Cyprus-Forum.com

[Paphitis]

viewpoint,

One of the many problems with Turkey, but one that particularly affects us Turkish Cypriots, is that they always wait until the last minute to respond to a situation - too bloody late!

Turkey is too slow, not all ready to play big politics with Cyprus or even the EU, it just loses its purpose by the time it decides to sit around a table. Like with the Cyprus issue. If Turkey agreed with Denktas to recognise the bubble TRNC self-declared state then why doesn't it recognise it from ALL corners? It is obvious that Turkey does not recognise the bubble TRNC self-declared state as it wouldn't feel obliged to force Talat to bargain it away. The real issue viewpoint here, and you know it, is that the so-called TRNC is not a guaranteed safe haven for the Turkish Cypriots - those of course who have woken up. We have been isolated for 35 years, we now prefer to use our original ROC passports to travel abroad, we do not associate ourselves with the moon and start inverted so-called TRNC flag, we do not believe that the "TRNC" will ever gain any type of recognition in any way, we are now being told that houses that we so-called compensated to us after 1974 are still under threat as they are legitimately "Greek Cypriot" owned (so much for the "TRNC" ey!) and our side has now more air-headed Turks from eastern uneducated Turkey in it than Turkish Cypriots.

Face it Viewpoint, I am as frustrated as you are but the difference is I regard myself as a true "Cypriot" and do not believe Turkey gives two Kurus about our preservation or our so-called "Protection".

Turkey has never, ever sought to prove its claim on northern Cyprus, on its protection policy or has kept any of its threats. Ever the 1974 affair was an opportunity that Turkey had ill responded to - too late. Answer this.....

What happened to the Turkish threats of annexation if the ROC entered the EU - NOTHING! The ROC has been a full member of the EU now since 2004 and hey presto, still NO sign of annexation - WHAT A SURPRIZE.

What happened to all the threats if the Greek Cypriots said no to the Annan Plan in April 2004? What utter rubbish was Turkey talking about then....I recall the following from the Turkish government.. "This is Cyprus's last chance for unification"....and "The Turkish Cypriots will go their separate ways and order the UN to leave the island". Again WHAT RUBBISH. Turkey just can not stop lying about its Cyprus affairs.

Turkey has played on Turkish Cypriot emotion for so long now that WE do not believe her NO MORE, not that we ever did anyway. The ONLY PRACTICAL solutions we've seen so far have come from the Republic of Cyprus. As I have said, I can now fly direct to Cyprus...but not with my so-called bubble TRNC passport but with my original ROC passport.

If Turkey truly wants to win the hearts of ALL Turkish Cypriots, which I know it doesn't care to Kurus's about, then it better start meaning what it says, better stop WASTING OUR BLOODY LIVES. My son is now 24, was born in this UNRECOGNISED state, graduated from an UNRECOGNISED university and NOW MUST GO TO TURKEY TO FIND A JOB - What rubbish. There is no way in hell I am sending my son to Turkey, alone to seek work. The old politics of Cyprus is over, old news - the opening of the border proven how well we can generally work as people with each other. I have given the TRNC too many chances for its so-called recognition or isolation to be removed. I never thought, after 24 years later - my son's life so far, I'd be addressing the same "economic", "isolation", "Recognition" issues.

TURKEY = What a waste of time for us. We have given Turkey more than its share of chances. It's now our time to live our lives in Cyprus the way any human being and EU member state should - within our rights and liberties as a Citizen of the Republic of Cyprus with all its economic and political freedoms.

Excellent post.
May I enquire as to the likely percentage of T/Cs that you think would feel the same way. I have always believed , based on the fact that I talk to T/Cs almost on a daily basis in view of my business , that the percentage could be as high as 50% , furthermore what in your opinion should the RoC BE CONCENTRATING UPON to encourage reconciliation amongst the Cypriot people.

Lets say the TCs who are sympathetic make up 50% of all TCs. Then that makes it 45,000 TCs out of a population of 510,000.

You are barking up the wrong tree, and need to realise that every move we have made for "reconciliation" has back fired on us. All our good will has never been reciprocated and never will.

We are dealing with Turks not TCs...They have no power at all!

[miltiades]

International organizations not least the EU , consider the T/Cs as the other party on the negotiating table.
The more T/Cs feel the way that our friend expresses himself the more it strengthens the hand of the RoC in that the obstacle to a peaceful resolution is not the T/Cs but Turkey and the settlers.
Therefore it is of extreme importance that the T/Cs begin to embrace their nation , that of Cyprus , and abandon the one created by Turkey which is unrecognized and lacking all credentials that a proper nation possesses.
The political "war" must have reasonable support from our T/C compatriots if it is to produce the required results.
If you are again thinking on the lines of available options , there is only one valid option and that is the intensification of the political struggle.

[Paphitis]

International organizations not least the EU , consider the T/Cs as the other party on the negotiating table.
The more T/Cs feel the way that our friend expresses himself the more it strengthens the hand of the RoC in that the obstacle to a peaceful resolution is not the T/Cs but Turkey and the settlers.
Therefore it is of extreme importance that the T/Cs begin to embrace their nation , that of Cyprus , and abandon the one created by Turkey which is unrecognized and lacking all credentials that a proper nation possesses.
The political "war" must have reasonable support from our T/C compatriots if it is to produce the required results.
If you are again thinking on the lines of available options , there is only one valid option and that is the intensification of the political struggle.

Don't waste your breath, because the TCs are not at the "negotiating" table...Turkey is!

And Turkey views these talks as nothing but surrender talks for the RoC!

Talks should crumble like a house of cards, or we will get the Annan Plan rehashed...

[Kibrisli Turk]

Hi Paphitis,

I'm sure the true figure is much higher than 50%, but most suffer from a realisation complex.

I only hatched out of my brainwashed shell after the situation affected my son, and then me personally. I am fed up of this situation and now it's not sustainable. We are in the EU, and Turkey wants to join, the rest is common sense and now very much obvious.

Unless, of course Turkey has a few tricks up its sleeve! Many TCs just want two basic forms of freedoms in today's world. Firstly to be able to trade freely, travel and not be isolated. And second, to live side-by-side with people who care about the island and its future and not with people (like those from eastern Turkey) who obsiously see the island as a working dock zone and do not care about the future and educational welfare of its children. Times have now changed, the world for god's sake has changed. We know longer believe that spending two years in the Turkish Army is our birth right, not that I ever did anyway. Turkey has seriously shot itself in the foot on Cyprus and must now face certain realities.

The UBP were obviously installed to up hold Turkish policy on Cyprus, but this is not sustainable. the answer is simple, because eventually, the UBP will not make ANY such difference on the island, will NOT be able to remove the isolation from the bubble "TRNC" so called state and is dreaming if it can over turn the UN's decision to not recognise the "TRNC" by saying Yes to a future referendum. Let me just finally say that the future agreement, if it's rejected by the GC, will not make one slightest bit of difference. I challenge anyone who says otherwise. The bubble state will remain as static as glue regardless of any political reunification plan that's rejected as that's the way Turkey wishes the people within it to remain. But there's a flaw. Turkey hasn't got much time, and the EU will demand its removal from Cyprus when the time comes for Turkey to join - and Turkey will listen and drop its current nationalist stance. In the meantime, its us, the TC alone, who have suffered this inhumane isolation under this dumb Turkish invented state know as the "TRNC".

[Kikapu]

viewpoint,

One of the many problems with Turkey, but one that particularly affects us Turkish Cypriots, is that they always wait until the last minute to respond to a situation - too bloody late!

Turkey is too slow, not all ready to play big politics with Cyprus or even the EU, it just loses its purpose by the time it decides to sit around a table. Like with the Cyprus issue. If Turkey agreed with Denktas to recognise the bubble TRNC self-declared state then why doesn't it recognise it from ALL corners? It is obvious that Turkey does not recognise the bubble TRNC self-declared state as it wouldn't feel obliged to force Talat to bargain it away. The real issue viewpoint here, and you know it, is that the so-called TRNC is not a guaranteed safe haven for the Turkish Cypriots - those of course who have woken up. We have been isolated for 35 years, we now prefer to use our original ROC passports to travel abroad, we do not associate ourselves with the moon and start inverted so-called TRNC flag, we do not believe that the "TRNC" will ever gain any type of recognition in any way, we are now being told that houses that we so-called compensated to us after 1974 are still under threat as they are legitimately "Greek Cypriot" owned (so much for the "TRNC" ey!) and our side has now more air-headed Turks from eastern uneducated Turkey in it than Turkish Cypriots.

Face it Viewpoint, I am as frustrated as you are but the difference is I regard myself as a true "Cypriot" and do not believe Turkey gives two Kurus about our preservation or our so-called "Protection".

Turkey has never, ever sought to prove its claim on northern Cyprus, on its protection policy or has kept any of its threats. Ever the 1974 affair was an opportunity that Turkey had ill responded to - too late. Answer this.....

What happened to the Turkish threats of annexation if the ROC entered the EU - NOTHING! The ROC has been a full member of the EU now since 2004 and hey presto, still NO sign of annexation - WHAT A SURPRIZE.

What happened to all the threats if the Greek Cypriots said no to the Annan Plan in April 2004? What utter rubbish was Turkey talking about then....I recall the following from the Turkish government.. "This is Cyprus's last chance for unification"....and "The Turkish Cypriots will go their separate ways and order the UN to leave the island". Again WHAT RUBBISH. Turkey just can not stop lying about its Cyprus affairs.

Turkey has played on Turkish Cypriot emotion for so long now that WE do not believe her NO MORE, not that we ever did anyway. The ONLY PRACTICAL solutions we've seen so far have come from the Republic of Cyprus. As I have said, I can now fly direct to Cyprus...but not with my so-called bubble TRNC passport but with my original ROC passport.

If Turkey truly wants to win the hearts of ALL Turkish Cypriots, which I know it doesn't care to Kurus's about, then it better start meaning what it says, better stop WASTING OUR BLOODY LIVES. My son is now 24, was born in this UNRECOGNISED state, graduated from an UNRECOGNISED university and NOW MUST GO TO TURKEY TO FIND A JOB - What rubbish. There is no way in hell I am sending my son to Turkey, alone to seek work. The old politics of Cyprus is over, old news - the opening of the border proven how well we can generally work as people with each other. I have given the TRNC too many chances for its so-called recognition or isolation to be removed. I never thought, after 24 years later - my son's life so far, I'd be addressing the same "economic", "isolation", "Recognition" issues.

TURKEY = What a waste of time for us. We have given Turkey more than its share of chances. It's now our time to live our lives in Cyprus the way any human being and EU member state should - within our rights and liberties as a Citizen of the Republic of Cyprus with all its economic and political freedoms.

Excellent post.
May I enquire as to the likely percentage of T/Cs that you think would feel the same way. I have always believed , based on the fact that I talk to T/Cs almost on a daily basis in view of my business , that the percentage could be as high as 50% , furthermore what in your opinion should the RoC BE CONCENTRATING UPON to encourage reconciliation amongst the Cypriot people.

Lets say the TCs who are sympathetic make up 50% of all TCs. Then that makes it 45,000 TCs out of a population of 510,000.

You are barking up the wrong tree, and need to realise that every move we have made for "reconciliation" has back fired on us. All our good will has never been reciprocated and never will.

We are dealing with Turks not TCs...They have no power at all!

I agree with Paphitis. Many people in the north have become morally corrupted, unwillingly in some cases, by the deliberate corrupt system designed by their leaders who had set up for those living there to commit such wrong doings by giving away GCs properties to them first, and then teaching them how to live of it by committing "Sins of Haram". The only way the north is going to change, is when Turkey decides to be serious in becoming a EU member, so my message to Kibrisli Turk is, who wrote a very heart warming account as to what the situation in the north is like and who himself sounds like a very decent TCs who has deep concerns for the future of his children, that he should consider moving to the south in order to secure a better future for his family how ever difficult it may be to do so at first, until a True Federation can be set up in Cyprus where his and every citizens Democratic, Human Rights and Constitutional rights will be protected and respected as a Cypriot and as a EU citizen.!

[Paphitis]

Hi Paphitis,

I'm sure the true figure is much higher than 50%, but most suffer from a realisation complex.

I only hatched out of my brainwashed shell after the situation affected my son, and then me personally. I am fed up of this situation and now it's not sustainable. We are in the EU, and Turkey wants to join, the rest is common sense and now very much obvious.

Unless, of course Turkey has a few tricks up its sleeve! Many TCs just want two basic forms of freedoms in today's world. Firstly to be able to trade freely, travel and not be isolated. And second, to live side-by-side with people who care about the island and its future and not with people (like those from eastern Turkey) who obsiously see the island as a working dock zone and do not care about the future and educational welfare of its children. Times have now changed, the world for god's sake has changed. We know longer believe that spending two years in the Turkish Army is our birth right, not that I ever did anyway. Turkey has seriously shot itself in the foot on Cyprus and must now face certain realities.

The UBP were obviously installed to up hold Turkish policy on Cyprus, but this is not sustainable. the answer is simple, because eventually, the UBP will not make ANY such difference on the island, will NOT be able to remove the isolation from the bubble "TRNC" so called state and is dreaming if it can over turn the UN's decision to not recognise the "TRNC" by saying Yes to a future referendum. Let me just finally say that the future agreement, if it's rejected by the GC, will not make one slightest bit of difference. I challenge anyone who says otherwise. The bubble state will remain as static as glue regardless of any political reunification plan that's rejected as that's the way Turkey wishes the people within it to remain. But there's a flaw. Turkey hasn't got much time, and the EU will demand its removal from Cyprus when the time comes for Turkey to join - and Turkey will listen and drop its current nationalist stance. In the meantime, its us, the TC alone, who have suffered this inhumane isolation under this dumb Turkish invented state know as the "TRNC".

I agree with you Kibrisli. But unfortunately things are very difficult for us because of Turkey's policies. Also, EU pressure on Turkey seems to be inneffective as EURO scepticism is starting to creep in. France and Germany do not seem to be helping the situation due to some strong anti Turkish rhetoric, resulting in Turkey beginning to believe that the EU is an unreachable dream. This does not suit Cyprus at all.

I wish you luck and all the best. Don't let things get you down. Just know that there is always a RoC which will always be there for you should you need it.

[The Cypriot]

Unless, of course Turkey has a few tricks up its sleeve! Many TCs just want two basic forms of freedoms in today's world. Firstly to be able to trade freely, travel and not be isolated. And second, to live side-by-side with people who care about the island and its future and not with people (like those from eastern Turkey) who obsiously see the island as a working dock zone and do not care about the future and educational welfare of its children. Times have now changed, the world for god's sake has changed. We know longer believe that spending two years in the Turkish Army is our birth right, not that I ever did anyway. Turkey has seriously shot itself in the foot on Cyprus and must now face certain realities.

This is what Viewpoint always says; that Cypriots in the free areas must face certain realities. He must have things the wrong way round.

Hosgelding to the forum "Kirbrisli". I hope you don't mind if I only ever call you by your first name.

[Oracle]

Unless, of course Turkey has a few tricks up its sleeve! Many TCs just want two basic forms of freedoms in today's world. Firstly to be able to trade freely, travel and not be isolated. And second, to live side-by-side with people who care about the island and its future and not with people (like those from eastern Turkey) who obsiously see the island as a working dock zone and do not care about the future and educational welfare of its children. Times have now changed, the world for god's sake has changed. We know longer believe that spending two years in the Turkish Army is our birth right, not that I ever did anyway. Turkey has seriously shot itself in the foot on Cyprus and must now face certain realities.

This is what Viewpoint always says; that Cypriots in the free areas must face certain realities. He must have things the wrong way round.

Hosgelding to the forum "Kirbrisli". I hope you don't mind if I only ever call you by your first name.

Then, we'll have to call you by your first name ...

Hello "The"!

[The Cypriot]

Unless, of course Turkey has a few tricks up its sleeve! Many TCs just want two basic forms of freedoms in today's world. Firstly to be able to trade freely, travel and not be isolated. And second, to live side-by-side with people who care about the island and its future and not with people (like those from eastern Turkey) who obsiously see the island as a working dock zone and do not care about the future and educational welfare of its children. Times have now changed, the world for god's sake has changed. We know longer believe that spending two years in the Turkish Army is our birth right, not that I ever did anyway. Turkey has seriously shot itself in the foot on Cyprus and must now face certain realities.

This is what Viewpoint always says; that Cypriots in the free areas must face certain realities. He must have things the wrong way round.

Hosgelding to the forum "Kirbrisli". I hope you don't mind if I only ever call you by your first name.

Then, we'll have to call you by your first name ...

Hello "The"!

That's not my first name that's my title... the definite article.

[Viewpoint]

viewpoint,

One of the many problems with Turkey, but one that particularly affects us Turkish Cypriots, is that they always wait until the last minute to respond to a situation - too bloody late!

Turkey is too slow, not all ready to play big politics with Cyprus or even the EU, it just loses its purpose by the time it decides to sit around a table. Like with the Cyprus issue. If Turkey agreed with Denktas to recognise the bubble TRNC self-declared state then why doesn't it recognise it from ALL corners? It is obvious that Turkey does not recognise the bubble TRNC self-declared state as it wouldn't feel obliged to force Talat to bargain it away. The real issue viewpoint here, and you know it, is that the so-called TRNC is not a guaranteed safe haven for the Turkish Cypriots - those of course who have woken up. We have been isolated for 35 years, we now prefer to use our original ROC passports to travel abroad, we do not associate ourselves with the moon and start inverted so-called TRNC flag, we do not believe that the "TRNC" will ever gain any type of recognition in any way, we are now being told that houses that we so-called compensated to us after 1974 are still under threat as they are legitimately "Greek Cypriot" owned (so much for the "TRNC" ey!) and our side has now more air-headed Turks from eastern uneducated Turkey in it than Turkish Cypriots.

Face it Viewpoint, I am as frustrated as you are but the difference is I regard myself as a true "Cypriot" and do not believe Turkey gives two Kurus about our preservation or our so-called "Protection".

Turkey has never, ever sought to prove its claim on northern Cyprus, on its protection policy or has kept any of its threats. Ever the 1974 affair was an opportunity that Turkey had ill responded to - too late. Answer this.....

What happened to the Turkish threats of annexation if the ROC entered the EU - NOTHING! The ROC has been a full member of the EU now since 2004 and hey presto, still NO sign of annexation - WHAT A SURPRIZE.

What happened to all the threats if the Greek Cypriots said no to the Annan Plan in April 2004? What utter rubbish was Turkey talking about then....I recall the following from the Turkish government.. "This is Cyprus's last chance for unification"....and "The Turkish Cypriots will go their separate ways and order the UN to leave the island". Again WHAT RUBBISH. Turkey just can not stop lying about its Cyprus affairs.

Turkey has played on Turkish Cypriot emotion for so long now that WE do not believe her NO MORE, not that we ever did anyway. The ONLY PRACTICAL solutions we've seen so far have come from the Republic of Cyprus. As I have said, I can now fly direct to Cyprus...but not with my so-called bubble TRNC passport but with my original ROC passport.

If Turkey truly wants to win the hearts of ALL Turkish Cypriots, which I know it doesn't care to Kurus's about, then it better start meaning what it says, better stop WASTING OUR BLOODY LIVES. My son is now 24, was born in this UNRECOGNISED state, graduated from an UNRECOGNISED university and NOW MUST GO TO TURKEY TO FIND A JOB - What rubbish. There is no way in hell I am sending my son to Turkey, alone to seek work. The old politics of Cyprus is over, old news - the opening of the border proven how well we can generally work as people with each other. I have given the TRNC too many chances for its so-called recognition or isolation to be removed. I never thought, after 24 years later - my son's life so far, I'd be addressing the same "economic", "isolation", "Recognition" issues.

TURKEY = What a waste of time for us. We have given Turkey more than its share of chances. It's now our time to live our lives in Cyprus the way any human being and EU member state should - within our rights and liberties as a Citizen of the Republic of Cyprus with all its economic and political freedoms.

You appear to looking at it from the angle of the glass being half empty when you should realize you have many options open to you and your family. If you are not already aware there is a world recession and people are going where the work is. The TRNC is a much better place to live than say the Uk right now where the crime rate is so high people are scared to wonder the streets at night. The TRNC has and will develop but not over night we cannot just capitualte to the demands of the GCs becuase we are pissed of with Turkey for not keeping her promises when has anyone kept their promises including the EU the so called bastion of democracy and human rights. If you are not happy with the TRNC and consider yourself a true "Cypriot" move south its your right and then judge for yourself where the TRNC is on scale of best places to work live and play. Uniting with the GCs as a minority will be disastrous for us as we are not used to being treated as second class citizens, we have developed and especially your son as free TCs with no GC influence, admitidly our Turkishness has increased at the expense of our "Cypriotness" but dont forget you were originally Turkish anyway. Would you rather be absorbed by GCs and ridiculed forced to learn Greek and treated as scum or continue to grow within a new generation TC nation. The GCs have shown no effort to compromise in fact their rejection and subsequent refusal to accept us as is a clear sign of your future in a Gc state run by GCs. Wake up and understand that nowhere in the world is perfect and there much much worseplaces than the TRNC.