Cyprus-Forum.com

[Gregory]

So this Australian guy has commited some heinous crime and should be black-listed according to some people like Get Real???The Americans,British,Rolandis,and no doubt soon Papandreou and even Christophias will be branded as traitors and the whole world has nothing to do all day other than sit and dream up ways to damage Cyprus,as if its the only country in the world they have to worry about???
Anyone who comes here and dares to express any opinion that these rejectionists don't agree with is always pillioried and called a traitor etc etc...
With this mentality Cyprus is doomed for sure!
They had this kind of attitude in Russia during Stalins time and still do in nasty little dictatorships in various countries around the world!

Perhaps its what we need in Cyprus. A nice short spell under a dictatorship. Seems to me that the "realists" of this island are now competing with each other on who is going to accept the most that Turkey has to offer in the shortest period of time. Perhaps this new fad has gone too far.

Stylianides is a politician I admire who is able to back up his arguments and doesn't seem to have fallen down skid row that Papapetrou and Rolandis have fallen into, who seem more concerned with public opinion of TC's rather than GC's. Understandable since according to the new plan of voting for each others candidates if TC's MUST vote for a GC then these GC's are more likely to be Papapetrou and Rolandis.

This explains why they have dropped out of politics in the ROC and were so angered at the failure of the Annan Plan which meant their new political careers had to wait a few more years.

[Paphitis]

Don't be surprised if they do!After failing to force Downer the U.N. representative out of Cyprus these nutcases will be looking for a new scapegoat to direct their paranoic rantings against!

Downer could be thrown off the island at a moment’s notice if that’s what the government wanted, but all they’re doing at this stage is questioning his integrity to act as a mediator in the Cyprus problem and there is plenty of evidence to back such suspicions/allegations.

Could it be that they afraid the Cyprus problem just might be solved this time around and that would be the end for the armchair patriots,the rejectionists and the other people like them who have wasted the last 35 years trying to peddle trivia and nonesense?

Could it be that someone on this forum is frustrated because the RoC is successfully fending off all Anglo-Turco-American plans against Cyprus?

Downer's business partner is a former Greek Australian Senator, but to classify him as a philhellene because of this is just as ludicrous as labeling him a Turkophile just because his company has a contract with a company that has bought out another Turkish company.

But in case you are wondering, no one really cares GR!, because the fact remains, if Cyprus had politicians of his calibre, there would not even be a Cyprus problem today. He will leave soon, like many before him, without achieving a single thing, and Cyprus will remain partitioned....

After his departure, you will learn about the identities of his advisors, because I may decide to reveal them, and then we will see who will be hitting their head against the brick wall....

[Piratis]

I think I saw the interview of Klerides. It was taken by Costas Gennaris on the occasion of October 1, the 49th anniversary of Cyprus independence. Klerides was very caustic of the rejectionists, but then, he is a very level headed man. Another traitor, that is, according to the logic of B25.

Of course I know the calibre of these people. They are the same people that brought Turkey to Cyprus in the first place and the poor baggers think that they can redeem themselves with their nationalist/fascist slogans.

As far as drinking coffee and eating mahallebi with my friends is concerned, I do not need to give explanations to bigots. I have more in common with Halil than these people who are merely working for the final demise of Cyprus.

Bananiot thinks that rejecting what some foreign Imperialists (AngloAmericans and Turks) want to impose on our island is what is "wrong", while what is "right" is to collaborate with these Imperialists in order to help them to impose their plans in Cyprus on the expense of the Cypriot people.

No mate. What is right is for the Cypriot people to be free to peacefully and democratically decide the destiny of their own island. What is wrong is collaborating with Imperialists in order to prevent this from happening. And such actions can be described by one and only word: Treason.

Who helped Turkey to come to Cyprus and the Imperialists to implement their plans are 2 extremist groups:

1) A group within the Turkish minority (TMT etc), who collaborated with the Imperialists since the 1950s having being promised gains on the expense of the Cypriot people as a reward for their help.

2) A minority of GC extremists (EOKA-B etc) who undermined the efforts of the democratically elected leader of Cyprus, as they were directed by the CIA, and the CIA owned Athens Junta.

It is well known that Cleredes gave refuge to the EOKA-B extremists within DISY, and that his party continued to serve the interests of these foreign Imperialists even after 1974. (which is why they supported the Annan plan)

Today, these two minority groups continue to do what they are told by these specific Imperialists and they continue to betray Cyprus.

I am not saying that every DISY supporter or every member of the TC minority is a traitor. The traitors are specific people in the leadership. People like Bananiot are just fools that allow themselves to be manipulated like that and ultimately help those imperialists to serve their interests in Cyprus.

We, the majority of the Cypriot people, will continue to reject what the imperialists want to impose on our island. We will continue to struggle for our right to peacefully and democratically decide the destiny of our own island. The Imperialists along with their Cypriot traitors and fools, will fail to impose on us what they want. We are not here to "accept" what others want to impose on us. We are the Cypriot people and we want the freedom to decide whatever we want for our own island.

[Bananiot]

So, TMT and EOKA B (etc) are solely to blame for our predicament. Include a good dosage of imperialism and you have the volatile mixture that is responsible for all our ailments. This analysis may have been "good" at the turn of the last century and of course it is just laughable to even attempt to explain contemporary, complex problems in this way. In reality it is simply pathetic for if all those forces were against Cyprus, this island would have receded to the bottom of the Tethys Sea from where it surfaced some millions of years ago, despite the armchair struggles of Piratis and his likes. Just a couple of examples to illustrate the point:

• In 1964 the Turkish armada was ready to set sail for Cyprus but was stopped at the last minute by the imperialists who thus saved our skin, big time.
• In 1967 the above scenario was repeated and the wretched imperialists once more saved the day for us.

A few words for Gregory: Like Piratis you too think that the truth is just a matter of statistics. You surely do not need a fool like me to tell you that the truth may be found within the way of thinking of even the smallest of minorities. In democratic countries, they make doubly sure that all voices are heard, for reasons that you may not understand for the time being but I have confidence in you that you will eventually overcome this handicap.

Just one more thing: In ancient times they used to execute the bearer of bad news. Things have not changed much in Cyprus for some people, who easily brand as traitors (call it execution of character) anyone that proposes rational options to tackle complex issues, be they political, environmental or else.

[B25]

So, TMT and EOKA B (etc) are solely to blame for our predicament. Include a good dosage of imperialism and you have the volatile mixture that is responsible for all our ailments. This analysis may have been "good" at the turn of the last century and of course it is just laughable to even attempt to explain contemporary, complex problems in this way. In reality it is simply pathetic for if all those forces were against Cyprus, this island would have receded to the bottom of the Tethys Sea from where it surfaced some millions of years ago, despite the armchair struggles of Piratis and his likes. Just a couple of examples to illustrate the point:

• In 1964 the Turkish armada was ready to set sail for Cyprus but was stopped at the last minute by the imperialists who thus saved our skin, big time.
• In 1967 the above scenario was repeated and the wretched imperialists once more saved the day for us.

A few words for Gregory: Like Piratis you too think that the truth is just a matter of statistics. You surely do not need a fool like me to tell you that the truth may be found within the way of thinking of even the smallest of minorities. In democratic countries, they make doubly sure that all voices are heard, for reasons that you may not understand for the time being but I have confidence in you that you will eventually overcome this handicap.

Just one more thing: In ancient times they used to execute the bearer of bad news. Things have not changed much in Cyprus for some people, who easily brand as traitors (call it execution of character) anyone that proposes rational options to tackle complex issues, be they political, environmental or else.

Well Bananiot, since you only ever criticise RoC politicians, 'pavement patriots', rejectionists, bigots and is pro imperialist, perhaps you would mind tell us (me) exactly what is your take on this cyprus problem.

All you seem to do is bash others but never offer any way forward apart from galivanting with your turkish mates for coffee.

Come do tell us (me), because if you answer is the Annan plan, then you deserve the labels that are placed upon you.

We (I) wait.

[Oracle]

You surely do not need a fool like me to tell you that the truth may be found within the way of thinking of even the smallest of minorities.

It may be. But it's not a defining characteristic of being a "minority" that you have a monoploy on the truth or that demands should be met to the detriment of democracy.

I don't think the TCs can justifiably claim we do not listen to them. We've heard all their claims (truths and lies) and demands (reasonable and unreasonable). So, perhaps now, they need to address what they are claiming/demanding!

[Lit]

Just a couple of examples to illustrate the point:

• In 1964 the Turkish armada was ready to set sail for Cyprus but was stopped at the last minute by the imperialists who thus saved our skin, big time.
• In 1967 the above scenario was repeated and the wretched imperialists once more saved the day for us.

Quick reply, Bana, before i head out.

How can you compare the early 1960s to the early 1970s? Two completely different decades:

• From 1960-1968, the United States had a democrat President named Lyndon B. Johnson. His secretary of State was named David Dean Rusk.
• From 1969-1974, the United States had a republican President named Richard Nixon. His secretary of State was named Henry Kissinger.

Reputable press from the United States on Kissinger and Cyprus:

http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Intellige ... _0626.html

Former Secretary of State Henry Kissinger pushed for the 1974 Turkish invasion of Cyprus and allowed arms to be moved to Ankara for an attack on that island..

Cypriots are a forgiving people. Many in the RoC, including myself, believe that Cyprus needs to be a strong reliable US ally. Americans are a generous compassionate people. I congratulate President Obama on the Nobel Peace Prize. He can truly earn it by pushing Turkey to comply with international laws and obligations. I would add more here but i am pressed for time. Let me get to why you're constantly berated by fellow contributors. You do it to yourself. Get a clue:

• The "Annan plan" is dead, get over it.
• You are on the fringes of Cypriot political beliefs. 9 candidates were approved to participate in the previous presidential elections and you voted for the guy who received less than 1 percent of the vote.
• Quit using sock puppets, you are an embarrassment.
• The Cyprus Ma//////

l

[Piratis]

So, TMT and EOKA B (etc) are solely to blame for our predicament. Include a good dosage of imperialism and you have the volatile mixture that is responsible for all our ailments. This analysis may have been "good" at the turn of the last century and of course it is just laughable to even attempt to explain contemporary, complex problems in this way. In reality it is simply pathetic for if all those forces were against Cyprus, this island would have receded to the bottom of the Tethys Sea from where it surfaced some millions of years ago, despite the armchair struggles of Piratis and his likes. Just a couple of examples to illustrate the point:

• In 1964 the Turkish armada was ready to set sail for Cyprus but was stopped at the last minute by the imperialists who thus saved our skin, big time.
• In 1967 the above scenario was repeated and the wretched imperialists once more saved the day for us.

A few words for Gregory: Like Piratis you too think that the truth is just a matter of statistics. You surely do not need a fool like me to tell you that the truth may be found within the way of thinking of even the smallest of minorities. In democratic countries, they make doubly sure that all voices are heard, for reasons that you may not understand for the time being but I have confidence in you that you will eventually overcome this handicap.

Just one more thing: In ancient times they used to execute the bearer of bad news. Things have not changed much in Cyprus for some people, who easily brand as traitors (call it execution of character) anyone that proposes rational options to tackle complex issues, be they political, environmental or else.

Bananiot, if it wasn't for those specific Imperialists and those treasonous groups that help them, the Cyprus Problem wouldn't even exist. In the 1950s (or even earlier) the Cypriot people would have been allowed peacefully and democratically to decide the destiny of their own island - no bloodshed, no problems, no Turkish or British occupation of parts of our island. The reason this was not allowed to happen was exactly because the British (and later the Turks) wanted to maintain armies and control over Cyprus. The TC minority was used by these Imperialists as pawns and as the excuse to deny to Cyprus their freedom. They did this by offering to the TC minority gains on our expense as a reward for their help.

This was the situation in the 50s, and nothing much has changed since then.

You are very naive if you believe that those Imperialists would ever put our well being above their own interests. In the 60s they stopped Turkey from invading because of the situation in Greece at that time. Greece had recently been in a civil war between communists and the Right, and the Communists still had a lot of influence among the Greek people. If they had allowed Turkey (a NATO member) to occupy Cyprus that could convince Greeks that their national interests are better served by joining the Eastern Block, and the Americans didn't want this to happen.

This is why CIA installed the Junta in Greece, and in 1974 they agreed that it was a good idea to also remove the "Red Monk" of the "Cuba of Mediterranean", by splitting Cyprus between Greece and Turkey.

You also naively overestimate the power of those Imperialists. Yes, they care only for their own interests and nothing else and they can create coups, install puppet governments, fund terrorists or even invade other countries directly (and they did all of these against Cyprus), but they can not make Cyprus to sink under the sea, or make us disappear.

So nothing is really complex at its core Bananiot. The core is quite simple: Certain Imperialists have interests in maintaining armies and control over Cyprus. Instead of keep fighting the Cypriots directly (as the British tried initially in the 50s), something which can cause problems and casualties to them, they instead use other methods, one of which is "divide and rule" to get the people to fight each other, while they can maintain their armies, listening stations and everything they want without any problem.

Achieving divide and rule is not that complicated either. Just find a minority and offer to them gains on the expense of the majority as a reward for their collaboration. That is all it takes.

[Bananiot]

B25 and Piratis, if you understood the most basic concept of political science "politics is the art of the feasible" perhaps one could have a meaningful debate with you. If not, we are all wasting our time, however, I do have a proposition.

A year after the referendum, Papadopoulos summoned the National Council and asked the members to compile those changes to the Annan plan that could make it palatable to the Greek Cypriot side. As a result, an official document was prepared that bears the name "synopsis". I think that if we proposed this document to the Turkish side we could move on in the talks and gain many friends internationally because we would be showing everybody that we mean business.

This is my idea B25 and the rest of you and since this document contains the collective wisdom of our leadership and was endorsed by Papadopoulos, you should have no problem accepting it. What do you say?

P.S. The imperialists are no joke, says Piratis, and should be taken seriously. Isn't this what I am saying all along? Shouldn't we have taken into consideration the interests of all parties concerned before sinking into the abyss of seeking the desirable instead of the feasible? We have only ourselves to blame and the demagogues that led the people astray, promising them unattainable targets, have been the scourge of our country.

[B25]

OK bananiot, then let me ask you a few questions if you don't mind:

1. Does this Synopsis allow Turkish Guarantor rights?
2. Does it allow the settlers to stay?
3. Does it allow for a full right of return to the GCs and TCs to their properties?
4. Do you agree that for any solution the above 3 points MUST be eliminated?

I eagerly wait your reply.

Thanks