Cyprus-Forum.com

[repulsewarrior]

Not being Cypriot and having no axe to grind against either side of the green line i have visited areas of the occupied north to look for myself at the countryside and villages that were once mixed communities.
I want to know why such disgraceful behaviour on the part of the occupiers took place??
I refer to the destruction and desecration of Christian churches and even worse in my mind, the destruction and vandalism of Christian Graveyards.
What were you afraid of? the dead can harm no one. They represent no threat yet you have destroyed graves and vandalised them - for what?
Used them as goat pens....these are the actions of Barbarians.
You want tourism, but mainly from christian countries i suspect, and this is how you treat the dead?

I also note that in the South the Mosques there i have visited are in good order and some have even been renovated.
Is this the way your God tells you to respect others? Eternal Shame on you.

I think that Turkey wishes to perpetuate the myth that Cyprus has always been divided into a Turkish north and a Greek south, and in order to perpetuate this myth requires to remove all evidence that contradicts this. I think Turkey is succeeding in creating this impression. Speak to many foreigners who have a casual acquaintance with Cyprus and you will find that they believe that the island has always been divided along ethnic lines as it is now, and that the north has always been populated by Turks.

Tim
You are fairly new to Cyprus so naturally you wouldn't know..This "removing the evidence of other communities past" has been practiced by GC's long time ago..
Up until the end of 19th century there used to be only muslim villages occupied by ancestors of TC's in Cyprus.Each and every one of these villages had a small or a large mosque and a cemetery...Where are they now?
Captain H.H Kitchener's Trigonometric map of Cyprus dated 1882 is an excellent evidence for the above claim.

Iceman, I am not quite sure I understand what exactly you are talking about. Can you be more specific and give us some examples of such villages, and also a link to the said map? So far I knew that a good number of mosques in Cyprus were previously Christian churches, and this is also evident by their architectural style, beside other historical accounts, but it’s the first time I hear that exclusively Muslim villages were overtaken by Greek Cypriots and their mosques destroyed.

Kifeas
During Ottoman occupation in Cyprus,there used to be villages with mix population there were also villages occupied by either only Christian population or only Muslim population..
H.H.Kitcheners map published in 1882 clearly states these villages and their population status by religion..(as well as their names use by each population)
Some of the place names Turkish administration started using after 1974 are the names which had been used for centuries..some examples are Chatal Keuy (Ayios Epiktitos) or Arap Keuy (Klepini) Ay Ghroush (Ayios Amvrosios) these villages in Kyrenia region used to have mixed population at the time the map was made but later on Turkish population and their remains vanished from these villages.
Plenty of examples i cannot remember individually now..examples of only TC villages which in time the TC population vanished and they became only GC villages with no sign of the TC's ever existing there..Like Akathu...Not many people know Akathu was a TC village..
Anyway...the H.H.Kitcheners map is not online but i have a detailed copy of it on a CD..
If interested in a copy send me a PM..
I cannot upload all of the map because its made up of loads of files (146 to be more precise) but i am uploading the index to give you an idea of what i mentioned about displaying population info as well as names used by both communities..

Iceman ... his maps were produced in haste and deemed unreliable by historians, when compared to other sources from that time.

...not that it really matters what was done by whom
a hundred odd years ago, we are talking about the here
and now,

ms, O please will you provide other maps
(or sources that "Greeks" and "Turks" lived differently then, when "Niggers" hung from trees)
...this question remains; haven't we changed?

[runaway]

Two worthwhile neutral contributors, BOF and Tim, present some independent observations from the occupied north ... and the maggots (runaway, YFred, etc ...) crawl out to ruin the thread with their inane views, in case anyone has any doubts they are the lowest life-forms.

fuck off old hairy ugly moron murderer south cypriot orospu

You forgot "Greek"

south cypriot stands for Greek. no need to repeat twice.

[Oracle]

Two worthwhile neutral contributors, BOF and Tim, present some independent observations from the occupied north ... and the maggots (runaway, YFred, etc ...) crawl out to ruin the thread with their inane views, in case anyone has any doubts they are the lowest life-forms.

fuck off old hairy ugly moron murderer south cypriot orospu

You forgot "Greek"

south cypriot stands for Greek. no need to repeat twice.

Just as east turk stands for Kurd .... and Turk stands for corrupted Mongol.

[denizaksulu]

Two worthwhile neutral contributors, BOF and Tim, present some independent observations from the occupied north ... and the maggots (runaway, YFred, etc ...) crawl out to ruin the thread with their inane views, in case anyone has any doubts they are the lowest life-forms.

fuck off old hairy ugly moron murderer south cypriot orospu

You forgot "Greek"

south cypriot stands for Greek. no need to repeat twice.

Just as east turk stands for Kurd .... and Turk stands for corrupted Mongol.

Good morning Oracle. Fighting your demons I see. I am south Cypriot, but am not a Greek speaker. What is going on here. There are many thousands of Turkish speaking south Cypriots.

[runaway]

Two worthwhile neutral contributors, BOF and Tim, present some independent observations from the occupied north ... and the maggots (runaway, YFred, etc ...) crawl out to ruin the thread with their inane views, in case anyone has any doubts they are the lowest life-forms.

fuck off old hairy ugly moron murderer south cypriot orospu

You forgot "Greek"

south cypriot stands for Greek. no need to repeat twice.

Just as east turk stands for Kurd .... and Turk stands for corrupted Mongol.

You have the wrong idea of Kurds hating Turks and loving south cypriots. A Kurd (Eastern Turk as you call ) hates you as much as I do. Now get on top of a cypriot donkey and get yourself fucked on the plains of Mongolia.[/b]

[YFred]

Two worthwhile neutral contributors, BOF and Tim, present some independent observations from the occupied north ... and the maggots (runaway, YFred, etc ...) crawl out to ruin the thread with their inane views, in case anyone has any doubts they are the lowest life-forms.

fuck off old hairy ugly moron murderer south cypriot orospu

You forgot "Greek"

south cypriot stands for Greek. no need to repeat twice.

Just as east turk stands for Kurd .... and Turk stands for corrupted Mongol.

Good morning Oracle. Fighting your demons I see. I am south Cypriot, but am not a Greek speaker. What is going on here. There are many thousands of Turkish speaking south Cypriots.

Deniz, welcome to the club. However there is a slight difference between us. I can knock up couple of words of the CY dialect and to my amazement some of the GC understand it!

[Oracle]

Not being Cypriot and having no axe to grind against either side of the green line i have visited areas of the occupied north to look for myself at the countryside and villages that were once mixed communities.
I want to know why such disgraceful behaviour on the part of the occupiers took place??
I refer to the destruction and desecration of Christian churches and even worse in my mind, the destruction and vandalism of Christian Graveyards.
What were you afraid of? the dead can harm no one. They represent no threat yet you have destroyed graves and vandalised them - for what?
Used them as goat pens....these are the actions of Barbarians.
You want tourism, but mainly from christian countries i suspect, and this is how you treat the dead?

I also note that in the South the Mosques there i have visited are in good order and some have even been renovated.
Is this the way your God tells you to respect others? Eternal Shame on you.

I think that Turkey wishes to perpetuate the myth that Cyprus has always been divided into a Turkish north and a Greek south, and in order to perpetuate this myth requires to remove all evidence that contradicts this. I think Turkey is succeeding in creating this impression. Speak to many foreigners who have a casual acquaintance with Cyprus and you will find that they believe that the island has always been divided along ethnic lines as it is now, and that the north has always been populated by Turks.

Tim
You are fairly new to Cyprus so naturally you wouldn't know..This "removing the evidence of other communities past" has been practiced by GC's long time ago..
Up until the end of 19th century there used to be only muslim villages occupied by ancestors of TC's in Cyprus.Each and every one of these villages had a small or a large mosque and a cemetery...Where are they now?
Captain H.H Kitchener's Trigonometric map of Cyprus dated 1882 is an excellent evidence for the above claim.

Iceman, I am not quite sure I understand what exactly you are talking about. Can you be more specific and give us some examples of such villages, and also a link to the said map? So far I knew that a good number of mosques in Cyprus were previously Christian churches, and this is also evident by their architectural style, beside other historical accounts, but it’s the first time I hear that exclusively Muslim villages were overtaken by Greek Cypriots and their mosques destroyed.

Kifeas
During Ottoman occupation in Cyprus,there used to be villages with mix population there were also villages occupied by either only Christian population or only Muslim population..
H.H.Kitcheners map published in 1882 clearly states these villages and their population status by religion..(as well as their names use by each population)
Some of the place names Turkish administration started using after 1974 are the names which had been used for centuries..some examples are Chatal Keuy (Ayios Epiktitos) or Arap Keuy (Klepini) Ay Ghroush (Ayios Amvrosios) these villages in Kyrenia region used to have mixed population at the time the map was made but later on Turkish population and their remains vanished from these villages.
Plenty of examples i cannot remember individually now..examples of only TC villages which in time the TC population vanished and they became only GC villages with no sign of the TC's ever existing there..Like Akathu...Not many people know Akathu was a TC village..
Anyway...the H.H.Kitcheners map is not online but i have a detailed copy of it on a CD..
If interested in a copy send me a PM..
I cannot upload all of the map because its made up of loads of files (146 to be more precise) but i am uploading the index to give you an idea of what i mentioned about displaying population info as well as names used by both communities..

Iceman ... his maps were produced in haste and deemed unreliable by historians, when compared to other sources from that time.

...not that it really matters what was done by whom
a hundred odd years ago, we are talking about the here
and now,

ms, O please will you provide other maps
(or sources that "Greeks" and "Turks" lived differently then, when "Niggers" hung from trees)
...this question remains; haven't we changed?

Greetings my dear repulsewarrior

The aim is not for blame nor for face-saving apologies. But towards correcting wrongs and accurate portrayal of events which led to the present. Historical information calls for evaluation of as many reliable sources as available, from which a more accurate picture may emerge.
To take one source and state:

This "removing the evidence of other communities past" has been practiced by GC's long time ago..

... is a very serious allegation and one which demands more than the need to apportion blame.

The Historian Tønnes Bekker-Nielsen makes the following entry in his book The roads of ancient Cyprus ...

"... The Kitchener map was produced in haste and under unfavourable conditions [...] and there are numerous minor and major inaccuracies in the maps ..."
page 42

He then goes on to compare with some other historical sources.

[denizaksulu]

Two worthwhile neutral contributors, BOF and Tim, present some independent observations from the occupied north ... and the maggots (runaway, YFred, etc ...) crawl out to ruin the thread with their inane views, in case anyone has any doubts they are the lowest life-forms.

fuck off old hairy ugly moron murderer south cypriot orospu

You forgot "Greek"

south cypriot stands for Greek. no need to repeat twice.

Just as east turk stands for Kurd .... and Turk stands for corrupted Mongol.

Good morning Oracle. Fighting your demons I see. I am south Cypriot, but am not a Greek speaker. What is going on here. There are many thousands of Turkish speaking south Cypriots.

Deniz, welcome to the club. However there is a slight difference between us. I can knock up couple of words of the CY dialect and to my amazement some of the GC understand it!

I was trying to avoid the use of the word 'Greek' by itself. You being from Lurucina have an advantage over me. In our house we always spoke Turkish, and in the streets its was Gibreaga. Lurucina was a bit different.

[denizaksulu]

Not being Cypriot and having no axe to grind against either side of the green line i have visited areas of the occupied north to look for myself at the countryside and villages that were once mixed communities.
I want to know why such disgraceful behaviour on the part of the occupiers took place??
I refer to the destruction and desecration of Christian churches and even worse in my mind, the destruction and vandalism of Christian Graveyards.
What were you afraid of? the dead can harm no one. They represent no threat yet you have destroyed graves and vandalised them - for what?
Used them as goat pens....these are the actions of Barbarians.
You want tourism, but mainly from christian countries i suspect, and this is how you treat the dead?

I also note that in the South the Mosques there i have visited are in good order and some have even been renovated.
Is this the way your God tells you to respect others? Eternal Shame on you.

I think that Turkey wishes to perpetuate the myth that Cyprus has always been divided into a Turkish north and a Greek south, and in order to perpetuate this myth requires to remove all evidence that contradicts this. I think Turkey is succeeding in creating this impression. Speak to many foreigners who have a casual acquaintance with Cyprus and you will find that they believe that the island has always been divided along ethnic lines as it is now, and that the north has always been populated by Turks.

Tim
You are fairly new to Cyprus so naturally you wouldn't know..This "removing the evidence of other communities past" has been practiced by GC's long time ago..
Up until the end of 19th century there used to be only muslim villages occupied by ancestors of TC's in Cyprus.Each and every one of these villages had a small or a large mosque and a cemetery...Where are they now?
Captain H.H Kitchener's Trigonometric map of Cyprus dated 1882 is an excellent evidence for the above claim.

Iceman, I am not quite sure I understand what exactly you are talking about. Can you be more specific and give us some examples of such villages, and also a link to the said map? So far I knew that a good number of mosques in Cyprus were previously Christian churches, and this is also evident by their architectural style, beside other historical accounts, but it’s the first time I hear that exclusively Muslim villages were overtaken by Greek Cypriots and their mosques destroyed.

Kifeas
During Ottoman occupation in Cyprus,there used to be villages with mix population there were also villages occupied by either only Christian population or only Muslim population..
H.H.Kitcheners map published in 1882 clearly states these villages and their population status by religion..(as well as their names use by each population)
Some of the place names Turkish administration started using after 1974 are the names which had been used for centuries..some examples are Chatal Keuy (Ayios Epiktitos) or Arap Keuy (Klepini) Ay Ghroush (Ayios Amvrosios) these villages in Kyrenia region used to have mixed population at the time the map was made but later on Turkish population and their remains vanished from these villages.
Plenty of examples i cannot remember individually now..examples of only TC villages which in time the TC population vanished and they became only GC villages with no sign of the TC's ever existing there..Like Akathu...Not many people know Akathu was a TC village..
Anyway...the H.H.Kitcheners map is not online but i have a detailed copy of it on a CD..
If interested in a copy send me a PM..
I cannot upload all of the map because its made up of loads of files (146 to be more precise) but i am uploading the index to give you an idea of what i mentioned about displaying population info as well as names used by both communities..

Iceman ... his maps were produced in haste and deemed unreliable by historians, when compared to other sources from that time.

...not that it really matters what was done by whom
a hundred odd years ago, we are talking about the here
and now,

ms, O please will you provide other maps
(or sources that "Greeks" and "Turks" lived differently then, when "Niggers" hung from trees)
...this question remains; haven't we changed?

Greetings my dear repulsewarrior

The aim is not for blame nor for face-saving apologies. But towards correcting wrongs and accurate portrayal of events which led to the present. Historical information calls for evaluation of as many reliable sources as available, from which a more accurate picture may emerge.
To take one source and state:

This "removing the evidence of other communities past" has been practiced by GC's long time ago..

... is a very serious allegation and one which demands more than the need to apportion blame.

The Historian Tønnes Bekker-Nielsen makes the following entry in his book The roads of ancient Cyprus ...

"... The Kitchener map was produced in haste and under unfavourable conditions [...] and there are numerous minor and major inaccuracies in the maps ..."
page 42

He then goes on to compare with some other historical sources.

Not having read the book yeyt, ( I have to purchase it first - a good idea), is there any mention of the nature of the 'errors' and 'in-accuracies'? Naturally it is important to get to the truth in all things, but how significant would these be to the discussion at hand. Can you reproduce photographic copies of the relevant pages (Copyright?).

[YFred]

Two worthwhile neutral contributors, BOF and Tim, present some independent observations from the occupied north ... and the maggots (runaway, YFred, etc ...) crawl out to ruin the thread with their inane views, in case anyone has any doubts they are the lowest life-forms.

fuck off old hairy ugly moron murderer south cypriot orospu

You forgot "Greek"

south cypriot stands for Greek. no need to repeat twice.

Just as east turk stands for Kurd .... and Turk stands for corrupted Mongol.

Good morning Oracle. Fighting your demons I see. I am south Cypriot, but am not a Greek speaker. What is going on here. There are many thousands of Turkish speaking south Cypriots.

Deniz, welcome to the club. However there is a slight difference between us. I can knock up couple of words of the CY dialect and to my amazement some of the GC understand it!

I was trying to avoid the use of the word 'Greek' by itself. You being from Lurucina have an advantage over me. In our house we always spoke Turkish, and in the streets its was Gibreaga. Lurucina was a bit different.

You see, I knew all along that we are the true Gibrea (spell it right), we spoke the lingo in da house and outside.