Cyprus-Forum.com

[Oneness]

Please VOTE! Here is your opportunity to vote for what you believe about this specific issue. Here, you need not submit to other people's demands. You have the choice. The reason of this vote is to see the current overall position of Cyprus forum members.

Only one vote per person and please indicate whether you are GC, TC, T colonists, UK, US, EU or other, if possible.

[Cyprus]

Only one vote per person and please indicate whether you are GC, TC, T colonists, UK, US, EU or other, if possible.

You said that this poll is only for TCs ...So this sentence is not needed!

[Cyprus]

Why EU bases?

We have to disarm the island COMPLETLY!

On the other hand my answer is "NO".

[Oneness]

Has Turkey a good record of disarmament?

And who is to stop Turkey from sending, as previously, 40000 troops to the island to do what they wish?!?

Don't you think a more neutral troops like EU troops would be more credible for intervention than Turkey?

Personally, I think arms reduction not total disarmament.

[mehmet]

the issue isn't so much whether there are bases but whether they have responsibility for security. The British and UNFICYP have a poor record at protecting Turkish Cypriots between 1963-74 when RoC security forces were around. So, it's what they are there to do that matters not whether they are there at all.

[Oneness]

The difference, Mehmet, is that the UN troops had no mandate to use force to guarrantee the peace and the British were little interested in the strife outside their sovereign territory but EU would have interest to protect all EU states and treat all EU citizens equally. The same cannot be said of Turkey.

the issue isn't so much whether there are bases but whether they have responsibility for security.

And for whom security?

The presence of Turkish troops on Cyprus soil would undermine Cypriot reconciliation and brotherhood by creating an environment of distrust between GC's and TC's. It would help pave the way for more Turkish colonists in Cyprus. The troops and colonists would represent the interests of Turkey by "Turkifying" Cyprus. Does that make you feel safe and secure? Does it leave you optimistic about prospects of reconciliation?

By contrast, if northern Cyprus joined southern Cyprus in the EU, the whole island would have the advantages of EU membership, including security. Aggression in Cyprus would be aggression in the EU! EU troops in Cyprus would provide better security for everyone, GC and TC, and their presence be better news for peace, reconciliation and the functionality of any settlement.

Any paper "agreement" that is not supported by all parties and lacks guarrantees and incentives will as workable as the 1960 Cyprus Independence or the 1938 Anglo-German peace agreement.

[mehmet]

The UN was supposed to keep the peace but there wasn't enopugh of them and the RoC forces were always one step ahead of them, that is the nature of any peace keeping operation. Unlike in other situations where peace keeping forces operate the Turkish Cypriots were dispersed throughout the island prior to 1974. This is a factor which needs to be considered when resolving intercommunal issues. I'm not saying we can't live together but for Turkish Cypriots at least the most recent experience of living together is not one they wish to re-live. I can quite see why Greek Cypriots wouldn't feel comfortable with Turkish soldiers on the island, Turkish Cypriot's felt the same about Greek and Greek Cypriot security forces before partition.

I agree the UK wasn't primarily interested in relations between Cypriot's, even so before UNFICYP came they too were given the runaround by Greek and Greek Cypriot security forces.

The powers UNFICYP had were a direct result of Makarios manipulatiing world opinion. It is him we have to thank for UNFICYP being so small that they were trying to put out a forest fire with a bucket of water. The issue for Makarios from trying to stop Turkey exercising its powers under 1960 Constitution. Let's not forget that Greece abused the 1960 constitution throughout 1960-73 period, always having more than the permitted number of soldiers. We also remember how Greek Cypriot's collaborated with them to harrass and persecute Turkish Cypriot's. Remember that when you try to persuade us that Turkish soldiers are our enemy. It is the same divide and rule the British were accused of.

All the same we have to move forward, but let us not be stupid enough to think we can turn back the clock and start again or deny the events that led us to the position we are in today.

[Piratis]

Mehmet, I can not accept the logic that because our past was screwed up we should screw up our future as well.

You keep crying like TCs are the only victims and you forget that GC are the biggest victims of Cyprus history.

We should learn from the past and we should move ahead and not get stuck in the past and repeat the same mistakes.

If there was something wrong with the UN power 30 years ago, then lets fix that, and not use the past events as excuses instead of lessons.

[Oneness]

Why EU bases? We have to disarm the island COMPLETLY! On the other hand my answer is "NO".

Cyprus, do you want reunification and for northen Cyprus to join the EU? I ask this because the path of alignment with Turkey (Turkish troops, Turkish colonists etc) leads closer alignment with Turkey and partition.

Or do you want the benefits of recognition as well as the benefits of joining the EU as well as alignment with Turkey ... and who cares if an Annan Plan breaks up after a few years because you will have recognition, you will have the EU and you more interested in relations with Turkey than GC's?

Bear in mind, an EU force in Cyprus would be a small but important step forward for EU security in EU. It could also satisfy Cypriots by including 1/3 Cypriots and British by including a 1/3 British troops and 1/3 other European eg Dutch, Danish. It is the only military presence which can help prevent excess alignment to and rivalry between Turkey and Greece.

Total disarmament is not a good goal in current world climate. Even Switzerland a neutral country has troops.

[mehmet]

I don't want to screw up the future also, I guess you think that I do, I know there are Greek Cypriot victims I have met many in Uk in my life and I am not ignorant of that.

I agree with you that we should learn from the past, it's just a concern of mine that there might be some very selective amnesia which isn't helped by partition but can be challenged by bi-communal activities, because when it comes down to it we have more in common with each other than we do our 'motherlands'.

How do you suggest we 'fix' what UNFICYP couldn't fix 30 years ago. I'm not sure the issue is relevant. Are there any military forces from Greece in RoC today, how many? Both Turkey and Greece seem to have a more mature attitude toeach other, at least there doesn't seem to be the same level of tension.