Cyprus-Forum.com

[Piratis]

Again I will tell you that for the last 30 years you were not only welcomed to come back to the RC, but you even defined UN resolutions in order not to come. So whatever you lost, you lost it because you insisted on continuing something illegal. It is not our fault. Blame Turkey and your leader if you didn't manage to have what you were planing to have with the land that was stolen from us.

GCs lost a lot more than the TCs not in 40 years period but within a couple of days. You consider nothing 200.000 refugees that lost all their properties. Those refugees are more than your whole population!

And I have no problem with how much TCs will gain. You have all my wishes to become the richest, happiest etc in the world. What I have a problem is if you gain on our loss.
A solution should benefit all, even if that means benefiting GC a little, and benefiting TCs a lot.

[Bananiot]

Taking a long, careful look at history may spare us from this kind of recrimination. I believe that what happened to us over the last half century can best be described as civil war. The struggle for enosis was wrong and fuelled the nationalist sentiments in the tc community. It was wrong because it did not address the inner fears of tcts who naturally became very sceptical of their own fate since events in Crete made them very suspicious. Out of 80 000 turkish cretans not a single one remained after the island's union with Greece. Anyone that claims that their fears were not unfounded will not be telling the truth. Once we started the ball rolling (contrary to all friendly advices) the fate of Cyprus was sealed. On top of this, the struggle for enosis turned nasty and it's enough to say that EOKA killed more gcpts than british soldiers. Countries such as India, Spain and China chose different types of struggle to claim their independence. They did so despite having more muscle than us but of course they had the leaders with vision. We were led by nationalist doctors and lawyers and the chusch! Our struggle was doomed right from the begining.

So, we suffered a lot in 1974 and thereafter. The tcps suffered greatly before 1974. I believe the time has come to put everything behind us and look to the future. We are wiser now. We cannot change history. We all made bad mistakes but it's up to us to shape a peaceful and prosperous future for the whole of cyprus. The tcpts were very dissapointed by our "NO" in the referendum. Some were offended as they thought that we do not want them to be our partners. They are dead right to feel like this. Nationalism is riding high on our side. Many people believe that we are better off to stay separated and to substantiate their argument they they take recourse to the darkest side of our nature. The fear of the turk. The centuries old enemy!

This is what counted more in the referendum in the minds of many gcpts. This is imprinted into our brains from kindergarden and given our current leadership, the vision of unification had no chance.

So much work is needed to turn the sun, as the poet agonisingly argues.

[Piratis]

The British clearly said that they would never stop having us as slaves. You might be comfortable with that, I am not. Although probably not having a lot of chances to succeed, and although many things that EOKA did where not good, the general idea of fighting against the colonialists is correct and rightful.

This is what counted more in the referendum in the minds of many gcpts. This is imprinted into our brains from kindergarden and given our current leadership, the vision of unification had no chance.

I wonder, since you voted "yes", how do you know what people that voted "no" have in their minds? You are just making assumptions, that unfortunately have nothing to do with reality again.
People voted no because they want democracy, security and their human rights.

If you say that people that voted "no" were either misled or nationalists, then I can say that people that voted "yes" are either idiots or traitors.

[Bananiot]

In the 60's, one after the other, the british colonies gained their independence. It is absurd to suggest that the british with their well known democratic institutions would deny cyprus its independence. When EOKA started killing 18 year old school girls (Famagusta) and forcing thousands of leftists to emigrate in order to save themselves from the assasins, the struggle turned sour and could only end in disaster.

You are also saying that I am making assumptions on the nature of the people that voted "NO". Of course I am and there is nothing wrong with this even if you disagree with my conclusions. I believe you have made the wtrong conclusions, and this is inevidable, since you suggest that all 64% that voted "NO" were staunch rejectionists of the A plan. A recent poll conducted by one of our colleges has shown that more than 60% of the people would accept the A plan, given adequate guarantees for it's implementation. This proves my point that there are different types of "NO" and some of the could easily change to a resounding "YES" if we are given another chance to save our country and prevent partition.

[Piratis]

It is absurd to suggest that the british with their well known democratic institutions would deny cyprus its independence.

whatever

I believe you have made the wtrong conclusions, and this is inevidable, since you suggest that all 64% that voted "NO" were staunch rejectionists of the A plan.

First of all it was 75.8% and not 64%.
People voted "no" to reject the plan. If they didn't want to reject it they would vote "yes".

A recent poll conducted by one of our colleges has shown that more than 60% of the people would accept the A plan, given adequate guarantees for it's implementation.

Are you sure that the question was : "Would you accept the Annan plan just with adequate guarantees for it's implementation?" ? Can you give us a link? Or maybe you confuse "security" with "guarantees for implementation". I am asking because I saw several polls in the past and non of them showed the results that you claim.

[Bananiot]

It's extremely hard to argue with someone who seriously thinks that if it were not for EOKA we would still be a british colony (come to think, I wish we still were).

Anyway, the results of the poll were in "Politis" yesterday.

[Piratis]

come to think, I wish we still were

No doubt. Turkey is your second preference i guess.

[Bananiot]

I don't mind you making nasty comments, perhaps they make you feel better, thus I may be doing you lots of good. In any case, all I am saying is that EOKA (A and B) by its actions, has brought Turkey as a player in the Cyprus equation. You can disagree with this, but please do so with dignity and stop seeing enemies and traitors everywhere!

[mehmet]

Maybe, as an addition to the conversation about British colonies, someone can care to name some that still exist. Gibraltar? Maybe some reference books need to be consulted to find one or two islands in the middle of the Atlantic ocean or perhaps there are still a few bits of rock somewhere the British have a flag and not much else on.

If you wish to honour Grivas and EOKA as I was reading some old EOKA members were with some statue somewhere you must do so with an awareness that the division of Cyprus started when someone said 'it is more important that we consider ourselves Greek than Cypriots'. Carry on blaming the British, the Turks, the US, the UN, the EU (this list can go on indefinitely) if you like. You will never solve the future if you can't understand the past.

[Bananiot]

Blaming everyone else except our stupid head is a favourite pastime for gcpts. I was listening to Christofias the other day. For all our ailments, he said, Britain is to blame. The brits are responsible for everything bad that happened to Cyprus. This kind of absurd rhetoric is heard from almost eveybody these days. Its a sad, sad story and absolutely undiplomatic to say the least when it comes from the second in command and also the acting president for most of the time, since Papadopoulos is always absent in his endeavour to find someone to talk to!

My friend, Cyprus is in the grip of nationalism at this moment. The situation is almost desparate and there is no light at the end of the tunnel. We are ruled by extreme nationalists who look for excuses in the shape of Turkey to hold on to power. Playing the patriotic card is all they do and it works! It's devastating, peace loving cypriots are choked to death and if we utter anything, then conveniently we are traitors.