Cyprus-Forum.com

[Paphitis]

Speaking to president Christofias at the UN yesterday, Erdogan referred to "two states" in Cyprus and added that there is no settler problem since the settlers are "citizens of the TRNC". In short Erdogan has nullified Talat as a negotiator by removing any bargaining power Talat says he has.

What is the point of all this BBF talk?

No point at all, in fact Turkey is doing whatever she can to have a dealock the soonest possible and they want that deadlock to happen while Talat is in power because of his good image. They won't allow Eroglu to replace him before an official deadlock...

While waiting for this deadlock Turkey is busy buying out keymen like Verhoigen in the EU (Ok this crook was already bought from the Anan Plan days) the Australian UN representative in Cyprus ( i keep forgetting his name) and many others who we don't know. She will use all these keymen for the next step of trying to get partial recognition. She wants this partial recognition/direct flights/direct trade basically to get off her shoulders as much as possible of the financial load of the occupied.

In the meantime Christofias seems to be sleeping like a baby.

Now whether they will succeed or not remains to be seen. Fact is Turkey does work systematically, they do have plans, and they do try them. This time their plan is very risky though. We will see...

Pyrpoliser,

One thing about Cypriots is that they always jump to conclusions after making a long list of assumptions which only magnify the miscalculation. This I won't belittle at all, because Cyprus has had been betrayed many times by foreign powers and even by its own people...

I have heard much about allegations of vested interests in Turkey through another contractual business deal with an enterprise that is somehow connected to Turkey.

But you should also know, that the person that calls all the shots in these business transactions is a Greek Australian (business partner) former Labor Senator, and not Downer himself.

If you guys have proof about his bias, then hang him. But this will of course be like shooting yourself in the foot.

Yes, he does have his own views on Cyprus. And on the whole, his views are quite reasonable to both sides. Some of these views have only recently been formed, because his knowledge about the Cyprus Problem before he became UN Envoy was to say the least, very basic. Just because he was Australian Foreign Affairs Minister for 12 years does not mean he knows all there is to know about Cyprus. That is what he had advisers for. And even to this day, he has a team of advisers that brief and educate him about Cyprus and its bloody and sad history. Do you know who it is that is advising him on Cyprus? No you don't. They are all Australian, and are all considered experts on Cyprus.

Furthermore, Downer is by no means a key man to solving the Cyprus Problem. This has been stated many times.

His role is one of arbitration and nothing more. He has no authority to go beyond his scope as an arbitrator or negotiations facilitator.

[umit07]

His role is one of arbitration and nothing more. He has no authority to go beyond his scope as an arbitrator or negotiations facilitator.

Wasn't that the case with Desoto also? Then all of a sudden we got the Annan Plan.

I can still remember him displaying a pen and a little black book to reporters after the first meeting between Tpap and Denktas.

[Paphitis]

His role is one of arbitration and nothing more. He has no authority to go beyond his scope as an arbitrator or negotiations facilitator.

Wasn't that the case with Desoto also? Then all of a sudden we got the Annan Plan.

I can still remember him displaying a pen and a little black book to reporters after the first meeting between Tpap and Denktas.

No, that was not the case with Desoto.

The Annan Plan was authored by Desoto and the UN as a "solution" for Cyprus.

These talks are somewhat different. The UN will just sit back and allow the 2 leaders to develop and negotiate THEIR own solution (if possible) to the Cyprus Problem which they hope will be accepted by both communities at a future referendum.

However, as pointed out by Nikitas, Turkey is nullifying Talat's power to negotiate anything, which obviously means that these talks are not really peace negotiations but capitulation talks as far as Turkey is concerned. The talks will no doubt collapse, so it is probably important that Christofias just drags the process out until Eroglu takes over, because then the blame will quite likely switch to Turkey and the UBP Party.

[insan]

His role is one of arbitration and nothing more. He has no authority to go beyond his scope as an arbitrator or negotiations facilitator.

Wasn't that the case with Desoto also? Then all of a sudden we got the Annan Plan.

I can still remember him displaying a pen and a little black book to reporters after the first meeting between Tpap and Denktas.

No, that was not the case with Desoto.

The Annan Plan was authored by Desoto and the UN as a "solution" for Cyprus.

These talks are somewhat different. The UN will just sit back and allow the 2 leaders to develop and negotiate THEIR own solution (if possible) to the Cyprus Problem which they hope will be accepted by both communities at a future referendum.

However, as pointed out by Nikitas, Turkey is nullifying Talat's power to negotiate anything, which obviously means that these talks are not really peace negotiations but capitulation talks as far as Turkey is concerned. The talks will no doubt collapse, so it is probably important that Christofias just drags the process out until Eroglu takes over, because then the blame will quite likely switch to Turkey and the UBP Party.

That's the game being played by sneaky Chris but what if Turkey and Eroglu r aware of the game and hunt Chris while he sets up for hunting them?

[umit07]

His role is one of arbitration and nothing more. He has no authority to go beyond his scope as an arbitrator or negotiations facilitator.

Wasn't that the case with Desoto also? Then all of a sudden we got the Annan Plan.

I can still remember him displaying a pen and a little black book to reporters after the first meeting between Tpap and Denktas.

No, that was not the case with Desoto.

The Annan Plan was authored by Desoto and the UN as a "solution" for Cyprus.

These talks are somewhat different. The UN will just sit back and allow the 2 leaders to develop and negotiate THEIR own solution (if possible) to the Cyprus Problem which they hope will be accepted by both communities at a future referendum.

However, as pointed out by Nikitas, Turkey is nullifying Talat's power to negotiate anything, which obviously means that these talks are not really peace negotiations but capitulation talks as far as Turkey is concerned. The talks will no doubt collapse, so it is probably important that Christofias just drags the process out until Eroglu takes over, because then the blame will quite likely switch to Turkey and the UBP Party.

What I am disputing is that Desoto was also an arbitrator until he pulled the Annan Plan out of he's ass.

[Paphitis]

His role is one of arbitration and nothing more. He has no authority to go beyond his scope as an arbitrator or negotiations facilitator.

Wasn't that the case with Desoto also? Then all of a sudden we got the Annan Plan.

I can still remember him displaying a pen and a little black book to reporters after the first meeting between Tpap and Denktas.

No, that was not the case with Desoto.

The Annan Plan was authored by Desoto and the UN as a "solution" for Cyprus.

These talks are somewhat different. The UN will just sit back and allow the 2 leaders to develop and negotiate THEIR own solution (if possible) to the Cyprus Problem which they hope will be accepted by both communities at a future referendum.

However, as pointed out by Nikitas, Turkey is nullifying Talat's power to negotiate anything, which obviously means that these talks are not really peace negotiations but capitulation talks as far as Turkey is concerned. The talks will no doubt collapse, so it is probably important that Christofias just drags the process out until Eroglu takes over, because then the blame will quite likely switch to Turkey and the UBP Party.

What I am disputing is that Desoto was also an arbitrator until he pulled the Annan Plan out of he's ass.

You may be right.

But I have the impression that the Annan Plan was authored and manipulated by the UN.

I think the 2 leaders will be responsible for constructing their own solution (if possible) this time round.

[Paphitis]

His role is one of arbitration and nothing more. He has no authority to go beyond his scope as an arbitrator or negotiations facilitator.

Wasn't that the case with Desoto also? Then all of a sudden we got the Annan Plan.

I can still remember him displaying a pen and a little black book to reporters after the first meeting between Tpap and Denktas.

No, that was not the case with Desoto.

The Annan Plan was authored by Desoto and the UN as a "solution" for Cyprus.

These talks are somewhat different. The UN will just sit back and allow the 2 leaders to develop and negotiate THEIR own solution (if possible) to the Cyprus Problem which they hope will be accepted by both communities at a future referendum.

However, as pointed out by Nikitas, Turkey is nullifying Talat's power to negotiate anything, which obviously means that these talks are not really peace negotiations but capitulation talks as far as Turkey is concerned. The talks will no doubt collapse, so it is probably important that Christofias just drags the process out until Eroglu takes over, because then the blame will quite likely switch to Turkey and the UBP Party.

That's the game being played by sneaky Chris but what if Turkey and Eroglu r aware of the game and hunt Chris while he sets up for hunting them?

I think you will find that he genuinely wants to unify Cyprus, but the games and antics from Turkey leave him with no other choice, as Turkey's terms are not acceptable.

The key to a solution is in Ankara, and Talat is powerless to negotiate anything. It is Turkey's unacceptable demands which will lead to the collapse of the talks, and we will do everything in our power to ensure that Turkey is blamed for their eventual collapse.

[insan]

His role is one of arbitration and nothing more. He has no authority to go beyond his scope as an arbitrator or negotiations facilitator.

Wasn't that the case with Desoto also? Then all of a sudden we got the Annan Plan.

I can still remember him displaying a pen and a little black book to reporters after the first meeting between Tpap and Denktas.

No, that was not the case with Desoto.

The Annan Plan was authored by Desoto and the UN as a "solution" for Cyprus.

These talks are somewhat different. The UN will just sit back and allow the 2 leaders to develop and negotiate THEIR own solution (if possible) to the Cyprus Problem which they hope will be accepted by both communities at a future referendum.

However, as pointed out by Nikitas, Turkey is nullifying Talat's power to negotiate anything, which obviously means that these talks are not really peace negotiations but capitulation talks as far as Turkey is concerned. The talks will no doubt collapse, so it is probably important that Christofias just drags the process out until Eroglu takes over, because then the blame will quite likely switch to Turkey and the UBP Party.

That's the game being played by sneaky Chris but what if Turkey and Eroglu r aware of the game and hunt Chris while he sets up for hunting them?

I think you will find that he genuinely wants to unify Cyprus, but the games and antics from Turkey leave him with no other choice, as Turkey's terms are not acceptable.

The key to a solution is in Ankara, and Talat is powerless to negotiate anything. It is Turkey's unacceptable demands which will lead to the collapse of the talks, and we will do everything in our power to ensure that Turkey is blamed for their eventual collapse.

Christofias is just a player under pressure of what he inheritted from his predecessors. He perforce fights for the common national interests of Greeks and GCs... Maybe his personal opinions r a bit different but perforce he fights for the national interests... and that nation is not the so-called Cypriot nation but Greek nation...

I can't understand how he dares accusing Talat by claiming that Talat didn't act like a Cypriot. Ridiculous old boy, Christofias!

[Paphitis]

His role is one of arbitration and nothing more. He has no authority to go beyond his scope as an arbitrator or negotiations facilitator.

Wasn't that the case with Desoto also? Then all of a sudden we got the Annan Plan.

I can still remember him displaying a pen and a little black book to reporters after the first meeting between Tpap and Denktas.

No, that was not the case with Desoto.

The Annan Plan was authored by Desoto and the UN as a "solution" for Cyprus.

These talks are somewhat different. The UN will just sit back and allow the 2 leaders to develop and negotiate THEIR own solution (if possible) to the Cyprus Problem which they hope will be accepted by both communities at a future referendum.

However, as pointed out by Nikitas, Turkey is nullifying Talat's power to negotiate anything, which obviously means that these talks are not really peace negotiations but capitulation talks as far as Turkey is concerned. The talks will no doubt collapse, so it is probably important that Christofias just drags the process out until Eroglu takes over, because then the blame will quite likely switch to Turkey and the UBP Party.

That's the game being played by sneaky Chris but what if Turkey and Eroglu r aware of the game and hunt Chris while he sets up for hunting them?

I think you will find that he genuinely wants to unify Cyprus, but the games and antics from Turkey leave him with no other choice, as Turkey's terms are not acceptable.

The key to a solution is in Ankara, and Talat is powerless to negotiate anything. It is Turkey's unacceptable demands which will lead to the collapse of the talks, and we will do everything in our power to ensure that Turkey is blamed for their eventual collapse.

Christofias is just a player under pressure of what he inheritted from his predecessors. He perforce fights for the common national interests of Greeks and GCs... Maybe his personal opinions r a bit different but perforce he fights for the national interests... and that nation is not the so-called Cypriot nation but Greek nation...

I can't understand how he dare accusing Talat by claiming that Talat didn't act like a Cypriot. Ridiculous old boy, Christofias!

Just because that is the case with you Turks, it does not mean it is the same with Christofias.

President Christofias is only fighting for his Cypriot nation and no one else. Greece's interests don't even come into play, because Greece plays an extremely minimalist role in Cypriot affairs.

To us, Greece is just and ally and fellow EU nation. Greece does not have any interests in Cyprus and seems very ready to abandon any Treaty Guarantees to the state in order to respect the Cypriot nations desire for independence.

It seems you Turks are always looking to involve Greece in your games, but it apperars that Greece is no longer interested and has taken a step back, something Turkey refuses to do!

[insan]

His role is one of arbitration and nothing more. He has no authority to go beyond his scope as an arbitrator or negotiations facilitator.

Wasn't that the case with Desoto also? Then all of a sudden we got the Annan Plan.

I can still remember him displaying a pen and a little black book to reporters after the first meeting between Tpap and Denktas.

No, that was not the case with Desoto.

The Annan Plan was authored by Desoto and the UN as a "solution" for Cyprus.

These talks are somewhat different. The UN will just sit back and allow the 2 leaders to develop and negotiate THEIR own solution (if possible) to the Cyprus Problem which they hope will be accepted by both communities at a future referendum.

However, as pointed out by Nikitas, Turkey is nullifying Talat's power to negotiate anything, which obviously means that these talks are not really peace negotiations but capitulation talks as far as Turkey is concerned. The talks will no doubt collapse, so it is probably important that Christofias just drags the process out until Eroglu takes over, because then the blame will quite likely switch to Turkey and the UBP Party.

That's the game being played by sneaky Chris but what if Turkey and Eroglu r aware of the game and hunt Chris while he sets up for hunting them?

I think you will find that he genuinely wants to unify Cyprus, but the games and antics from Turkey leave him with no other choice, as Turkey's terms are not acceptable.

The key to a solution is in Ankara, and Talat is powerless to negotiate anything. It is Turkey's unacceptable demands which will lead to the collapse of the talks, and we will do everything in our power to ensure that Turkey is blamed for their eventual collapse.

Christofias is just a player under pressure of what he inheritted from his predecessors. He perforce fights for the common national interests of Greeks and GCs... Maybe his personal opinions r a bit different but perforce he fights for the national interests... and that nation is not the so-called Cypriot nation but Greek nation...

I can't understand how he dare accusing Talat by claiming that Talat didn't act like a Cypriot. Ridiculous old boy, Christofias!

Just because that is the case with you Turks, it does not mean it is the same with Christofias.

President Christofias is only fighting for his Cypriot nation and no one else. Greece's interests don't even come into play, because Greece plays an extremely minimalist role in Cypriot affairs.

To us, Greece is just and ally and fellow EU nation. Greece does not have any interests in Cyprus and seems very ready to abandon any Treaty Guarantees to the state in order to respect the Cypriot nations desire for independence.

It seems you Turks are always looking to involve Greece in your games, but it apperars that Greece is no longer interested and has taken a step back, something Turkey refuses to do!

Keep trying to create impressions to hide the obvious. It won't work. Since when there has been a Cypriot nation in Cyprus? Ask Chris this question next time u meet with him... Today, the player of Hellenic side is Chris, tomorrow will be someone else... The fact is, all perforce fight for their own national interests... it was just a few years ago when TPapa called GCs as "Greeks of Cyprus"... u r like chameleons I guess... in every 5 or so years u change ur nationality... How it suits! Keep playing! Until when? We have already come to the end of the road... no way out...