image of TCs ... I saw an article once by a Turk ... I'll try and find it again.

[Piratis]

The Fractures of a Struggle:
Remembering and Forgetting Erenköy

Rebecca Bryant
George Mason University

http://www.prio.no/upload/Rebecca%20Bryant.doc

Not a single mention of the word "napalm". Presenting the TMT as heroes. She even talks about how they were bringing weapons from Turkey to Cyprus in the 50s with no mention about how those weapons were used: To attack innocent Greek Cypriots and start the inter-communal conflict.

I read 3 pages of this document (and made a search for the word "napalm") and it was more than enough to understand what it was all about.

In many occasions in this forum I exposed PRIO as a pro-Turkish organization. This document is yet another confirmation.

What about Cengiz Topel,Piratis???....Could you bring yourself to comment on his human rights...He was a soldier doing his job..Was captured,tortured,and torn to pieces by your mob...Can you bring yourself to feel for him??? Lets hear how you will justify the cruel treatment of a prisoner of war!!!

What was his job? To invade our country and kill Cypriots?

Are you now supporting murderers Bir? (as long as they are Turkish of course!)

Bir's Logic:

Turkish murderer = good. Deserves his human rights.
Greek Cypriots = all bad. None of them deserve human rights.

What about Cengiz Topel??? Where was his human rights as a prisoner of war???? Did you approve of his being torn to pieces alive,Piratis??? Would you have liked to be there to watch it???would you get great pleasure from it?? One less Turk to worry about when the battle comes???

I believe that foreign invaders who invade my country throwing napalm bombs to kill my people, rape under age girls, and commit mass murders and similar atrocities fully deserve the death penalty.

If this Topel was such a person then he surely got what he deserved. If not, then he didn't deserve such treatment. Does this answer your question?

[BirKibrisli]

The Fractures of a Struggle:
Remembering and Forgetting Erenköy

Rebecca Bryant
George Mason University

http://www.prio.no/upload/Rebecca%20Bryant.doc

Not a single mention of the word "napalm". Presenting the TMT as heroes. She even talks about how they were bringing weapons from Turkey to Cyprus in the 50s with no mention about how those weapons were used: To attack innocent Greek Cypriots and start the inter-communal conflict.

I read 3 pages of this document (and made a search for the word "napalm") and it was more than enough to understand what it was all about.

In many occasions in this forum I exposed PRIO as a pro-Turkish organization. This document is yet another confirmation.

What about Cengiz Topel,Piratis???....Could you bring yourself to comment on his human rights...He was a soldier doing his job..Was captured,tortured,and torn to pieces by your mob...Can you bring yourself to feel for him??? Lets hear how you will justify the cruel treatment of a prisoner of war!!!

What was his job? To invade our country and kill Cypriots?

Are you now supporting murderers Bir? (as long as they are Turkish of course!)

Bir's Logic:

Turkish murderer = good. Deserves his human rights.
Greek Cypriots = all bad. None of them deserve human rights.

What about Cengiz Topel??? Where was his human rights as a prisoner of war???? Did you approve of his being torn to pieces alive,Piratis??? Would you have liked to be there to watch it???would you get great pleasure from it?? One less Turk to worry about when the battle comes???

I believe that foreign invaders who invade my country throwing napalm bombs to kill my people, rape under age girls, and commit mass murders and similar atrocities fully deserve the death penalty.

If this Topel was such a person then he surely got what he deserved. If not, then he didn't deserve such treatment. Does this answer your question?

Yes,it does...You are a very dangerous person who will justify torture and mutilation to extract revenge...VP is right not to trust you...Get ready for the battle ,Piratis..I will watch it from a long way away..How bitter and twisted individuals come to their sorry end...It will not give me any pleasure..But my children will be safe in any case... What about yours???
What will your legacy be ???Will you pass on all this hatred and bitterness to those poor innocent kids???