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Kavazoglu article from 1964

How can we solve it? (keep it civilized)

Postby zan » Fri Sep 18, 2009 5:30 pm

Paphitis wrote:
insan wrote:
Paphitis wrote:
zan wrote:
Paphitis wrote:
zan wrote:Who was that issued by Paphitis??? :?


Don't you have a counter argument? :lol: Have we hit a grey area? :lol:



That is my counter argument.......Didn't need much more..... 8)


So you have nothing to say...You know full well hat the above is true, and from an unbiased source, and now you have nothing to say because you just can't counter a damn thing.... 8)


That is a state report re Pufidi. :lol:

A state report that was prepared by so-called RoC and submitted to UN. Another one sided propaganda! :lol: even ROFL :lol:


Oh right...So anything published by the only recognized administration on the island is propaganda is it? :lol:



If you take the language used in your post then yes....It is an accusation not a report.
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Postby denizaksulu » Fri Sep 18, 2009 5:37 pm

zan wrote:
denizaksulu wrote:
zan wrote:Do you think that article is balanced Deniz???



One journalists, impressions and interview. Hmmm. The proper question would have been , ' is it the truth?'. I'd say God knows.

The article stems from the discussion with the Bulgarian Turk and the journalists response and nothing else. Does there have to be a balance?IMO.


Balance in the Forum or the article???

If the Forum then yes.



Tim aint the moderator. If you seek balance in everything you read, you will read nothing (oxymoron?). Why pick on this article? and not others by TCs and GCs? Since when are we balanced?
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Postby Paphitis » Fri Sep 18, 2009 5:41 pm

zan wrote:
Paphitis wrote:
insan wrote:
Paphitis wrote:
zan wrote:
Paphitis wrote:
zan wrote:Who was that issued by Paphitis??? :?


Don't you have a counter argument? :lol: Have we hit a grey area? :lol:



That is my counter argument.......Didn't need much more..... 8)


So you have nothing to say...You know full well hat the above is true, and from an unbiased source, and now you have nothing to say because you just can't counter a damn thing.... 8)


That is a state report re Pufidi. :lol:

A state report that was prepared by so-called RoC and submitted to UN. Another one sided propaganda! :lol: even ROFL :lol:


Oh right...So anything published by the only recognized administration on the island is propaganda is it? :lol:



If you take the language used in your post then yes....It is an accusation not a report.


Perhaps you can then redress this article with some "balance".
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Postby Tim Drayton » Fri Sep 18, 2009 5:47 pm

insan wrote:
Tim Drayton wrote:
insan wrote:
Tim Drayton wrote:
insan wrote:Tim, what's ur point?


It is Kavazoğlu's article not mine.


Ok, but what's ur point? Plz evaluate it.


My point in posting this article is that I think it makes an interesting continuation of the discussion we were having about 1964.

Kavazoğlu does not deny that the Turkish Cypriots were suffering greatly at that time, and nor do I. But he also asks the question 'why', as do I.

As you know, I look at the consequences of the TCs being driven into the enclaves, and what I see is that they came under the iron rule of the TMT. The TMT was set up by the Turkish Special War Department. This was a secret organisation that was set up and financed by the Americans for the specific purpose of waging guerilla war in the event of a Soviet invasion. This organisation was so secret that even Bülent Ecevit, the democratically elected prime-minister of Turkey only learned of its existence by co-incidence. In other words, the Turkish Cypriot community came under the autocratic rule of an organisation that was actually financed and supported by America, and which was accountable to no democratically elected body. Somehow, this makes me suspect that the long arm of Anglo-Saxon imperialism is involved.

With that thought on my mind, I suddenly remembered that article by Kavazoğlu which argues that the root cause of this Turkish Cypriot suffering was the interests of imperialism. Of course Kavazoğlu was a prominent AKEL member so he is arguing from the left of the political spectrum. I just feel that bringing up such views that challenge entrenched positions can promote discussion and help to get at the truth.


Ok. Thanks for ur evaluation...

Isn't it strange that Kavazoğlu didn't mention just a single word abt EOKA that was just another secret organization funded by Americans? By not mentioning just a single word abt EOKA and it's activities; he made his article sound as written by a pro-EOKA journalist/spy?

It seems like Kavazoğlu ignored the activities of EOKA bcz he thought EOKA had nothing to do with the formation of TMT. Do u agree with Kavazoğlu that EOKA has no role on foundation of TMT and it's activities?

I'll go step by step... there r a lot of other aspects of theis article I'd like to question.


I agree with the above points. Of course, he was just writing a polemical article in which he attacks a simplistic, chauvinistic statement and then broadens his argument into a critique of Denktash and the TMT. Of course things like the formation of the TMT and the moving of people into the enclaves did not happen in a vacuum and these were reactions to other events.
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Postby YFred » Fri Sep 18, 2009 6:08 pm

Tim Drayton wrote:
insan wrote:
Tim Drayton wrote:
insan wrote:
Tim Drayton wrote:
insan wrote:Tim, what's ur point?


It is Kavazoğlu's article not mine.


Ok, but what's ur point? Plz evaluate it.


My point in posting this article is that I think it makes an interesting continuation of the discussion we were having about 1964.

Kavazoğlu does not deny that the Turkish Cypriots were suffering greatly at that time, and nor do I. But he also asks the question 'why', as do I.

As you know, I look at the consequences of the TCs being driven into the enclaves, and what I see is that they came under the iron rule of the TMT. The TMT was set up by the Turkish Special War Department. This was a secret organisation that was set up and financed by the Americans for the specific purpose of waging guerilla war in the event of a Soviet invasion. This organisation was so secret that even Bülent Ecevit, the democratically elected prime-minister of Turkey only learned of its existence by co-incidence. In other words, the Turkish Cypriot community came under the autocratic rule of an organisation that was actually financed and supported by America, and which was accountable to no democratically elected body. Somehow, this makes me suspect that the long arm of Anglo-Saxon imperialism is involved.

With that thought on my mind, I suddenly remembered that article by Kavazoğlu which argues that the root cause of this Turkish Cypriot suffering was the interests of imperialism. Of course Kavazoğlu was a prominent AKEL member so he is arguing from the left of the political spectrum. I just feel that bringing up such views that challenge entrenched positions can promote discussion and help to get at the truth.


Ok. Thanks for ur evaluation...

Isn't it strange that Kavazoğlu didn't mention just a single word abt EOKA that was just another secret organization funded by Americans? By not mentioning just a single word abt EOKA and it's activities; he made his article sound as written by a pro-EOKA journalist/spy?

It seems like Kavazoğlu ignored the activities of EOKA bcz he thought EOKA had nothing to do with the formation of TMT. Do u agree with Kavazoğlu that EOKA has no role on foundation of TMT and it's activities?

I'll go step by step... there r a lot of other aspects of theis article I'd like to question.


I agree with the above points. Of course, he was just writing a polemical article in which he attacks a simplistic, chauvinistic statement and then broadens his argument into a critique of Denktash and the TMT. Of course things like the formation of the TMT and the moving of people into the enclaves did not happen in a vacuum and these were reactions to other events.

Is there any speeches by Miashauli attacking Eoka in the same maner?
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Postby zan » Fri Sep 18, 2009 6:40 pm

denizaksulu wrote:
zan wrote:
denizaksulu wrote:
zan wrote:Do you think that article is balanced Deniz???



One journalists, impressions and interview. Hmmm. The proper question would have been , ' is it the truth?'. I'd say God knows.

The article stems from the discussion with the Bulgarian Turk and the journalists response and nothing else. Does there have to be a balance?IMO.


Balance in the Forum or the article???

If the Forum then yes.



Tim aint the moderator. If you seek balance in everything you read, you will read nothing (oxymoron?). Why pick on this article? and not others by TCs and GCs? Since when are we balanced?


I see Tim as one of the more balanced people on this site so I am amazed that he has published something that I would be attacked for doing so..........This is more than just the balance of this thread..... 8)
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Postby zan » Fri Sep 18, 2009 6:42 pm

Paphitis wrote:
zan wrote:
Paphitis wrote:
insan wrote:
Paphitis wrote:
zan wrote:
Paphitis wrote:
zan wrote:Who was that issued by Paphitis??? :?


Don't you have a counter argument? :lol: Have we hit a grey area? :lol:



That is my counter argument.......Didn't need much more..... 8)


So you have nothing to say...You know full well hat the above is true, and from an unbiased source, and now you have nothing to say because you just can't counter a damn thing.... 8)


That is a state report re Pufidi. :lol:

A state report that was prepared by so-called RoC and submitted to UN. Another one sided propaganda! :lol: even ROFL :lol:


Oh right...So anything published by the only recognized administration on the island is propaganda is it? :lol:



If you take the language used in your post then yes....It is an accusation not a report.


Perhaps you can then redress this article with some "balance".


It would have been better coming from ONE of you.....That might have changed my view on the existence of god if it had happened!!! 8) :roll: :lol:
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Postby Get Real! » Fri Sep 18, 2009 7:01 pm

zan wrote:...I am amazed that he has published something that I would be attacked for doing so.....

Your very (afro) existence is enough to warrant an attack! :lol:
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Postby zan » Fri Sep 18, 2009 7:03 pm

Get Real! wrote:
zan wrote:...I am amazed that he has published something that I would be attacked for doing so.....

Your very (afro) existence is enough to warrant an attack! :lol:


Methinks you are worried about hair loss GR....... :lol:
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Postby Get Real! » Fri Sep 18, 2009 7:11 pm

zan wrote:
Get Real! wrote:
zan wrote:...I am amazed that he has published something that I would be attacked for doing so.....

Your very (afro) existence is enough to warrant an attack! :lol:

Methinks you are worried about hair loss GR....... :lol:

So true... :oops:
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