Cyprus-Forum.com

[zan]

For some annexation can't come soon enough.....

One of these days, I hope a Turkish Cypriot will explain to me what this Turkish “annexation” involves…

It involves half a million more Turks and proper trade through Turkey who does not give a shit what the EU thinks

[repulsewarrior]

Turkish politicians do not even know how TC politicians spend the financial aid they provide to TCs. Turkey has much bigger internal and external problems than Cyprus problem.

Only when a big scandalous incident happens they pay attention to TC affairs. They trust their ambassodor in TRNC. If he says everything is ok, it's ok. Primarily, the TC right wing political parties r corrupt... Though during the 5 years that CTP was in power, 3 or 4 embezzlement claims propounded by then the opposition parties.

For a long time, after 1974; abt 40% of TRNC citizens(mostly native TCs) share abt 80% of the wealth whereas 60% of TRNC citizens(mostly settlers or settler origin TCs) share 20% of wealth. This unjust income distribution was created by our corrupt politicians. Turkey has nothing directly to do with corruption of TC politicians... At least they didn't encourage it... and they didn't plan it... Though corruption of politicians is also a big problem in Turkey, still has nothing directly to do with corruption of TC politicians. To a great extend it is related with dishonor and unprinciplness of majority of TC community... Partisanship and nepotism kill and destroy even the stongest empires...

Not sure what to make of your claim that the poor settlers suffer from a kind of social exclusion. Settlers arrived in Cyprus without a penny and were given free land and a voting slip. They were given this not out of generosity but to ensure colonisation. Go to Australia / Canada and see if they give you free land and a vote!

I agree that T/C politicians are generally corrupt - nothing surprises me here. But don't be naive about Turkeys role. How about the role of the Turkish army in looting and smuggling icons? Are you seriously telling me that Turkey does not benefit from that corruption? That they only sign the cheques and let the T/Cs get on with it? What's in it for Turkey? Do you think Turkey does not attach many conditions to her cheques that influence how T/C politicians behave?

I think whatever Turkey pays it is value for money. Where else can you get a colony with free land to distribute for free to your own people, icons to sell and natives who voluntarily swear allegiance to you?

Omer


One question.....Are you prepared to give up and walk into the "RoC" as it stands.......

Turkish Cypriots have a recognised state of their own - the Republic of Cyprus. It is the only state they helped form. They have rights and duties to this state whatever may have happened in the past.

Now if we did get up and cross the green line, overtime we could reform the RoC, although we would lose the north to Turkey and her settlers.

But I think its best for Cyprus and all Cypriots if we persevere with a political solution that would unite north and south and reform the RoC into a federal state. This way we would save lots of time and keep the north.

If we stay as we are, we remain isolated and controlled by Turkey with no influence on the RoC.

Do you think that we could keep the North without Turkey?

The basis for negotiation at present is a bi-communal, bi-zonal (federal) state with political equality. This means a G/C and a T/C constituent state that are equal within a single federal state. In this set up the north will be a T/C constituent state which will be recognised as a T/C constituent state within the federal rep of Cyprus.

Each constituent state will govern areas it has power over, these may include education, public services, policing. At the federal level - issues such as Foreign Policy, Defence (Nato etc) will be decided by the Federal govt. Naturally there would be other areas that are decided by Brussels - Monetary issues (Money) as Cyprus is in the Eurozone.

At present, the TRNC is not a T/C state. It is a Turkish vassal state where T/C actually have little power and remain isolated. Furthermore, settlers outnumber us and will inevitably take over the TRNC and replace the T/Cs as a political force. The above UN solution is a better set up for the T/Cs without a doubt.

welcome Sehan, a Cypriot. cheers!

[insan]

Ömer Seyhan wrote:

No Turkish and Turkish Cypriots interests are by no means synonymous.... how can they be? T/Cs are culturally very different to Turks.

Ömer, the Turks living in various regions of Turkey have very different cultural features but still their national interests r same. R Thracian, Aegean, Eastern Anatolian and Black sea region Turks culturally same?

They are part of the Turkish Republic. T/Cs are part of Cyprus - another state. This makes a huge difference.

It migh make a huge difference as it makes a lot of difference with other independent Turkish states though for a long while 4 of the independent Turkish states have intensed their multfaceted releations and established a common parliamentary assembly consists of reperesentatives of those 4 sovereign Turkish states.

Ömer, vast majority of GCs will never accept any solution that will not make TCs a minority like Turks in Greece. So, face with the realities and struggle for a better TRNC and better Turkey for ur future. Though, throughout the world history these places always have been the targets of world powers because of their geo-strategic and geo-politic importance. I don't think there will ever be a long lasting peace in our region.

[Get Real!]

For some annexation can't come soon enough.....

One of these days, I hope a Turkish Cypriot will explain to me what this Turkish “annexation” involves…

It involves half a million more Turks and proper trade through Turkey who does not give a shit what the EU thinks

Half a million more Turks can't come soon enough?

[zan]

For some annexation can't come soon enough.....

One of these days, I hope a Turkish Cypriot will explain to me what this Turkish “annexation” involves…

It involves half a million more Turks and proper trade through Turkey who does not give a shit what the EU thinks

Half a million more Turks can't come soon enough?

You asked a question GR and got the answer.....You are beginning to sound like Kifeas with your legal argument.....You know I don't want the smallest war but I will tell you what a prominent lawyer said to me when I asked him if Turkey could ever win a legal war.... He said " Who cares. If you look at how America behaves around the world then there is only one thing to say. Might is right"!!! (Not my words)

[Get Real!]

For some annexation can't come soon enough.....

One of these days, I hope a Turkish Cypriot will explain to me what this Turkish “annexation” involves…

It involves half a million more Turks and proper trade through Turkey who does not give a shit what the EU thinks

Half a million more Turks can't come soon enough?

You asked a question GR and got the answer.....You are beginning to sound like Kifeas with your legal argument.....You know I don't want the smallest war but I will tell you what a prominent lawyer said to me when I asked him if Turkey could ever win a legal war.... He said " Who cares. If you look at how America behaves around the world then there is only one thing to say. Might is right"!!! (Not my words)

I can’t figure out how half a million more Turks could possibly benefit Turkish Cypriots…

As for the US’ might, it doesn’t look like it’ll last a century.

[zan]

For some annexation can't come soon enough.....

One of these days, I hope a Turkish Cypriot will explain to me what this Turkish “annexation” involves…

It involves half a million more Turks and proper trade through Turkey who does not give a shit what the EU thinks

Half a million more Turks can't come soon enough?

You asked a question GR and got the answer.....You are beginning to sound like Kifeas with your legal argument.....You know I don't want the smallest war but I will tell you what a prominent lawyer said to me when I asked him if Turkey could ever win a legal war.... He said " Who cares. If you look at how America behaves around the world then there is only one thing to say. Might is right"!!! (Not my words)

I can’t figure out how half a million more Turks could possibly benefit Turkish Cypriots…

As for the US’ might, it doesn’t look like it’ll last a century.

Lets put it this way GR...At the moment Turkey would be severely crippled by being the only doorway to export from the TRNC. Crippled in the EU sense. If aspirations for the EU were to be damaged then more trade would mean more people and an annexation by default. I have cut it short but I hope you get what I mean....


As for Might being right. As history shows, it is only a matter of time for change....But then 600 years of ottoman rule would have seen you, me and our children out

[Tim Drayton]

Zan, I agree with your "might is right" thesis, which is why the world is currently living under a kind of Pax Americana. Turkey has to kow tow to this as much as anybody else. Turkey continues to maintain a large military presence on a section of this island in part because the USA consents to this.

[zan]

Zan, I agree with your "might is right" thesis, which is why the world is currently living under a kind of Pax Americana. Turkey has to kow tow to this as much as anybody else. Turkey continues to maintain a large military presence on a section of this island in part because the USA consents to this.

A dangerous game in my books Tim.......And answers my question as to why Turkey does not pursue much through the courts. In my mind at least they should is both, if at hand. I suppose its back to the line that made me laugh....30,000 lawyers in the South and 40,000 troops in the North. We use our strengths to their limits....Its a good thing to see them talking for once though.