Cyprus-Forum.com

[EPSILON]

No, shah, it's you who is confusing the two. It's a very fine line. Justice is being sought against the perpetrators of illegalities. And if you think that includes you then you have a guilty conscience.

I have nothing to worry about, even if the GC's take EVERYTHING back and paint the entire island into blue and white, I will not loose a penny nor an inch of land.

Would I be upset to see the place I call "home" totally destroyed and morphed into something totally new for me purely for the sake of revenge, of course I would.

Like this, for example?

This is more on the lines of what I had in mind



But why would I be upset about a flag that actually represents me?

The white flag with the map of the Island started our problems!!!And a Turk was design it.

[shahmaran]

I disagree Epsilon, to me it seems like the problem started when they thought they could pull off independence AS WELL AS GC dominance and became vulnerable to all sorts of divisive attacks.

How else could people divide a 500 year old community?

Now lets just wait for Piratis to jump in with a few videos and claims of how Enosis was the democratic "right" of all "Cypriots" and that this place is their god given land and we are the foreign invaders etc. etc.

[EPSILON]

I disagree Epsilon, to me it seems like the problem started when they thought they could pull off independence AS WELL AS GC dominance and became vulnerable to all sorts of divisive attacks.

How else could people divide a 500 year old community?

Now lets just wait for Piratis to jump in with a few videos and claims of how Enosis was the democratic "right" of all "Cypriots" and that this place is their god given land and we are the foreign invaders etc. etc.

I do not think that there were many T/cs oposite or caring about Enosis or not until 1956. Neither Turkey i think was giving a sh..t about such a case.
This is what i can understand from what i heart and what i found in books.Maybe I am wrong but the Enosis target lost by G/cs because of their overestimation of their power against British. Stupid politicians in Greece of course helped also in this direction by their actions and decisions these times.Nevertheless if the incidents of 1963/1974 were not occurred the not success of Enosis would be for the benefit of Cyprus but unfortunatetly Makarios and Grivas were of these Cypriots (we have many) whos mind can not be changed even in centuries.

[Get Real!]

This thread is now closed.

Reason: The “Orams” and “Ercan” bookmaker who went bust is too busy licking his wounds.

[YFred]

This thread is now closed.

Reason: The “Orams” and “Ercan” bookmaker who went bust is too busy licking his wounds.

Mavro laoman banosu. Na bais stanathema.

[EU Ctzn]

Cypriot,
I agree with your comment.
D.T. It would appear that you are unable to debate. Perhaps respond more sensibly and you may become more enlightenede.

Miltiades, You are aware that the TRNC have an administration which is the de-facto government in the region. The Orams are obliged to adhere to the laws and systems of this government.
Of course you would have the TRNC held to ransom as stolen property. The ROC still aspires to destruction of the TRNC. It is abundantly clear that up till now they have failed entirely. Mr Appostolides and other displaced Cypriots , including of course TC's, lost the use of property and land over 30 years ago. Their influence, memory and control continues to diminish. There are clear options for displaced persons to seek compensation for their loss. I wonder why Mr Appostolides has chosen not to seek this type of recourse. I further wonder why Mr Appostolides has not sold his interest in the ssaid plot of land particularly as he is somewhat excluded from it.
Your comments towards British people is not fair. The british people who have purchased land and property in the North are predominently very aware of the ECHR supported Property Commission that provides measures to compensate those that have lost control of property. Of course there is also Turkish property in the ROC. It is the case that displaced Turks, as you may know, are severley hindered from taking or obtainning compensation for their loss.
The Exchange philosophy is really quite a good idea. It is such a shame that both sides are unable to make it work.
Perhaps they do not indeed want it to work. Some people are weened on the culture of racial hatred, conflict and divergence. Again the proven Cypriot inability to tackle and solve Cyprioy issues is very unfortunate and is ulitimately retaining the Island in a state of disadvantage.

[DT.]

Cypriot,
I agree with your comment.
D.T. It would appear that you are unable to debate. Perhaps respond more sensibly and you may become more enlightenede.

Miltiades, You are aware that the TRNC have an administration which is the de-facto government in the region. The Orams are obliged to adhere to the laws and systems of this government.
Of course you would have the TRNC held to ransom as stolen property. The ROC still aspires to destruction of the TRNC. It is abundantly clear that up till now they have failed entirely. Mr Appostolides and other displaced Cypriots , including of course TC's, lost the use of property and land over 30 years ago. Their influence, memory and control continues to diminish. There are clear options for displaced persons to seek compensation for their loss. I wonder why Mr Appostolides has chosen not to seek this type of recourse. I further wonder why Mr Appostolides has not sold his interest in the ssaid plot of land particularly as he is somewhat excluded from it.
Your comments towards British people is not fair. The british people who have purchased land and property in the North are predominently very aware of the ECHR supported Property Commission that provides measures to compensate those that have lost control of property. Of course there is also Turkish property in the ROC. It is the case that displaced Turks, as you may know, are severley hindered from taking or obtainning compensation for their loss.
The Exchange philosophy is really quite a good idea. It is such a shame that both sides are unable to make it work.
Perhaps they do not indeed want it to work. Some people are weened on the culture of racial hatred, conflict and divergence. Again the proven Cypriot inability to tackle and solve Cyprioy issues is very unfortunate and is ulitimately retaining the Island in a state of disadvantage.

Excuse me? Unable to debate? When you learn a few basics on the Cyprob I'll hapilly debate you all you like.

[miltiades]

Cypriot,
I agree with your comment.
D.T. It would appear that you are unable to debate. Perhaps respond more sensibly and you may become more enlightenede.

Miltiades, You are aware that the TRNC have an administration which is the de-facto government in the region. The Orams are obliged to adhere to the laws and systems of this government.
Of course you would have the TRNC held to ransom as stolen property. The ROC still aspires to destruction of the TRNC. It is abundantly clear that up till now they have failed entirely. Mr Appostolides and other displaced Cypriots , including of course TC's, lost the use of property and land over 30 years ago. Their influence, memory and control continues to diminish. There are clear options for displaced persons to seek compensation for their loss. I wonder why Mr Appostolides has chosen not to seek this type of recourse. I further wonder why Mr Appostolides has not sold his interest in the ssaid plot of land particularly as he is somewhat excluded from it.
Your comments towards British people is not fair. The british people who have purchased land and property in the North are predominently very aware of the ECHR supported Property Commission that provides measures to compensate those that have lost control of property. Of course there is also Turkish property in the ROC. It is the case that displaced Turks, as you may know, are severley hindered from taking or obtainning compensation for their loss.
The Exchange philosophy is really quite a good idea. It is such a shame that both sides are unable to make it work.
Perhaps they do not indeed want it to work. Some people are weened on the culture of racial hatred, conflict and divergence. Again the proven Cypriot inability to tackle and solve Cyprioy issues is very unfortunate and is ulitimately retaining the Island in a state of disadvantage.

Rather late at night to reply so I will just make it short.
Of course I wish to see the deletion of the "trnc" , because its continuance is contrary to international law and a divisive partitionist pseudo state. It does not mean that I harbour ill feelings towards the T/Cs , it merely means that I do not wish to see my island divided and continued to be under the occupation of Turkey.
The Brits who purchased land in the occupied part are brainless , idiotic , irresponsible , immoral cheapskates . They bought not out of love for the T/Cs but because they could not afford legitimate land in the free part of Cyprus. The corruption that accompanies the sale of G/C properties is a bloody disgrace to the Cypriot nation , do not try to excuse it for there is no justification in dealing in stolen property . You must know this so do not defend the indefensible.

[EU Ctzn]

Miltiades,
You are correct concerning international Law. However international law in situations linked to ethnic divisions, land grab, territorial issues are numerous in History. Palestine. Taiwan, Bosnia, Cyprus.
It is clear Fact that the TRNC is there and has you are aware of its highly motivated and committed followers and citizens. Your fight is likely to be long hard and without suffering on your own populus.
The spoils are just not there. The Cypriot History since the 1950's has led to an inevitable division. It may be time to let it happen (by agreement) and both sides can direct their energies into more productive projects of true and acheivable value such as economic growth and prosperity.
Are you aware how the Cypriot problem has stiffled the Islands potential?
It is not just Brits that have invested in the TRNC. Many other nationals from Iranians to Australians are buying.
OK ,I acknowledge your understadable anger at this but how can you really put a stop to it. So much development, so many people. Capitalist greed and material desire is the same driving force North, South or indeed internationally. If your government had siezed the solution in 2004 then at least they would have gained some territory and been able to move on. Now, I think the ROC hand is somewhat weakened. The legal ticket fails to provide significant changes in the TRNC. The Orams case will not really cause a great deal of change should the appeal fail. Embargoes are not having the desired level of effect. Turkey is taking a much stronger international position on the world political stage.
I am afraid that the legal ticket is several rows back from the front.
Whilst I respect you for your courageous stand in what is a contentious issue.. I think that the cause is really a failing one. The TC have the right for self governance. They are clearly in bed with Turkey and i do not see any change to this any time soon regardless of civil litigation cases.

[Nikitas]

Stick this firmly in your brains- the right of individuals to their property cannot be circumvented or corrupted by tricks like partition or declarations of independence etc.

The lesson here is Turkey's problems with the properties of Greeks of Istanbul and the islands of Imvros and Tenedos. They did go through a period of tricks and bullying to expropriate the properties. And now, Turkey wants in to the EU and it has to face up to the issue of these properties. It is almost a century since Imvros and Tenedos and 60 years since the Istanbul grab.

That is how the properties issue will hound the north forever. No matter how many Australians, Iranians, Jews or others invest there. The claims of the original owners cannot be extinguished unilaterally.

And by the way, when some posters use the term "investing" what they mean is selling, which is a whole different thing.