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Can Turkey annex the occupied territory of Cyprus?

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Can Turkey annex the occupied territory of Cyprus?

Postby Get Real! » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:00 pm

Can Turkey annex the occupied territory of Cyprus?

Let’s start with a definition. What is Annexation?

“Annexation is the legal incorporation of some territory into another geo-political entity (either adjacent or non-contiguous). Usually, it is implied that the territory and population being annexed is the smaller, more peripheral, and weaker of the two merging entities. It can also imply a certain measure of coercion, expansionism or unilateralism on the part of the stronger of the merging entities. Because of this, more positive terms like political union or reunification are sometimes preferred.

Annexation differs from cession and amalgamation, because unlike cession where territory is given or sold through treaty, or amalgamation where both sides are asked if they agree with the merge, annexation is a unilateral act where territory is seized and held by one state and made legitimate by the recognition of the international community”


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annexation


And what does international law have to say about the annexation of another state's territory?

Convention (IV) relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War. Geneva, 12 August 1949.

Part III : Status and treatment of protected persons #Section III : Occupied territories

ARTICLE 47 - INVIOLABILITY OF RIGHTS

4. ' Annexation '

”As was emphasized in the commentary on Article 4 , the occupation of territory in wartime is essentially a temporary, de facto situation, which deprives the occupied Power of neither its statehood nor its sovereignty; it merely interferes with its power to exercise its rights. That is what distinguishes occupation from annexation, whereby the Occupying Power acquires all or part of the occupied territory and incorporates it in its own territory (4).

Consequently occupation as a result of war, while representing actual possession to all appearances, cannot imply any right whatsoever to dispose of territory. As long as hostilities continue the Occupying Power cannot therefore annex the occupied territory, even if it occupies the whole of the territory concerned. A decision on that point can only be reached in the peace treaty. That is a universally recognized rule which is endorsed by jurists and confirmed by numerous rulings of international and national courts.”


http://www.icrc.org/ihl.nsf/1a13044f3bb ... enDocument


So, is annexation of another state’s territory possible at all? Well apparently it IS but only under the following circumstances…

3. ' Agreement concluded between the authorities of the occupied territory and the Occupying Power '

"Agreements concluded with the authorities of the occupied territory represent a more subtle means by which the Occupying Power may try to free itself from the obligations incumbent on it under occupation law; the possibility of concluding such agreements is therefore strictly limited by Article 7, paragraph 1"

http://www.icrc.org/ihl.nsf/1a13044f3bb ... enDocument



Conclusion:

The Republic of Cyprus’ territorial sovereignty is protected by the UN Charter and specifically under the Fourth Geneva Convention of 1949, making it impossible for Turkey or any other country, to annex any territorial portion of Cyprus without the Republic’s consent.


Regards, GR.
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Postby B25 » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:18 pm

yes, but will that stop them?

They don't give a hoot about any of the other laws thus broken, why should it bother them now?

Well, we will have to wait and see, otherwise it is just the Turks threats AGAIN!

How many you got on your list so far?? Count me in.

We may have to be the surgeon ourselves :wink:
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Postby Tim Drayton » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:23 pm

The first stage will have to be a sham independence before annexation becomes feasible.
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Postby insan » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:27 pm

First of all; why Turkey or TCs shall look for annexation and not an independent state in full cooperation and collaboration with each other?
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Postby Get Real! » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:42 pm

B25 wrote:yes, but will that stop them?

They don't give a hoot about any of the other laws thus broken, why should it bother them now?

Well, we will have to wait and see, otherwise it is just the Turks threats AGAIN!

How many you got on your list so far?? Count me in.

We may have to be the surgeon ourselves :wink:

You’re missing the whole point here. It’s always important to be able to identify what is LEGALLY POSSIBLE and what is NOT under international law! The definition for annexation itself starts with…

“Annexation is the legal incorporation…”

…note the key word “LEGAL”. Therefore, annexation cannot be conducted illegally and still be called an “annexation”! In other words, there are no loopholes and all Turkey can possibly do is further worsen her standing with bogus ceremonies and such which I doubt she will ever engage in.

What’s important is that no UN member can possibly recognize any Turkish tomfoolery that may mimic "annexation".
Last edited by Get Real! on Mon Oct 19, 2009 6:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Tim Drayton » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:45 pm

Get Real! wrote:
B25 wrote:yes, but will that stop them?

They don't give a hoot about any of the other laws thus broken, why should it bother them now?

Well, we will have to wait and see, otherwise it is just the Turks threats AGAIN!

How many you got on your list so far?? Count me in.

We may have to be the surgeon ourselves :wink:

You’re missing the whole point here. It’s always important to be able to identity what is LEGALLY POSSIBLE and what is NOT under international law! The definition for annexation itself starts with…

“Annexation is the legal incorporation…”

…note the key word “LEGAL”. Therefore, annexation cannot be conducted illegally and still be called an “annexation”! In other words, there are no loopholes and all Turkey can possibly do is further worsen her standing with bogus ceremonies and such which I doubt she will ever engage in.

What’s important is that no UN member can possibly recognize any Turkish tomfoolery that may mimic "annexation".


Can the UN not pass a resoultion that amends or overturns previous resolutions, especially when a paradigm of 35 years' standing has proven fruitless?
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Postby Get Real! » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:48 pm

Tim Drayton wrote:
Get Real! wrote:
B25 wrote:yes, but will that stop them?

They don't give a hoot about any of the other laws thus broken, why should it bother them now?

Well, we will have to wait and see, otherwise it is just the Turks threats AGAIN!

How many you got on your list so far?? Count me in.

We may have to be the surgeon ourselves :wink:

You’re missing the whole point here. It’s always important to be able to identity what is LEGALLY POSSIBLE and what is NOT under international law! The definition for annexation itself starts with…

“Annexation is the legal incorporation…”

…note the key word “LEGAL”. Therefore, annexation cannot be conducted illegally and still be called an “annexation”! In other words, there are no loopholes and all Turkey can possibly do is further worsen her standing with bogus ceremonies and such which I doubt she will ever engage in.

What’s important is that no UN member can possibly recognize any Turkish tomfoolery that may mimic "annexation".


Can the UN not pass a resoultion that amends or overturns previous resolutions, especially when a paradigm of 35 years' standing has proven fruitless?

If all permanent members of the Security Council are unanimous and able to adequately explain why the UN Charter may sometimes be violated then yes! :lol:
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Postby Get Real! » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:52 pm

insan wrote:First of all; why Turkey or TCs shall look for annexation and not an independent state in full cooperation and collaboration with each other?

Playing the devil’s advocate, if I were Turkey why would I gift the mere 100,000 Turkish Cypriots a territory that I had spilt blood for? What’s in it for them?

And not to mention that there is no legal basis for the establishment of an independent TC state. Feel free to supply evidence to the contrary. Build the case…
Last edited by Get Real! on Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby B25 » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:52 pm

Get Real! wrote:
B25 wrote:yes, but will that stop them?

They don't give a hoot about any of the other laws thus broken, why should it bother them now?

Well, we will have to wait and see, otherwise it is just the Turks threats AGAIN!

How many you got on your list so far?? Count me in.

We may have to be the surgeon ourselves :wink:

You’re missing the whole point here. It’s always important to be able to identity what is LEGALLY POSSIBLE and what is NOT under international law! The definition for annexation itself starts with…

“Annexation is the legal incorporation…”

…note the key word “LEGAL”. Therefore, annexation cannot be conducted illegally and still be called an “annexation”! In other words, there are no loopholes and all Turkey can possibly do is further worsen her standing with bogus ceremonies and such which I doubt she will ever engage in.

What’s important is that no UN member can possibly recognize any Turkish tomfoolery that may mimic "annexation".


I hear what you are saying GR, but since when does anything LEGAL mean anything to the Turks.

They ILLEGALLY brought in the settlers against the 4th Geneva Convention, so again I say, who's going to stop them?
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Postby Oracle » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:53 pm

It looks like Annexation is beyond the powers of Turkey or it would have done this before we joined the EU.

Neither the EU nor RoC would cede any part for annexation to an effectively weaker Asian state. It just doesn't make political or economic sense.

As for "independence" for the occupied territories ... Turkey has never been that generous in its entire history so why would it now give up territory, for free and at great cost to itself, to some "TCs" and scummy Settlers?
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