Cyprus-Forum.com

[YFred]

Sign of things to come: first minority then don't exist.

House rules Greece has no Turkish minorities
By Elias Hazou

BY UNANIMOUS vote, the Plenum yesterday passed a resolution stressing that it does not recognise the presence of “any Turkish minority within the territory of Greece”.

The move comes after DISY deputy Christos Pourgourides, in his personal capacity, signed a motion for a resolution calling for an investigation into possible human rights violations of the ‘Turkish minority’ in the Greek islands of Rhodes and Kos.

The contentious motion was drafted by the Parliamentary Assembly of the Council of Europe (PACE), of which Pourgourides is a member. PACE’s document, dated May 6, expressed “concern on the situation of the Turkish minority” in the two islands.

PACE’s motion cited concerns over religious and linguistic restrictions for persons of Turkish ethnic origin living in the two islands. It noted, for instance, that Turkish schools in Rhodes and Kos “ceased to operate in 1972”. And that “according to the latest information received, the Turkish minority on the islands is denied the right to education in their mother tongue.”

Greece does not acknowledge the presence of a Turkish minority, instead referring to Greek citizens of Turkish ethnic origin as the “Muslim minority”.

A number of Turkish MPs also signed the same document. Pourgourides took flak from politicians in Cyprus, accusing him of playing into the hands of Turkish diplomacy and of jeopardising Cyprus’ relations with steadfast ally Greece.

Yesterday’s resolution by Parliament, drafted at the initiative of DIKO, also stressed that “we remain firmly opposed to Turkey’s intention to promote secessionist elements in the territory of Greece”.

The final draft of the resolution omitted a reference to Pourgourides’ actions, as its authors had originally intended. The resolution was approved by all MPs, including Pourgourides.

Pourgourides’ own party DISY have distanced themselves from their deputy. Earlier this week, the veteran politician was summoned to party headquarters in Nicosia to explain his actions.

DISY spokesman Harris Georgiades told the Mail his party wanted to make it “absolutely clear” that they did not espouse the view that a Turkish minority existed in Greece.

“To avoid any confusion, we have to say that neither does Mr. Pourgourides. His point of view was that, given the allegations on human rights violations in Rhodes and Kos, it would be better to investigate these allegations rather than not. That does not mean he agrees there is a human rights problem vis-a-vis people of Turkish ethnic origin. His rationale is duly noted.”

DISY’s problem, it seems, was with Pourgourides’ handling of the matter: he had failed to consult with them on such a sensitive issue.

“By agreeing that an investigation is necessary, you’d send out the wrong political message. We wanted to demonstrate that Greece has a clear human rights record,” said Georgiades.

Though distancing themselves from Pourgourides, at the same time DISY sought to shield their man from some of the more malicious attacks leveled against him.

“The rhetoric we’ve been hearing these last few days…that his behaviour was unpatriotic, bordering on treasonous…was a gross exaggeration,” said Georgiades.


Copyright © Cyprus Mail 2009

[Big Al]

Sign of things to come: first minority then don't exist.

House rules Greece has no Turkish minorities
By Elias Hazou

BY UNANIMOUS vote, the Plenum yesterday passed a resolution stressing that it does not recognise the presence of “any Turkish minority within the territory of Greece”.

The move comes after DISY deputy Christos Pourgourides, in his personal capacity, signed a motion for a resolution calling for an investigation into possible human rights violations of the ‘Turkish minority’ in the Greek islands of Rhodes and Kos.

The contentious motion was drafted by the Parliamentary Assembly of the Council of Europe (PACE), of which Pourgourides is a member. PACE’s document, dated May 6, expressed “concern on the situation of the Turkish minority” in the two islands.

PACE’s motion cited concerns over religious and linguistic restrictions for persons of Turkish ethnic origin living in the two islands. It noted, for instance, that Turkish schools in Rhodes and Kos “ceased to operate in 1972”. And that “according to the latest information received, the Turkish minority on the islands is denied the right to education in their mother tongue.”

Greece does not acknowledge the presence of a Turkish minority, instead referring to Greek citizens of Turkish ethnic origin as the “Muslim minority”.

A number of Turkish MPs also signed the same document. Pourgourides took flak from politicians in Cyprus, accusing him of playing into the hands of Turkish diplomacy and of jeopardising Cyprus’ relations with steadfast ally Greece.

Yesterday’s resolution by Parliament, drafted at the initiative of DIKO, also stressed that “we remain firmly opposed to Turkey’s intention to promote secessionist elements in the territory of Greece”.

The final draft of the resolution omitted a reference to Pourgourides’ actions, as its authors had originally intended. The resolution was approved by all MPs, including Pourgourides.

Pourgourides’ own party DISY have distanced themselves from their deputy. Earlier this week, the veteran politician was summoned to party headquarters in Nicosia to explain his actions.

DISY spokesman Harris Georgiades told the Mail his party wanted to make it “absolutely clear” that they did not espouse the view that a Turkish minority existed in Greece.

“To avoid any confusion, we have to say that neither does Mr. Pourgourides. His point of view was that, given the allegations on human rights violations in Rhodes and Kos, it would be better to investigate these allegations rather than not. That does not mean he agrees there is a human rights problem vis-a-vis people of Turkish ethnic origin. His rationale is duly noted.”

DISY’s problem, it seems, was with Pourgourides’ handling of the matter: he had failed to consult with them on such a sensitive issue.

“By agreeing that an investigation is necessary, you’d send out the wrong political message. We wanted to demonstrate that Greece has a clear human rights record,” said Georgiades.

Though distancing themselves from Pourgourides, at the same time DISY sought to shield their man from some of the more malicious attacks leveled against him.

“The rhetoric we’ve been hearing these last few days…that his behaviour was unpatriotic, bordering on treasonous…was a gross exaggeration,” said Georgiades.


Copyright © Cyprus Mail 2009

this has been my argument all along regarding cyprus, first tc are told your a cypriot to piss anna vatan off then we get told we're a minority tc community then a muslim minority then you dont even exist!!

[runaway]

and this country is supposed to be a EU member. There are at least 150,000 Turks in Western Thrace despite Greek denial.

[Piratis]

It was a Muslim minority right from the very begging with the Treaty of Lausanne of 1923 between Greece and Turkey. Nothing changed since then. Greece follows the agreement on that Treaty as signed. The Muslim/Turkish minority in Greece has increased in population vastly since then.

On the other hand, Turkey has not honored her agreement about the Greeks that would stay in Turkey, and has actually exterminated most of them.

For example the islands of Imbros and Tenedos that would remain under Turkish rule had a majority of Greeks. With the Treaty of Lausanne Turkey agreed to give a special autonomous administrative status to those people. Not only it didn't do that, but on the contrary it ethnically cleansed almost all Greeks from those islands.

Now Turkey is again trying (like they did in Cyprus) to use that Muslim minority as a way to serve their expansinistic aims against Greece.

Maybe the Greeks were stupid for not doing what the Turks did? If the Greeks acted like the Turks there wouldn't even be a Muslim minority in Greece today.

[Tim Drayton]

It was a Muslim minority right from the very begging with the Treaty of Lausanne of 1923 between Greece and Turkey. Nothing changed since then. Greece follows the agreement on that Treaty as signed. The Muslim/Turkish minority in Greece has increased in population vastly since then.

On the other hand, Turkey has not honored her agreement about the Greeks that would stay in Turkey, and has actually exterminated most of them.

For example the islands of Imbros and Tenedos that would remain under Turkish rule had a majority of Greeks. With the Treaty of Lausanne Turkey agreed to give a special autonomous administrative status to those people. Not only it didn't do that, but on the contrary it ethnically cleansed almost all Greeks from those islands.

Now Turkey is again trying (like they did in Cyprus) to use that Muslim minority as a way to serve their expansinistic aims against Greece.

Maybe the Greeks were stupid for not doing what the Turks did? If the Greeks acted like the Turks there wouldn't even be a Muslim minority in Greece today.

Pressurised them into emigrating would be a more accurate statement.

[YFred]

It was a Muslim minority right from the very begging with the Treaty of Lausanne of 1923 between Greece and Turkey. Nothing changed since then. Greece follows the agreement on that Treaty as signed. The Muslim/Turkish minority in Greece has increased in population vastly since then.

On the other hand, Turkey has not honored her agreement about the Greeks that would stay in Turkey, and has actually exterminated most of them.

For example the islands of Imbros and Tenedos that would remain under Turkish rule had a majority of Greeks. With the Treaty of Lausanne Turkey agreed to give a special autonomous administrative status to those people. Not only it didn't do that, but on the contrary it ethnically cleansed almost all Greeks from those islands.

Now Turkey is again trying (like they did in Cyprus) to use that Muslim minority as a way to serve their expansinistic aims against Greece.

Maybe the Greeks were stupid for not doing what the Turks did? If the Greeks acted like the Turks there wouldn't even be a Muslim minority in Greece today.

Pressurised them into emigrating would be a more accurate statement.

Please take into account the fact that Piratis uses a hellennic microscope on all Turkish matters.

[james_mav]

This is absolutely correct: Greece does not have a Turkish minority, it has a muslim minority, a sub-minority of whom may self-identify as turkish. But we'll never know because the Greek government does not collect official statistics on how people identify. And really who cares, people are free to self-identify with whichever ethic grouping they so choose...they might even self-identify as Jedi.

Greece is in fact being a proper citizen of the community of nations by complying with her obligations under the Treaty of Lausanne. Perhaps we should discuss how turkey has complied with her obligations under the same treaty towards the rights of the (now nearly non-existent) Christian minority in Turkey, particularly Imbros, Tenedos, and Constantinople? And to think that turks have the gall to criticise the EU for not admitting turkey - the turks cannot abide by the treaty which created the modern state of turkey, how the hell are they going to abide by the EU ascension treaties?

Or perhaps turkey should claim guarantor rights for the muslim population in western Trace in order to attempt some kind of intervention? Something tells me that there would be a different outcome to that which occurred last time they tried an "intervention" (or "peace operation" or whatever the euphemism of the day is).

[james_mav]

and this country is supposed to be a EU member. There are at least 150,000 Turks in Western Thrace despite Greek denial.

Who has counted them?

I get the impression that turkey is slightly economical with the truth on such matters...and you wonder why the EU doesn't want to know you.

[Piratis]

It was a Muslim minority right from the very begging with the Treaty of Lausanne of 1923 between Greece and Turkey. Nothing changed since then. Greece follows the agreement on that Treaty as signed. The Muslim/Turkish minority in Greece has increased in population vastly since then.

On the other hand, Turkey has not honored her agreement about the Greeks that would stay in Turkey, and has actually exterminated most of them.

For example the islands of Imbros and Tenedos that would remain under Turkish rule had a majority of Greeks. With the Treaty of Lausanne Turkey agreed to give a special autonomous administrative status to those people. Not only it didn't do that, but on the contrary it ethnically cleansed almost all Greeks from those islands.

Now Turkey is again trying (like they did in Cyprus) to use that Muslim minority as a way to serve their expansinistic aims against Greece.

Maybe the Greeks were stupid for not doing what the Turks did? If the Greeks acted like the Turks there wouldn't even be a Muslim minority in Greece today.

Pressurised them into emigrating would be a more accurate statement.

One of the methods used was by killing several of them and forcing the rest to flea to save their lives.

In Greece the Muslim minority has higher standards of living than most people in Turkey, and this why their population is constantly rising (otherwise they would emigrate to Turkey).

They are recognized as a minority (something which Turkey refuses to do for the 20% Kurds!) and the only thing is that they are labeled as "Muslim Minority" instead of "Turkish minority", which is in accordance with the Treaty of Lausanne.

If it wasn't for the Turkish expansionism with the pretext of "protecting" Turkish minorities, something which was demonstrated clearly with the case of Cyprus, I am sure Greece would not mind to change the label for that minority from "Muslim" to "Turkish".

[paliometoxo]

the hell with that, so they can cause problems and try invade greece? all turkey does is causee problems and kill and murder and take whats not theirs