Cyprus-Forum.com

[Floda]

where I make a clear distinction is when it comes to Cypriots denying their true homeland and aligning themselves to the same foreign countries that were in the first place responsible for dividing our people and causing the seeds of hatred to expand and grow uncontrollably.

Unbelievable !, that YOU of all people should pen those words.

I propose a new thread where the likes of you should post so that " na min anakatonese mestarhidia tous anthropus "
I suggest we name this thread and all who post in it the STUPUID THREAD, so clear off malaka.

"Oh Fie" miltiades, if we are to create a new thread, let it be known as 'The Tinker and the Thinker'.

Far more appropriate under the circumstances.

[Viewpoint]

The vengeance seeking G/Cs are resting in peace . Someone mentioned that only the older generation would somehow feel that vengeance is appropriate , on the contrary the older generation who lived through both the peaceful era and the conflict era would want nothing more than to bury the hatchet and live peacefuly on the island of Cyprus. No older generation Cypriot would want to put his children and grandchildren through the horrible conflict days that they went through. It is the young indoctrinated hot heads that are the problem on both sides of the divide , the young who deny Cyprus as their true homeland and look elsewhere.
Turkey along with Greece are the cause of our troubles . Greece , albeit under the Junta , orchestrated the military coup against Makarios , Turkey saw that as her opportunity to achieve what had been planned , the partition of the island. Turkey continues to this day , in total self denial , to occupy a part of Cyprus while audaciously promotes the ludicrous assumption that there exists a separate state , one that the entire world refuses to recognise as such , while in the meantime contrary to all international conventions continues her policy of Turkifying a part of Cyprus , eliminating the natives and installing her own citizens to occupy lands that for generations were lived on by the indigenous Cypriots both G/Cs and T/Cs.

Turkey's insistence in retaining guarantor status will never be accepted by the RoC. Moderates such as my self oppose such action along with most if not not all of the Cypriot people. Turkey must see that and act accordingly if she genuinely aspires for peace and stability in Cyprus.

The future of Cyprus is bright , united or not the democratic and free part of the island will prosper and progress in every field , the European membership has put the seal of approval on the legitimate government of Cyprus , regardless of the pathetic sounding noises by Turkey.
As a united island the sky is the limit , peace , stability financial benefits and above all the opportunity for all Cypriots to thrive and better them selves and improve the prospects of the new generation.
I make no distinction whatsoever between the G/Cs and the T/Cs , both are my compatriots and both should equally benefit in a united Cyprus , where I make a clear distinction is when it comes to Cypriots denying their true homeland and aligning themselves to the same foreign countries that were in the first place responsible for dividing our people and causing the seeds of hatred to expand and grow uncontrollably.

Great speach but is wanting to know the exact details of how a united Cyprus will work and how it will effect our daily lives or wanting to feel the security of the last 35 years wrong?

All we want is to live in peace and not be exposed to discrimination or domination which we know GCs are experts at, all they put forward reconfirms their real intention of taking control of the whole island and running it for themselves.

We need definate guidelines to which everyone will adhere otherwise the dangers are to great to dissolve the TRNC recognized or not and take a big leap of faith into the arms of a mistrusted "compatriot", this is to much to ask of anyone. Even the structure of today with all its shortfalls is far prefered to the unknown and constant chants of GCs "you are just another minority you will be treated as like bu us the GC majority.

We will get nowhere unless the GCs realize we are equal partners and that past experiences have shown we need to take further measures to obtain safeguards and guarantees which cannot be broken or disregarded unless very heavy penalties are paid by the offending side...eg if anything like the Akritas is resurected we are thrown out of the EU.

[miltiades]

As T/Cs of course your equal partners , democracy however is based on the principle primarily and fundamentally of one man one vote . There is no denying that the G/Cs are numerically larger than the T/Cs , just as in the UK the Scots , Welsh and Irish are numerically less than the English. Democracy has made no provision for artificially increasing a communities numbers to equal that of a larger community .
The "problem " can be dealt with by the formation of new political CYPRIOT parties embracing all Cypriots from whatever community they belong. In time a good solid and wise political leader could emerge from either community to inspire and lead a party to an electoral victory . Much has to be done by both sides in order to pave the way forward , the way that leads to the realization by all Cypriots that our homeland is none other than the island of Cyprus. Integration and interaction between our people is of essence if we are to realize our goal of finding a way to stand on our own feet as Cypriots first and foremost. You will have noticed that I have never instigated that the G/Cs and T/Cs or indeed Armenian Cypriots should deny their inherent identity but have always promoted that the Cypriot identity measures much higher than all else.
You know through this forum that I have a great number of T/C friends whom I respect and trust and would never see them as minority Cypriots anymore than I would see my G/C friends as majority Cypriots .
You should try and understand that all Cypriots suffered a great deal , lets us put a stop on all that happened in the past by empathising and understanding each others concerns . This is where the Turkish army , an occupation army , has no place in Cyprus.

[Byron]

...a GC dominated island with no strict political bouderies will allow revenge seeking GCs discriminate us at every turn until we capitulate to their demands of becoming a minority privilidge to live off their crumbs.

You’re awfully concerned about “revenge seeking”…

What on earth have your people done to Greek Cypriots VP?

You yourself have stated what we have done which you still seek revenge for so giving you the free hand you desire to do as you wish based on your numerical advantage will be our downfall, we must demand safeguards and guarantees that will never expose us to your mindset.

VP , for every G/C fascist there are at least 1 million Europeans including Cypriots who will defend the right of all of our citizens to full enjoyment of their human rights.
The fact that on this forum there are a few such individuals it does not mean that their views are representative of the G/C Cypriot people , anymore that the views of the T/C fascists.
You have witnessed my challenges to the extremists from both sides for a few years now and I hope you put a different interpretation to that that you originally posted concerning my position.

You and your like a very small minority and thats what scares us the most otherwise we would have no problems merging in a unitary state. The people on this forum unfortunately for me do represent and reconfirm my worst fears, in the face to which safeguards guarantees and strict penalities are vital if we even to consider living together.

Perhaps its time for another poll asking which GCs want re-unification. I get the feeling that a significant number want the continuation of the status quo (hence partition). Am I wrong?

Partition is not in the interests of either Greek or Turkish Cypriots but unfortunately neither party is giving way just like a game of chess with many openings and endless endgame positions. Even so there is no justification for the TURKISH MILITARY to keep 35000 troops when the EU is a guarantor. Once the military goes a solution will be found.

The TA will leave but only after an agreement, how can you expect us to weaken our hand and expose ourselves to 12.000 GC soldiers and 120.000 armed reservists and a revenge seeking GC population, it would be mayhem and very very dangerous.

So you are using the TURKISH MILITARY to improve your bargaining hand or to leave the status quo as is which was my original point.

Greek Cypriots are not interested in starting a war otherwise we would have done so long time ago. The Turkish army does not scare us one bit. However we believe in democracy taking its course something you TURKS do not understand. On the one hand you wish to enter the EU on the other hand you do not accept the EU guarantees for the Turkish military to leave. Everything else is poetry .........Attilio Lazzarin

[Byron]

The vengeance seeking G/Cs are resting in peace . Someone mentioned that only the older generation would somehow feel that vengeance is appropriate , on the contrary the older generation who lived through both the peaceful era and the conflict era would want nothing more than to bury the hatchet and live peacefuly on the island of Cyprus. No older generation Cypriot would want to put his children and grandchildren through the horrible conflict days that they went through. It is the young indoctrinated hot heads that are the problem on both sides of the divide , the young who deny Cyprus as their true homeland and look elsewhere.
Turkey along with Greece are the cause of our troubles . Greece , albeit under the Junta , orchestrated the military coup against Makarios , Turkey saw that as her opportunity to achieve what had been planned , the partition of the island. Turkey continues to this day , in total self denial , to occupy a part of Cyprus while audaciously promotes the ludicrous assumption that there exists a separate state , one that the entire world refuses to recognise as such , while in the meantime contrary to all international conventions continues her policy of Turkifying a part of Cyprus , eliminating the natives and installing her own citizens to occupy lands that for generations were lived on by the indigenous Cypriots both G/Cs and T/Cs.

Turkey's insistence in retaining guarantor status will never be accepted by the RoC. Moderates such as my self oppose such action along with most if not not all of the Cypriot people. Turkey must see that and act accordingly if she genuinely aspires for peace and stability in Cyprus.

The future of Cyprus is bright , united or not the democratic and free part of the island will prosper and progress in every field , the European membership has put the seal of approval on the legitimate government of Cyprus , regardless of the pathetic sounding noises by Turkey.
As a united island the sky is the limit , peace , stability financial benefits and above all the opportunity for all Cypriots to thrive and better them selves and improve the prospects of the new generation.
I make no distinction whatsoever between the G/Cs and the T/Cs , both are my compatriots and both should equally benefit in a united Cyprus , where I make a clear distinction is when it comes to Cypriots denying their true homeland and aligning themselves to the same foreign countries that were in the first place responsible for dividing our people and causing the seeds of hatred to expand and grow uncontrollably.

Great speach but is wanting to know the exact details of how a united Cyprus will work and how it will effect our daily lives or wanting to feel the security of the last 35 years wrong?

All we want is to live in peace and not be exposed to discrimination or domination which we know GCs are experts at, all they put forward reconfirms their real intention of taking control of the whole island and running it for themselves.

We need definate guidelines to which everyone will adhere otherwise the dangers are to great to dissolve the TRNC recognized or not and take a big leap of faith into the arms of a mistrusted "compatriot", this is to much to ask of anyone. Even the structure of today with all its shortfalls is far prefered to the unknown and constant chants of GCs "you are just another minority you will be treated as like bu us the GC majority.

We will get nowhere unless the GCs realize we are equal partners and that past experiences have shown we need to take further measures to obtain safeguards and guarantees which cannot be broken or disregarded unless very heavy penalties are paid by the offending side...eg if anything like the Akritas is resurected we are thrown out of the EU.

Yes you are equal partners with equal rights but in a minority status that is democracy. There is no other solution to resolving the Cyprus problem other than partition which is of no benefit to both communities .

[Viewpoint]

...a GC dominated island with no strict political bouderies will allow revenge seeking GCs discriminate us at every turn until we capitulate to their demands of becoming a minority privilidge to live off their crumbs.

You’re awfully concerned about “revenge seeking”…

What on earth have your people done to Greek Cypriots VP?

You yourself have stated what we have done which you still seek revenge for so giving you the free hand you desire to do as you wish based on your numerical advantage will be our downfall, we must demand safeguards and guarantees that will never expose us to your mindset.

VP , for every G/C fascist there are at least 1 million Europeans including Cypriots who will defend the right of all of our citizens to full enjoyment of their human rights.
The fact that on this forum there are a few such individuals it does not mean that their views are representative of the G/C Cypriot people , anymore that the views of the T/C fascists.
You have witnessed my challenges to the extremists from both sides for a few years now and I hope you put a different interpretation to that that you originally posted concerning my position.

You and your like a very small minority and thats what scares us the most otherwise we would have no problems merging in a unitary state. The people on this forum unfortunately for me do represent and reconfirm my worst fears, in the face to which safeguards guarantees and strict penalities are vital if we even to consider living together.

Perhaps its time for another poll asking which GCs want re-unification. I get the feeling that a significant number want the continuation of the status quo (hence partition). Am I wrong?

Partition is not in the interests of either Greek or Turkish Cypriots but unfortunately neither party is giving way just like a game of chess with many openings and endless endgame positions. Even so there is no justification for the TURKISH MILITARY to keep 35000 troops when the EU is a guarantor. Once the military goes a solution will be found.

The TA will leave but only after an agreement, how can you expect us to weaken our hand and expose ourselves to 12.000 GC soldiers and 120.000 armed reservists and a revenge seeking GC population, it would be mayhem and very very dangerous.

So you are using the TURKISH MILITARY to improve your bargaining hand or to leave the status quo as is which was my original point.

Greek Cypriots are not interested in starting a war otherwise we would have done so long time ago. The Turkish army does not scare us one bit. However we believe in democracy taking its course something you TURKS do not understand. On the one hand you wish to enter the EU on the other hand you do not accept the EU guarantees for the Turkish military to leave. Everything else is poetry .........Attilio Lazzarin

Both sides are holding ace cards to be dealt when the time is right, but just as you will not budge on the recognition or easing of isolation issues we will not budge on ours, why should we? EU guarantees mean nothing as they are unable to have nose bleed without 200 high level meetings to decide which nostril..sorry this is just not good enough and does not instil any trust as they are clearly one sided and in times of crisis would be ineffective. The TA has been a stabilising factor on the island and for 35 years we have not experienced any of the problems we had in the past..why dont you accept that the TA will go once everything is agreed, their role included..if you do not fear them then whats your problem?

[Viewpoint]

The vengeance seeking G/Cs are resting in peace . Someone mentioned that only the older generation would somehow feel that vengeance is appropriate , on the contrary the older generation who lived through both the peaceful era and the conflict era would want nothing more than to bury the hatchet and live peacefuly on the island of Cyprus. No older generation Cypriot would want to put his children and grandchildren through the horrible conflict days that they went through. It is the young indoctrinated hot heads that are the problem on both sides of the divide , the young who deny Cyprus as their true homeland and look elsewhere.
Turkey along with Greece are the cause of our troubles . Greece , albeit under the Junta , orchestrated the military coup against Makarios , Turkey saw that as her opportunity to achieve what had been planned , the partition of the island. Turkey continues to this day , in total self denial , to occupy a part of Cyprus while audaciously promotes the ludicrous assumption that there exists a separate state , one that the entire world refuses to recognise as such , while in the meantime contrary to all international conventions continues her policy of Turkifying a part of Cyprus , eliminating the natives and installing her own citizens to occupy lands that for generations were lived on by the indigenous Cypriots both G/Cs and T/Cs.

Turkey's insistence in retaining guarantor status will never be accepted by the RoC. Moderates such as my self oppose such action along with most if not not all of the Cypriot people. Turkey must see that and act accordingly if she genuinely aspires for peace and stability in Cyprus.

The future of Cyprus is bright , united or not the democratic and free part of the island will prosper and progress in every field , the European membership has put the seal of approval on the legitimate government of Cyprus , regardless of the pathetic sounding noises by Turkey.
As a united island the sky is the limit , peace , stability financial benefits and above all the opportunity for all Cypriots to thrive and better them selves and improve the prospects of the new generation.
I make no distinction whatsoever between the G/Cs and the T/Cs , both are my compatriots and both should equally benefit in a united Cyprus , where I make a clear distinction is when it comes to Cypriots denying their true homeland and aligning themselves to the same foreign countries that were in the first place responsible for dividing our people and causing the seeds of hatred to expand and grow uncontrollably.

Great speach but is wanting to know the exact details of how a united Cyprus will work and how it will effect our daily lives or wanting to feel the security of the last 35 years wrong?

All we want is to live in peace and not be exposed to discrimination or domination which we know GCs are experts at, all they put forward reconfirms their real intention of taking control of the whole island and running it for themselves.

We need definate guidelines to which everyone will adhere otherwise the dangers are to great to dissolve the TRNC recognized or not and take a big leap of faith into the arms of a mistrusted "compatriot", this is to much to ask of anyone. Even the structure of today with all its shortfalls is far prefered to the unknown and constant chants of GCs "you are just another minority you will be treated as like bu us the GC majority.

We will get nowhere unless the GCs realize we are equal partners and that past experiences have shown we need to take further measures to obtain safeguards and guarantees which cannot be broken or disregarded unless very heavy penalties are paid by the offending side...eg if anything like the Akritas is resurected we are thrown out of the EU.

Yes you are equal partners with equal rights but in a minority status that is democracy. There is no other solution to resolving the Cyprus problem other than partition which is of no benefit to both communities .

Like it or not partition is just another option which has unofficially been untilized for the past 35 years ahich has brough prosperity and peace to all who live on this island.

[Byron]

...a GC dominated island with no strict political bouderies will allow revenge seeking GCs discriminate us at every turn until we capitulate to their demands of becoming a minority privilidge to live off their crumbs.

You’re awfully concerned about “revenge seeking”…

What on earth have your people done to Greek Cypriots VP?

You yourself have stated what we have done which you still seek revenge for so giving you the free hand you desire to do as you wish based on your numerical advantage will be our downfall, we must demand safeguards and guarantees that will never expose us to your mindset.

VP , for every G/C fascist there are at least 1 million Europeans including Cypriots who will defend the right of all of our citizens to full enjoyment of their human rights.
The fact that on this forum there are a few such individuals it does not mean that their views are representative of the G/C Cypriot people , anymore that the views of the T/C fascists.
You have witnessed my challenges to the extremists from both sides for a few years now and I hope you put a different interpretation to that that you originally posted concerning my position.

You and your like a very small minority and thats what scares us the most otherwise we would have no problems merging in a unitary state. The people on this forum unfortunately for me do represent and reconfirm my worst fears, in the face to which safeguards guarantees and strict penalities are vital if we even to consider living together.

Perhaps its time for another poll asking which GCs want re-unification. I get the feeling that a significant number want the continuation of the status quo (hence partition). Am I wrong?

Partition is not in the interests of either Greek or Turkish Cypriots but unfortunately neither party is giving way just like a game of chess with many openings and endless endgame positions. Even so there is no justification for the TURKISH MILITARY to keep 35000 troops when the EU is a guarantor. Once the military goes a solution will be found.

The TA will leave but only after an agreement, how can you expect us to weaken our hand and expose ourselves to 12.000 GC soldiers and 120.000 armed reservists and a revenge seeking GC population, it would be mayhem and very very dangerous.

So you are using the TURKISH MILITARY to improve your bargaining hand or to leave the status quo as is which was my original point.

Greek Cypriots are not interested in starting a war otherwise we would have done so long time ago. The Turkish army does not scare us one bit. However we believe in democracy taking its course something you TURKS do not understand. On the one hand you wish to enter the EU on the other hand you do not accept the EU guarantees for the Turkish military to leave. Everything else is poetry .........Attilio Lazzarin

Both sides are holding ace cards to be dealt when the time is right, but just as you will not budge on the recognition or easing of isolation issues we will not budge on ours, why should we? EU guarantees mean nothing as they are unable to have nose bleed without 200 high level meetings to decide which nostril..sorry this is just not good enough and does not instil any trust as they are clearly one sided and in times of crisis would be ineffective. The TA has been a stabilising factor on the island and for 35 years we have not experienced any of the problems we had in the past..why dont you accept that the TA will go once everything is agreed, their role included..if you do not fear them then whats your problem?

I am sorry but neither side is holding ace cards when its citizens are deprived of their democratic rights. If you do not recognise the EU as your guarantor why do you wish to join the EU ?

Both sides must make concessions, nobody is advocating to return to past positions but it must come about democratically and a federal solution or an autonomous region ( Sicily) within a united cyprus is possible but the troops must start to return. Show us some good faith send half back next week !

[Viewpoint]

Byron dont forget we were not asked if we wanted to join the Eu we were forced in...which is another indication of how the GCs always try to steam roll over us to obtain only what they want, another indication of how a united Cyprus will be if GCs are given the free hand they desire to do as they wish.

Then why do you not all an easing of the isolation? if it is not your ace card as it is interfering with our democratic rights.

I agree that both sides must make concessions but just saying the troops should go is not enough especially when it concerns our security which mean lives, could you therefore allow direct flights as good faith next week? It wont work that way everything should be done in steps, if part of the troops go then so does yours, if Maraş is returned direct trade starts and so on, this give and take cannot be one sided.

[Byron]

Byron dont forget we were not asked if we wanted to join the Eu we were forced in...which is another indication of how the GCs always try to steam roll over us to obtain only what they want, another indication of how a united Cyprus will be if GCs are given the free hand they desire to do as they wish.

Then why do you not all an easing of the isolation? if it is not your ace card as it is interfering with our democratic rights.

I agree that both sides must make concessions but just saying the troops should go is not enough especially when it concerns our security which mean lives, could you therefore allow direct flights as good faith next week? It wont work that way everything should be done in steps, if part of the troops go then so does yours, if Maraş is returned direct trade starts and so on, this give and take cannot be one sided.

OK let's start by you sending 50% of your troops back next week 17500 and 50% of our GREEK troops 2500 back at the same time. Fair ?