Cyprus-Forum.com

[turkcyp]

deleted by the author...

[RAFAELLA]

Have you heard of saying "one man's terrorist is another's freedom fighter.".....

FOr TCs, EOKA (and not just EOKA B, but in all of its forms) was a vicious terrorist organization that attempted ethnic cleansing on Cyprus. On the other hand our terrorist becomes your freedom fighter for GCs.

The same is true for 1974, but reversed.

Another one obsessed with EOKA.
Either you have a short memory or deliberately you mention nothing about TMT...and that does not come only from you but from all the Tcs/Trs I've met in this forum. Anyway.

Regarding the invasion of '74...things have been repeated over and over again.
And one of the things you fail to understand is that the occupation army is keeping you isolated from the rest of the world for more than 30 years ...but I guess for this as well, the isolation, you are going to blame the Gcs
You know what? If it rains today, blame the Gcs, it's their fault

[RAFAELLA]

"In my conclusions I must also draw attention to the demographic impact of the presence of the Turkish army in the northern part of Cyprus. Even if we take the lowest estimate of a contingent of 30 000 men and a population totaling 180 000 persons, this works out at one soldier per six civilians, a ratio that must be unique in Europe." (COE Parliamentary Assembly 27 April 1992, paras. 105-112)
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This is over 13 years old, what is your facination with past documents, can you not find anything more to-date to back up your debate.

TC see the turkish army as intervention/peace operation as it was their back sides on the line, and as such they now see them as the keeper of peace as since they have been there no violence has occured.
While many tc have different opinions about the turkish army being there, the general concensus is that they would rather they left sooner than later but only after a solution.

Thanks for your reply Brother.

Although, I don't know and I don't understand why it bothers you when I post past documents.
What if this document is 13 years old?
Did anyhting changed since then? No.
Is there any decrease of the occupation army? No, on the contrary.
"...one soldier per six civilians, a ratio that must be unique in Europe."
This is what I wanted to point out, not only the invasion and occupation was and is illegal but also the amount of troops is unreasonable.

[Murtaza]

RAFAELLA


So why do you think, they dont call army of Turkey as occupiers?

[RAFAELLA]

RAFAELLA


So why do you think, they dont call army of Turkey as occupiers?

This was a question from me and for you to answer.
If I knew I wouldn't ask, right?

As I said before, the occupation and the turkish army are keeping you isolated from the rest of the world for more than 30 years.
...and another question for you to answer is, why you cannot realise it?

[turkcyp]

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[RAFAELLA]

This was a question from me and for you to answer.
If I knew I wouldn't ask, right?

As I said before, the occupation and the turkish army are keeping you isolated from the rest of the world for more than 30 years.
...and another question for you to answer is, why you cannot realise it?

I gave answer to this earlier but you fail to understand it. The truth lies at the expression. EOKA was an example. It meant to show you that depending on from which angle you look at the situation the truth and perception changes. GCs and TCS view things differently because they look at the same events from different angles.

For GCs EOKA was freedom fighters and Turkish army is doing occupation and had attempted ethnic cleansing.
For TC Turkish army came to save our asses and EOKA was a terrorist organization that attempted ethnic cleansing.

You askeing why don't TCs realize this is like me saying why don't GCs realize EOKA was a terrorist organization and attempted ethnic cleansing.

In order for one of the sides to see the other's point of view they should start looking with the other sides glasses and look from that angle. In short they should chaneg their perspectives.

BUt again isn't this whole problem about perspectives. If we didn't have different perspectives and motives then Cyprus problme would not exist today.

In short your question and inherently the whole topic is redundant.

My reply was for Murtaza, for the question he asked me.
I've been through your previous answer though.

If there was no invasion, no occupation etc I quess by now the puppet state would have been recognised and the Cy problem wouldn't exist, this is what I don't understand why you cannot and fail to realise.
If everything was legal all the countries would have recognised the bastard child of TR, you agree with me? Yes or No

[turkcyp]

deleted by the author...

[gabaston]

Rafaella

Let me try and answer that. Ok the ta is responsible for our isolation, keeping an open mind this is debatable but anyway it is one reason and if they suddenly left tomorrow it could be said that gc would allow that isolation to be lifted. But gc could then say …..aaahhh wait a minute we cant lift your isolation until we get our lands back, etc and so on and round and round we go again. So to say the TA is responsible for our isolation is only part of the equation.

Prior to the TA and under the Makarios years, please do not think that we traded freely with the world as GC did. We had travel restrictions by means of GC road block searches, many hours stuck in cars in the Cyprus heat waiting for our cars to be searched. Our goods at the airport were subject to violation by GC customs officers, so on and so forth, anything to make our lives unbareable - We had fourteen years of down trodden existence- do not in any way whatsoever compare gc living to tc living during those years. This is one thing you should fully appreciate in order to fully understand why we willingly accept isolation in preference to going back to anywhere near that draconian existence.

[RAFAELLA]

If there was no invasion, no occupation etc I quess by now the puppet state would have been recognised and the Cy problem wouldn't exist, this is what I don't understand why you cannot and fail to realise.
If everything was legal all the countries would have recognised the bastard child of TR, you agree with me? Yes or No

What I fail to answer is why so many members of the forum fail to understand what is being written. I do not want to atttibute to lack of intellect but more and more I am being forced to because what is written is very clear and you can not be clearer than that.

Let me explain one more time and if you still do not understand then it is not my problem.

You have asked in your opening subject this.

“Why is it so difficult for Tcs to realise and accept that?”

And I have explained it to you above by saying it is because we look from different angles.

Not very complicated really.

Noooo, not again...
Turkcyp, I understood excactly what you said about seeing things from different angles etc. BUT from this answer of yours another question rises, read my last reply once again:
If* there was no invasion*, no occupation* etc I quess by now the puppet state would have been recognised and the Cy problem wouldn't exist, this is what I don't understand why you cannot and fail to realise.
If everything was legal all the countries would have recognised the bastard child of TR, you agree with me? Yes or No :)
End of story Not very complicated really.

*as you believe and claim

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