Cyprus-Forum.com

[Oracle]

1. In terms of Nationality, anybody who is from or affiliated to Cyprus. If you have ancestors from Cyprus and live anywhere in the world then you have a right to identify youyrself as a Cypriot. There are American-Cypriots, South African-Cypriots, Argentine-Cypriots, Congolese-Cypriots and even New Zealander-Cypriots.

2. In legal terms, you are only a Cypriot if you hold Republic of Cyprus citizenship since this is the only Cypriot state in Cyprus and the only recognised one internationally. The majority if not all of the 'TRNC citizens' who are Turkish Cypriots hold Republic of Cyprus citizenship as do most Turkish Cypriots abroad. TRNC 'citizenship' is also extended to many non-Cypriot Turks, Kurds etc, as it is a Turkish entity not a Turkish Cypriot one as some wishfully and naively assume, therefore it cannot be considered Cypriot.

After a settlement, the number of Federal Republic Cypriot citizens will increase two fold as diaspora Cypriots and many eligible settlers (those whose status will be decided at the negotiating tables) apply for citizenship.

Exactly!

See Paphitis ....

[Paphitis]

1. In terms of Nationality, anybody who is from or affiliated to Cyprus. If you have ancestors from Cyprus and live anywhere in the world then you have a right to identify youyrself as a Cypriot. There are American-Cypriots, South African-Cypriots, Argentine-Cypriots, Congolese-Cypriots and even New Zealander-Cypriots.

2. In legal terms, you are only a Cypriot if you hold Republic of Cyprus citizenship since this is the only Cypriot state in Cyprus and the only recognised one internationally. The majority if not all of the 'TRNC citizens' who are Turkish Cypriots hold Republic of Cyprus citizenship as do most Turkish Cypriots abroad. TRNC 'citizenship' is also extended to many non-Cypriot Turks, Kurds etc, as it is a Turkish entity not a Turkish Cypriot one as some wishfully and naively assume, therefore it cannot be considered Cypriot.

After a settlement, the number of Federal Republic Cypriot citizens will increase two fold as diaspora Cypriots and many eligible settlers (those whose status will be decided at the negotiating tables) apply for citizenship.

Exactly!

See Paphitis ....

No I don't Oracle!

We are not talking in legal terms at all, and just because someone holds RoC citizenship does not mean they are True Cypriot because they could be Turkish Cypriots aiding and abetting the occupation and/or selling stolen GC property amongst other things, and hence they fall in the following category:

Someone who says they're Cypriot but only to give Turkey influence on the island

They certainly do not fall in this category:

Someone who puts Cyprus and all its legitimate people ahead of all other considerations

[Oracle]

I am suggesting that someone who puts Cyprus and all its legitimate people ahead of all other considerations is the correct answer, because it is the only sensible way of answering the poll question, given the choices we have in this poll. You know this, but you are as stubborn as ever....

We're back to square ONE.

That statement did not appeal because of the small print at the end ... i.e. : "ahead of all other considerations".

That last bit is a mine-field and I would have voted for the same as you IF The Cypriot had left that bit out or inserted the word "legitimate" in front of "considerations" since I wouldn't want to sign away to any unscrupulous "considerations" such as giving away all first-born sons or some such nonsense ....

[Paphitis]

The “Greek Cypriot” we use to describe ourselves is just a LABEL that only came into use once the British took over to differentiate the Muslims from the Christians on the island. It has NOTHING to do with Greece or Greeks.

Des efjes mu n' ashis.

Well Greek is just a label as well. Australian is a label, American is a label.

But this does not change the fact that the island of Cyprus is mostly Greek or Hellenic influenced. This is undeniable.

Hence the distinction between nationality and ethnicity.

[Paphitis]

I am suggesting that someone who puts Cyprus and all its legitimate people ahead of all other considerations is the correct answer, because it is the only sensible way of answering the poll question, given the choices we have in this poll. You know this, but you are as stubborn as ever....

We're back to square ONE.

That statement did not appeal because of the small print at the end ... i.e. : "ahead of all other considerations".

That last bit is a mine-field and I would have voted for the same as you IF The Cypriot had left that bit out or inserted the word "legitimate" in front of "considerations" since I wouldn't want to sign away to any unscrupulous "considerations" such as giving away all first-born sons or some such nonsense ....

Let's take it from the top Oracle....

someone who puts Cyprus and all its legitimate people ahead of all other considerations

Someone who puts CYPRUS and ALL its LEGITIMATE people ahead of all other considerations is the only sensible answer, because anyone who puts Cyprus ahead of all other considerations can not possibly be considered a minefield to Cyprus....

[Omer Seyhan]

If we are not talking legal terms then you enter a grey area where anybody in theory can define themselves as Cypriot. There are no critieria, rules, procedure etc, they are simply free to call themselves Cypriot. This means that anything you say is just your own opinion.

Legally, even if a Turkish Cypriot sold Greek Cypriot land in the north, however wrong it is, and whether they are taken to court or not, sued or not, there is no law that strips them of their citizenship as a result of it. Similarly, a Greek Cypriot who sells Turkish Cypriot land cannot be stripped of their citizenship.

Aiding or abetting an occupation, being a former member of terrorist groups EOKA (A and B) and TMT is wrong but not illegal as far as Republic of Cyprus's own Laws are concerned.

Now if it was up to me I would empower the Cypriot state and its security services to prosecute ex-terrorists even after a settlement. The state should also prosecute the most severe collaborators of the occupation (including those who benefitted the most from it). However, I would not condemn all collaboraters in the north as most are just trying to survive under the difficult circumstances in which they find themselves.

[EPSILON]

The “Greek Cypriot” we use to describe ourselves is just a LABEL that only came into use once the British took over to differentiate the Muslims from the Christians on the island. It has NOTHING to do with Greece or Greeks.

Re apostoloi tou dkiaolou ,ton tziero tou Onnisillou tzie tou Teykrou en yphrxan oute egglezika - se ti glossa mas to hpan oi tote British pos tous lete? Oute kan to AKEL then yphrxe tote-poios dkiaolos telos panton ekamen etsi praman?

[Paphitis]

If we are not talking legal terms then you enter a grey area where anybody in theory can define themselves as Cypriot. There are no critieria, rules, procedure etc, they are simply free to call themselves Cypriot. This means that anything you say is just your own opinion.

Legally, even if a Turkish Cypriot sold Greek Cypriot land in the north, however wrong it is, and whether they are taken to court or not, sued or not, there is no law that strips them of their citizenship as a result of it. Similarly, a Greek Cypriot who sells Turkish Cypriot land cannot be stripped of their citizenship.

Aiding or abetting an occupation, being a former member of terrorist groups EOKA (A and B) and TMT is wrong but not illegal as far as Republic of Cyprus's own Laws are concerned.

Now if it was up to me I would empower the Cypriot state and its security services to prosecute ex-terrorists even after a settlement. The state should also prosecute the most severe collaborators of the occupation (including those who benefitted the most from it). However, I would not condemn all collaboraters in the north as most are just trying to survive under the difficult circumstances in which they find themselves.

If we were talking in legal terms, then The Cypriot should have quoted the RoC's immigration and citizenship laws. And people that hold citizenship are not necessarily loyal to Cyprus, but are legally defined as Cypriot.

I don't see this poll referring to any RoC legal Acts pertaining to citizenship.

[The Cypriot]

I am suggesting that someone who puts Cyprus and all its legitimate people ahead of all other considerations is the correct answer, because it is the only sensible way of answering the poll question, given the choices we have in this poll. You know this, but you are as stubborn as ever....

We're back to square ONE.

That statement did not appeal because of the small print at the end ... i.e. : "ahead of all other considerations".

That last bit is a mine-field and I would have voted for the same as you IF The Cypriot had left that bit out or inserted the word "legitimate" in front of "considerations" since I wouldn't want to sign away to any unscrupulous "considerations" such as giving away all first-born sons or some such nonsense ....

O... this is just bizarre. How can something illegal or "unscrupulous" be in the interests of Cyprus and its legitimate citizens?

Read the statement:

A Cypriot:
"Someone who puts Cyprus and all its legitimate people ahead of all other considerations"

ie. For him/her Cyprus and all its legal people COME FIRST. Now I cannot, for the life of me, see how anyone who wants freedom and justice for Cyprus can take issue with this; or justify wanting something different. I hope Paphitis is right and that the people on this forum are not indicative of the wider Cypriot public. If he's wrong, Cyprus is in even more trouble than I thought.

[Oracle]

I am suggesting that someone who puts Cyprus and all its legitimate people ahead of all other considerations is the correct answer, because it is the only sensible way of answering the poll question, given the choices we have in this poll. You know this, but you are as stubborn as ever....

We're back to square ONE.

That statement did not appeal because of the small print at the end ... i.e. : "ahead of all other considerations".

That last bit is a mine-field and I would have voted for the same as you IF The Cypriot had left that bit out or inserted the word "legitimate" in front of "considerations" since I wouldn't want to sign away to any unscrupulous "considerations" such as giving away all first-born sons or some such nonsense ....

Let's take it from the top Oracle....

someone who puts Cyprus and all its legitimate people ahead of all other considerations

Someone who puts CYPRUS and ALL its LEGITIMATE people ahead of all other considerations is the only sensible answer, because anyone who puts Cyprus ahead of all other considerations can not possibly be considered a minefield to Cyprus....

I think you do realise that the word "considerations" also required the qualifier: "legitimate" ...

Still, it was more important to exclude anything labelled as "Turkish" (exclusively) as being in any way a definition of a Cypriot ....

The term : "Turkish/Muslim" equals "Turkish" or "Muslim" and neither of those define TCs exclusively! They are JUST that. Either "Turkish" or either "Muslim" (and the two jointly do not add up to TC)